Forums > Sailing General

Extra layer of antifoul???

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Created by Gos2017 3 months ago, 13 May 2018
Gos2017
NSW, 32 posts
13 May 2018 3:41PM
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Hi all
Ready for the next antifouling experience and I'm wondering...would it be worth it to get a third coat of antifoul (Altex #5)? Would this lengthen the time interval between getting it done? I do have a diver clean my hull every two months or so and try to use the boat as often as possible. Not sure if it would be beneficial or just throwing more money into an already expensive process.

Cheers
Gos

SirJman
VIC, 329 posts
13 May 2018 5:17PM
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Is that a hard or a soft antifoul? If it's a soft ablative then your diver is probably stripping it off on its first clean. I don't even clean my hull, just go for a sail/motor.

MorningBird
NSW, 1945 posts
13 May 2018 6:24PM
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I have a similar dilemma.
When MB was in Pittwater (Salt Pan Cove) I had her antfouled and about 9-12 months later had a diver clean her. Another 3 months later and maybe another clean 3 months on. Then an antifoul about 18 months after the previous one.
Now moored in Sydney at Drummoyne in about 3 metres under the keel at low tide I appear to have an entirely different problem.
I had MB antifouled and propspeeded on 4 December at Gladesville Bridge marina. In early April she desperately needed a thorough clean, speed under motor was down to low 4 knots, normally nearly 6.5 knots is normal after an anti foul. The prop was very barnacled.
Last week she appeared to be half way to another clean, speed was still at an average of 5.9-6.0 knots but the growth really growing.
Do Gladesville Bridge do a crap job, they were the cheapest quote at $2050 for the anti foul and prop speed, or is Sydney Harbour west of the bridge just a high growth area?

Gos2017
NSW, 32 posts
13 May 2018 8:21PM
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SirJaman: It's ablative
Morningbird: Had a similar experience when going for the "Most economical" quote for antifoul, the application was terrible. I too started off in Salt Pan Creek where the antifoul lasted for ages. Now in Sydney (also west of the bridge) I have similar trouble to you. I started using a diver when my last coat got to about 10 months old and with regular use (about every 8 weeks) have managed to stretch it our to about 18 months.

Just curious if an extra coat would possibly get me closer to 24 months with the same regime?

Cheers

tomooh
117 posts
14 May 2018 4:30AM
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If its ablative then the more you put on the longer it should last. My boat had 12 litre on 38 ft and i made it last almost 4 years with some cleaning

Ramona
NSW, 4257 posts
14 May 2018 8:59AM
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Select to expand quote
MorningBird said..
I have a similar dilemma.
When MB was in Pittwater (Salt Pan Cove) I had her antfouled and about 9-12 months later had a diver clean her. Another 3 months later and maybe another clean 3 months on. Then an antifoul about 18 months after the previous one.
Now moored in Sydney at Drummoyne in about 3 metres under the keel at low tide I appear to have an entirely different problem.
I had MB antifouled and propspeeded on 4 December at Gladesville Bridge marina. In early April she desperately needed a thorough clean, speed under motor was down to low 4 knots, normally nearly 6.5 knots is normal after an anti foul. The prop was very barnacled.
Last week she appeared to be half way to another clean, speed was still at an average of 5.9-6.0 knots but the growth really growing.
Do Gladesville Bridge do a crap job, they were the cheapest quote at $2050 for the anti foul and prop speed, or is Sydney Harbour west of the bridge just a high growth area?


Growth rate depends mostly on current flow. If your moored where a lot of water passes your boat then more passing organisms can lodge on your boat. Also sunlight makes a difference. Two coats of the correct film thickness of antifoul is all that's needed. If you put 3 coats on it wont last much longer when your mooring riser rubs on the bottom or you hit some debris while your out sailing and wears off the ablative paint.
Some batches of antifoul from the same manufacturer also can vary. I found this with the locally made Jotun a few years ago.
As always the best results are going to be when you apply the antifoul yourselves and the same goes for scrubbing the boat in the water. The bloke you pay wont be that fussy about how much antifoul he rubs off! The water is cooling off fast, time to get down there now and clean that prop. Your SS34 has the prop down a long way too. Keep an eye out for bull sharks!

GusTee
NSW, 230 posts
14 May 2018 9:05AM
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MB,
I'm at Drummoyne also, with similar experiences. Last August she was anti fouled at Newbridge and by March was noticeably slower.

The prop had decent growth around the hub despite prop speed on it. Next time I might give prop speed a miss and see the difference.

I use the boat at least once a fortnight.

Cheers,
Evan

wildemann
VIC, 17 posts
14 May 2018 12:56PM
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I've just redone with altex #5. 2 full coats and 4 coats around waist/waterline and rudder (until my two tins ran out). Marine growth either seems more profilic close to waterline or the paint just ablates off more readily there. I don't know if commercial operators offer the same option. Prop left bare. I promise to scrub that periodically this year, despite been despite being a bit lax other the past year.

Toyboata
NSW, 24 posts
14 May 2018 10:29PM
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What type of ablative antifoul should I use around the lane cove river / Woodford bay area? My boat isn't near the current but I use it regularly so ablative is definitely the way to go. Altex #5?

