Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling

Foil Volume = + / - board stability ?:-)

Reply
Created by Johndesu > 9 months ago, 5 Sep 2020
Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
5 Sep 2020 11:15PM
Thumbs Up

Howdy
A question for the smart cookies out there -
Just wondering how much volume (if any) is added to a foil board once it is in the water? and also would the board now be more stable or less stable (compared to say a regular quad or thruster fin set-up on the same board)?
thanks :-)

Pacey
WA, 525 posts
5 Sep 2020 10:08PM
Thumbs Up

You are adding volume, but you are also adding weight, so the effect on buoyancy is going to be pretty neutral unless the foil is very heavy or very light. Effect on stability at rest due to buoyant or weight related forces will be pretty neutral unless the foil is heavy, in which case it will stabilise the board slightly; or light, in which case the buoyancy of the foil will destabilise the board slightly.

however the lateral area of the mast will resist roll quite a lot, so the board will feel more stable when you are standing on it compared to if you only had a short fins in it

tomooh
275 posts
6 Sep 2020 3:30AM
Thumbs Up

Certainly the front wing size makes a huge difference to stability. I have a 1600 and 1200 size foil and find paddling around on the 1200 way more difficult and unstable. More difference than I would have thought.

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
8 Sep 2020 12:22AM
Thumbs Up

Thanks Pacey & tomooh it makes sense I just need to try for myself now, also just wondering if a heavy foil (5-6kg) is better / or does it make a difference compared to a lighter foil (3-4kg) for all round surf foiling etc?:-)

tomooh
275 posts
8 Sep 2020 3:43AM
Thumbs Up

There is all sorts of opinions about whose foils are better. I started with alloy masts fuselage etc and now have Armstrong carbon. Its nice to have a light rig that is well made and looks like it will last. But if you are starting out a cheap second hand set up works fine and can be resold whenever you want to upgrade. I think it is more about the area underwater than the weight that affects stability and its nice to have a board that is not a constant struggle to stand on and paddle.
b

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
9 Sep 2020 10:59AM
Thumbs Up

Yes I see tomooh but I recently bought a second hand Ride Engine foli with a massive front wing 84 (5.5kg) and it looks great + I also bought a second hand board Sunova 7.8 sling shot (7.5kg) but together it is just all too much / too heavy for me to carry to the surf and back so I won't be able to take it out to try even.
thanks

Pacey
WA, 525 posts
9 Sep 2020 9:46AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..
Yes I see tomooh but I recently bought a second hand Ride Engine foli with a massive front wing 84 (5.5kg) and it looks great + I also bought a second hand board Sunova 7.8 sling shot (7.5kg) but together it is just all too much / too heavy for me to carry to the surf and back so I won't be able to take it out to try even.
thanks


I agree the Ride Engine/Slingshot foils are heavy, but they are a good foil and a good place to get started. Maybe try carrying the board and foil down separately and putting them together on the beach would be easier.

tomooh
275 posts
9 Sep 2020 5:02PM
Thumbs Up

Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
9 Sep 2020 11:47PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.


I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)

GranG
WA, 257 posts
20 Sep 2020 12:05PM
Thumbs Up

Swapping from an axis (Al mast) to a Armstrong (Carbon mast) on the same Sunova SUP 105litre board, I could definitely feel the extra flotation. I weigh 86kg, 6ft. Also, when I fall off or the board shoots back from a wipeout wave, it does take longer to sink / go down.

Overall, I don't think it is a huge difference, but certainly in my unique set of gear, I would say the foil change added about 5 or so litres of volume to the board.

Getting back on a normal SUP though, I am all over the place with latteral stability... that big keel makes a huge difference!

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
21 Sep 2020 6:59PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..

tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.



I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)


HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
21 Sep 2020 6:59PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..


tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.




I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)



HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
25 Sep 2020 1:55PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..



tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.





I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)




HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.


Hi Tinka
So your foil sup board with attached Foil together weigh under 6kg for both? is that right?:-)
thanks (also a Go Foil & a 6.5 Jimmy Lewis will be arriving soon to my place:-)

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
28 Sep 2020 3:11PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..



tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.





I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)




HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.



Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..



tomo sup and foil
oh said..

Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.





I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)




HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.



8.9kg

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
28 Sep 2020 3:11PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..



tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.





I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)




HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.



Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..



tomo sup and foil
oh said..

Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.





I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)




HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.



8.9kg

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
28 Sep 2020 3:12PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

tinka said..


Johndesu said..




tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.






I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)





HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.





tinka said..


Johndesu said..




tomo sup and foil
oh said..

Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.






I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)





HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.




8.9kg


with leash

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
29 Sep 2020 12:55PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

tinka said..


tinka said..



Johndesu said..





tomooh said..
Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.







I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)






HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.







tinka said..



Johndesu said..





tomo sup and foil
oh said..

Or see if there is someone who is a little bit stronger than you that could manage to carry it down the beach and might buy it off you.







I do not think that is possible so I think that I would need to get / buy the smallest & lightest board that I am comfortable probably between 6-7ft between 100 - 120L (my sups are 6.10 & 7.2 about 90L each) and than afterwards buy the lightest carbon foil that I can ride :-)






HI Johnseu, the sup i surf is 7' 3" and 26 3/4, 92 litres and 5.6 kg feels tippy, but my 5'5" x 26 80 litre foil sup and foil both Armstrong weighing about the same as my sup is much more stable.I reckon even though the foil is neutral bouyant the whole rig is more stable due to the foil wing underneath.