Also anyone know of any little slip ways in the area where I can DIY.... I don't believe many exist anymore.... Any private one's about the place? There are a couple of little slip ways I see around the place that hardly operate like the one on the Western side of Woodford bay.. any recommendations on a cost effective slipway?

Toyboata
NSW, 24 posts
14 May 2018 10:30PM
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What type of ablative antifoul should I use around the lane cove river / Woodford bay area? My boat isn't near the current but I use it regularly so ablative is definitely the way to go. Altex #5?

Also anyone know of any little slip ways in the area where I can DIY.... I don't believe many exist anymore.... Any private one's about the place? There are a couple of little slip ways I see around the place that hardly operate like the one on the Western side of Woodford bay.. any recommendations on a cost effective slipway?

Ramona
NSW, 4257 posts
15 May 2018 8:48AM
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Altex 5 is as good as any. I have Micron on at the moment simply because I bought several tins cheap.

lydia
584 posts
15 May 2018 8:16AM
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I usually go the extra coat then after close to a year do a quick travel lift and a light water blast to get to new surface and I eek out another year.
Cost of in and out travel lift is more than offset by getting the other year.
Divers can be a bit indiscriminate particularly with foil edges
Cheers

Bristolfashion
VIC, 362 posts
15 May 2018 10:30AM
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When is someone going to invent a little hull cleaning robot? Chuck it over the side after a sail or have it mounted on the yacht for a clean at pre-determined times. No haul out & no chemicals. They could even be mounted on a berth.

Cheers

Bristol

Cav30
NSW, 79 posts
15 May 2018 10:38AM
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We have Altex no5 and moored in Double Bay. After 16 months the hull is not too bad, I would say 4/10. The rudder however is shot. Covered in hard growth. We had a diver clean after about 12 months and there was a noticeable speed improvement. We are lining up to anti foul in June. The prop speed lasted about 8 months. Again now covered in crusties and I need to clean off but cant face it.

We were quoted on 2 coats on the hull and 3 on the water line. I will ask for possibly 4 coats on the rudder.

I am considering going to Jotun or Petite Vivid which are a bit more accepting of hull scrubs but love the fact the altex is very low maintenance.
I believe our rudder is shot as its close proximity to the prop which has been just washing it off.
There is no easy solution. A robot would be great. Bit like the pool robots.
Ed.

Craig66
NSW, 1439 posts
15 May 2018 12:29PM
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Select to expand quote
Bristolfashion said..
When is someone going to invent a little hull cleaning robot? Chuck it over the side after a sail or have it mounted on the yacht for a clean at pre-determined times. No haul out & no chemicals. They could even be mounted on a berth.

Cheers

Bristol




That "someone" has, but looks like it needs to be improved



Serenite
10 posts
15 May 2018 12:23PM
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Select to expand quote
Toyboata said..
What type of ablative antifoul should I use around the lane cove river / Woodford bay area? My boat isn't near the current but I use it regularly so ablative is definitely the way to go. Altex #5?

Also anyone know of any little slip ways in the area where I can DIY.... I don't believe many exist anymore.... Any private one's about the place? There are a couple of little slip ways I see around the place that hardly operate like the one on the Western side of Woodford bay.. any recommendations on a cost effective slipway?


Toyboata, I came out at Woolwich Dock late last year and did the antifoul myself, no problem there for DIY. Had some work done by Itchy & Scratchy also though under insurance so not sure of the cost for lift and hard stand. I can recommend the dock & Itchy & Scratchy but can't say if it's cost effective.

sirgallivant
NSW, 1185 posts
15 May 2018 3:59PM
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Yep, ssdd, as l am at Drummoyne West and after using Micron Extra for years with relative success l let myself sweet talk into Altex 5.
What a craps it is! Usual 3 coats plus 1 extra on the edges. After just a short year a whole zoo is growing on my bottom. Never seen kind of pink barnacles appeared and all the usual ones thrive as well. I must do a job on it soon.

I dived on it twice and cleaned it thoroughly but gently, still no good. Never touch Altex 5 again.
Going back to Extra this year.

Balmain Marina got deals for dit 3 day w.ends for about $1550 incl gurney use, your choice of 10l antifoul and a 2l primer (last years prices) but you do the slog.


SandS
VIC, 5156 posts
15 May 2018 6:57PM
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the dearer joton ablative is good **** !!

nswsailor
NSW, 1063 posts
15 May 2018 7:58PM
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In May 2014 I put on four coats of Altex No5 [manufacturer recommends a minimum of three when done with a roller] and last month I hauled out and redid her after three and half years. She wasn't to bad except around the water line where there was a little bit of green weed growth and the odd barnacle over the rest of the hull. I won't say anything about the prop of course.
I probably rubbed her down in-water about three time as well as doing 8 months cruising up to the Whitsundays and down to Lake Macquarie in that time.

I reckon I saved the cost of two haul outs and a 4lt tin of Altex No 5.

I must say that I had less growth by far, over the 4 coats, than when I only did 2 coats that usually lasted just over a year.

Needless to say I've just put four more coats on her and won't see a slip until around 2022

Toyboata
NSW, 24 posts
15 May 2018 9:27PM
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Wow that's unreal Phillip!

Was one 4lt tin of altex no 5 enough to do all 4 coats on your top hat?

Jolene
844 posts
16 May 2018 5:18AM
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Altex#5 been on my boat for 18 months without a clean.,, 2 roller coats and 4 on the waterline,rudder and leading edges (aprox 9 lts)
I hauled out 6 months ago to remove the prop shaft and the hull paint was doing an awesome job along with the Velox prop paint.
Boat was on the stand for 10 days then, didn't touch hull or repaint the prop. There was some shell on the big hub of the Autostream prop that came off with very little effort but I was most impressed by the blades being rather clean.
I cleaned some shell off the prop a couple of months ago when checking underneath the boat, again,,very little shell on the blades.
Hauling out again next week for survey so I can have a good look again then at how all the paint is performing.

Ramona
NSW, 4257 posts
16 May 2018 8:30AM
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SandS said..
the dearer joton ablative is good **** !!


Yes the Jotum ablative comes in several guises and the names seem to change a bit. I think the Sea Queen stuff is the best at the moment. I used some of their 36 month[seaqueen36] stuff on my fishing vessel years ago and it was very good. I also used a tin of their ordinary stuff from the fish coop and it was finished after 3 months. It was allegedly a bad batch. I visited the factory in Sydney not long after to buy more paint but the bloke I talked to did not exactly inspire me and probably explained the varying quality.

SandS
VIC, 5156 posts
16 May 2018 7:35PM
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Select to expand quote
Ramona said..

SandS said..
the dearer joton ablative is good **** !!



Yes the Jotum ablative comes in several guises and the names seem to change a bit. I think the Sea Queen stuff is the best at the moment. I used some of their 36 month[seaqueen36] stuff on my fishing vessel years ago and it was very good. I also used a tin of their ordinary stuff from the fish coop and it was finished after 3 months. It was allegedly a bad batch. I visited the factory in Sydney not long after to buy more paint but the bloke I talked to did not exactly inspire me and probably explained the varying quality.


yes the names are different to the websites , and the reps are dodgy .... the cuustomer service is not ideal ....they make too much money selling paint to shipping companys !!!!

i think the stuff i bought was sea gardian , but carnt remember, must have been a good batch ,because its hanging in there .

nswsailor
NSW, 1063 posts
16 May 2018 10:10PM
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Toyboata said..
Wow that's unreal Phillip!

Was one 4lt tin of altex no 5 enough to do all 4 coats on your top hat?


No you require two 4 litre tins. [2 coats per tin for a Top Hat]

HowTo
2 posts
16 May 2018 11:52PM
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Supposed to antifoul at least every 12 months, and sounds like you pay someone to do it, do it yourself and save money, Once you scrape the bottom, the crustations become more aggressive, however this is also something you should do yourself if you chose to scrape the hull, (flippers, mask and scraper).

Stockie
NSW, 19 posts
17 May 2018 1:37PM
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This subject is an interesting one, very subjective. But I ask anyway!

I have Jotun Sea Guardian on my Bavaria in the Port Hacking. It was anti-fouled last August, and I the type that likes to try and clean off slime during the summer months. The boat is used most week ends, and the AF was pretty good, up until February 2018. However those nasty little volcano type shell creatures have infested the undersides, since about March. I think my mooring area is probably the culprit, no rain and hot water temperatures this season. Are other moored yachts getting done over by these critters this year?
I visited Jotun at Wetherill Park, Sydney. Mainly because I was struggling to understand the product names, Local to International. The rep gave me two possible ablative products for leisure applications.

Sea Guardian, already using this and not super impressed?
Sea Victor 50 , I gather this is a more commercial product, slightly dearer.

Has anyone used the Sea Victor and have any reports on it over say the Sea Guardian.

Cheers and thanks Richard

UncleBob
NSW, 256 posts
17 May 2018 2:50PM
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Select to expand quote
Stockie said..
This subject is an interesting one, very subjective. But I ask anyway!

I have Jotun Sea Guardian on my Bavaria in the Port Hacking. It was anti-fouled last August, and I the type that likes to try and clean off slime during the summer months. The boat is used most week ends, and the AF was pretty good, up until February 2018. However those nasty little volcano type shell creatures have infested the undersides, since about March. I think my mooring area is probably the culprit, no rain and hot water temperatures this season. Are other moored yachts getting done over by these critters this year?
I visited Jotun at Wetherill Park, Sydney. Mainly because I was struggling to understand the product names, Local to International. The rep gave me two possible ablative products for leisure applications.

Sea Guardian, already using this and not super impressed?
Sea Victor 50 , I gather this is a more commercial product, slightly dearer.

Has anyone used the Sea Victor and have any reports on it over say the Sea Guardian.

Cheers and thanks Richard


Hi, my boat is moored in Gwawley Bay, Georges river so the barnacles aren't so bad but everyone that I know who has a boat moored in the Hacking are struggling with the barnacles. Good luck!!



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"Extra layer of antifoul???" started by Gos2017