8.9kg



with leash


I see that is pretty light I think, so your small foil sup is pretty small 5.5 & 80L and so what is the actual weight of it?, and also what is the weight of the foil set up that you use ?:-)

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
30 Sep 2020 10:35AM
Thumbs Up

Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
3 Oct 2020 1:29PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.


Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
4 Oct 2020 1:07PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..

tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.



Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)


Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide?

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
4 Oct 2020 1:10PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..


tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.




Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)



Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide? Last years naish ultra carbon hover sup foils are pretty good and this years model is way lighter than the previous years and more sizes this year.

Johndesu
NSW, 549 posts
4 Oct 2020 2:23PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..

Johndesu said..


tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.




Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)



Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide?


Hey Tinka
I am soon to start foiling (this Tuesday & Wednesday) but I am a great sup surfer (about 4 years) and great short board surfer (about 50 years +) as well as been a light weight - 65kg so I am keen to foil sup surf, also I noticed that you have had similar boards in the past -same as me (6.10 Hypernut, CES etc.) so you must be good and a light weight also. I have been reading/looking at the Armstrong foil boards etc., are they/is yours really much better then the rest (the construction and rails, bottom etc.?:-)

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
5 Oct 2020 11:51AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..

tinka said..


Johndesu said..



tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.





Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)




Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide?



Hey Tinka
I am soon to start foiling (this Tuesday & Wednesday) but I am a great sup surfer (about 4 years) and great short board surfer (about 50 years +) as well as been a light weight - 65kg so I am keen to foil sup surf, also I noticed that you have had similar boards in the past -same as me (6.10 Hypernut, CES etc.) so you must be good and a light weight also. I have been reading/looking at the Armstrong foil boards etc., are they/is yours really much better then the rest (the construction and rails, bottom etc.?:-)


give us a call ive sent my number to your email

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
5 Oct 2020 12:12PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..

tinka said..


Johndesu said..



tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.





Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)




Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide?



Hey Tinka
I am soon to start foiling (this Tuesday & Wednesday) but I am a great sup surfer (about 4 years) and great short board surfer (about 50 years +) as well as been a light weight - 65kg so I am keen to foil sup surf, also I noticed that you have had similar boards in the past -same as me (6.10 Hypernut, CES etc.) so you must be good and a light weight also. I have been reading/looking at the Armstrong foil boards etc., are they/is yours really much better then the rest (the construction and rails, bottom etc.?:-)


give us a call ive sent my number to your email

Select to expand quote
Johndesu said..

tinka said..


Johndesu said..



tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.





Ok great that sounds good, probably I will head down the same path as you after some time, I need to start to learn how to ride/fly a foil first (which will be pretty soon:-)




Thought you were pretty handy on the foil? My HS 1250 is arriving this week i will report whats its like,apparently its the highest aspect ratio wing armstrong has made so far.Good for the glide?



Hey Tinka
I am soon to start foiling (this Tuesday & Wednesday) but I am a great sup surfer (about 4 years) and great short board surfer (about 50 years +) as well as been a light weight - 65kg so I am keen to foil sup surf, also I noticed that you have had similar boards in the past -same as me (6.10 Hypernut, CES etc.) so you must be good and a light weight also. I have been reading/looking at the Armstrong foil boards etc., are they/is yours really much better then the rest (the construction and rails, bottom etc.?:-)



Every board i have had has been an improvement of the last . The armstrong board is amazing ,super light and the construction is really good , what i think is important is the length of the board to reduce swing weight and the posistion of the foil boxes .Armstrong have moved the foil boxes slightly more forward on there boards which i reckon really helps . the previous board to the armstrong was pretty good and the construction was bullit proof but it was about 1.5 kilo more heavier , the newer models are somewhat lighter but not as light as the same size Armstrong . which when learning i reckon can be a slight advantage especially us lighter riders . I,m 65 kg and found 95 litres was a good volume ,as now i,m down to 80 litres which is probably as low as i would go on the sup foil . the Armstrong 1550 set up ive got is also the best ,build quality and performance ,The ride on the Armstrong is unreal really stable and linear lift , especialllly the early lift of the 1550 wing . I,ve sent you a email with my contact details ,give us a ring anytime.

jatem
13 posts
5 Oct 2020 11:12AM
Thumbs Up

How do you find paddling on such a short 5'5 board, and what kind of distance could you comfortably paddle to get to a wave?

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
5 Oct 2020 5:36PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
jatem said..
How do you find paddling on such a short 5'5 board, and what kind of distance could you comfortably paddle to get to a wave?



paddle from n bech to break probably 1 klm ,overall sesssion say 3 hours 20 waves 15 klm total distance foiling and paddling,did a seeion not so long back when it was pumping 4 and a half hours 31 waves 41 klm foiling and paddling . keeps your fit

kitemantim
146 posts
5 Oct 2020 4:04PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.

Hi

what is the version 2 5''5 foil wing sup, nothing on the Armstrong site?

cheers

tinka
QLD, 76 posts
6 Oct 2020 5:43AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
kitemantim said..

tinka said..
Just wieghed it, and the board weight is 5.3 kilos and the Armstrong HS 1550 wing 60 Fuse 72 Mast and 232 tail weight is 3.3 kilos giving the whole rigs tottal weight of 8.6 kilos ,my board is version 2 5' 5'' Armstrong 80 litre foil wing sup. I found just dropping the weight of the board gives you so muuch more speed and the swing weight is reduced dramatically . I know that from riding a known brands board the same size but heavier and the ride is totally different.


Hi

what is the version 2 5''5 foil wing sup, nothing on the Armstrong site?

cheers


go to armstrong site select boards wing foil sup 55



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling


"Foil Volume = + / - board stability ?:-)" started by Johndesu