Forums > Sailing General

PANTANEUS boat insurance appears to be totally USELESS and misleading

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Created by julesmoto A week ago, 5 Aug 2022
julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
5 Aug 2022 11:31AM
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Going through the throes of trying to get reasonable insurance. Pantaenius sent me a policy which appears to have so many exclusions that it is next to worthless. For example what would people consider to be the meaning of this clause buried in the policy and not on the front page which says the exess is $2,500.

"The Deductible in the event of loss or damage as a result of flooding or sinking when your Vessel is unattended while moored at a swing mooring, in a marina or pontoon berth, at anchor or on a pile mooring shall be 50% of the value of the claim for a partial loss or 50% of the Market Value for a Total Loss or Constructive Total Loss."

Madmouse
274 posts
5 Aug 2022 12:42PM
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Nasty

FabulousPhill
VIC, 196 posts
5 Aug 2022 3:19PM
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What's the point of an excess, and then deduct 50% of the claim on top of the excess.
Shop around.

julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
5 Aug 2022 4:05PM
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Select to expand quote
FabulousPhill said..
What's the point of an excess, and then deduct 50% of the claim on top of the excess.
Shop around.



Don't worry I have but how many poor unsuspecting souls are resting happily with peace of mind having payed exorbitant premiums mistakenly believing they are fully insured whilst this clause and plenty of other bad ones are lurking in their policy.
Given that this is a policy for people who do not live on their boats this clause would apply 99.9% of the time and they should be taken to court for misrepresenting that the boat is insured for the full value and that the excess is only $2,500.

sparau
QLD, 51 posts
5 Aug 2022 5:30PM
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It's so amazingly open ended yeah? Insurance speak isn't really my thing but wont all events with a boat that end up with a total loss involve
...
sinking?
So basically if you ever leave your boat in the water it is a 50% policy as soon as you walk away?
'I just went to use the marina bathroom your honour and my lithium batteries...'

julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
5 Aug 2022 5:46PM
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sparau said..
It's so amazingly open ended yeah? Insurance speak isn't really my thing but wont all events with a boat that end up with a total loss involve
...
sinking?
So basically if you ever leave your boat in the water it is a 50% policy as soon as you walk away?
'I just went to use the marina bathroom your honour and my lithium batteries...'






Yep. The one about lightning damage is even worse because then only 10% of the policy insured value is recoverable - less of course the front page excess. Then there's the $5,000 excess for salvage and additional $5,000 excess for disposal of wreck so they may end up paying nothing.

Isn't it Kay Cottee that fronts the TV ads for these crooks now? Wonder she has seen a policy?

MorningBird
NSW, 2546 posts
5 Aug 2022 6:56PM
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Basically telling you they don't want your business. MB was insured with them and the cover was very good, although I never claimed and that is the only test of insurance.

r13
NSW, 1148 posts
5 Aug 2022 7:14PM
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Yep - Pantaenius included the below in Jan 2022 quote to us...............

There is no cover for mast, spars and rigging and damage caused by mast, spars and rigging failure.

woko
NSW, 1211 posts
5 Aug 2022 9:15PM
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Ah but it the only company that will 3rd party, public liability/ salvage my aged fleet so I can haul out

Jethrow
NSW, 1129 posts
5 Aug 2022 9:18PM
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MorningBird said..
Basically telling you they don't want your business. MB was insured with them and the cover was very good, although I never claimed and that is the only test of insurance.


Actually, they're not saying they don't want your business, they're just saying pay your premiums until you claim, then we'll screw you!

garymalmgren
879 posts
5 Aug 2022 7:33PM
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Actually, they're not saying they don't want your business, they're just saying pay your premiums until you claim, then we'll screw you!

Where one leads the others follow.
It is hard to imagine some company jumping in with a great policy to undercut everyone else in the market.

Ramona
NSW, 6756 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 8:49AM
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woko said..
Ah but it the only company that will 3rd party, public liability/ salvage my aged fleet so I can haul out


Try New Wave Marine.

woko
NSW, 1211 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 9:03AM
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Ramona said..

woko said..
Ah but it the only company that will 3rd party, public liability/ salvage my aged fleet so I can haul out



Try New Wave Marine.

I tried them all last year pantaenius was the only one to take on the work boat. There was another shonky as hell set up that worked out of Spain but it was utter dead money as the marinas wouldn't accept their cover

Madmouse
274 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 7:27AM
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Youi requires a marine survey no more than 3 years old at the time of the claim.

(Special conditions)

cammd
QLD, 3113 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 10:05AM
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julesmoto said..
Going through the throes of trying to get reasonable insurance. Pantaenius sent me a policy which appears to have so many exclusions that it is next to worthless. For example what would people consider to be the meaning of this clause buried in the policy and not on the front page which says the exess is $2,500.

"The Deductible in the event of loss or damage as a result of flooding or sinking when your Vessel is unattended while moored at a swing mooring, in a marina or pontoon berth, at anchor or on a pile mooring shall be 50% of the value of the claim for a partial loss or 50% of the Market Value for a Total Loss or Constructive Total Loss."


I have a new Pantaenius policy, I cannot find the above clause in the PDS or policy schedule anywhere. What section is it.

r13
NSW, 1148 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 5:32PM
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In the PDS which was attached to the quote we received in Jan 2022 it was in Clause 5.1 under Section 5 Deductibles on page 14.

Madmouse
274 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 3:46PM
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This is the Pantheus website





Madmouse
274 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 4:05PM
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This is the current PDS.


cammd
QLD, 3113 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 6:06PM
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r13 said..
In the PDS which was attached to the quote we received in Jan 2022 it was in Clause 5.1 under Section 5 Deductibles on page 14.


Definatley different from the PDS I have from them. The one I have reflects the statement posted above from the website.

I did have a couple of questions before signing, mostly about the racing exclusion, I may want to do some wags or bay races from time to time so they amended the schedule.to reflect that request. Phone service was good and actually met the people I spoke on the phone at the boat show. All that is wonderful I guess but the true test would be a claim that I hope never happens.

Kinora
VIC, 101 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 7:47PM
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We recently had to renew the insurance on our ski lodge at Mt Baw Baw (GAFIA, look it up, built by members in the '70s to a very high standard). The insurance company, with whom we have been for years, inserted a similar clause restricting pay out to 50% of claim in the event of loss due to bush fire (and maybe a couple of other "Acts of God" if memory serves). We couldn't find another company prepared to insure us, so we had to take the offer reasoning that at least that would cover cleaning up the debris.

It's getting tough to be different, insurance is just one more pressure pushing us towards a blander society.

Good luck, julesmoto!

Cheers,
Kinora

julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 9:09PM
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Select to expand quote
r13 said..
In the PDS which was attached to the quote we received in Jan 2022 it was in Clause 5.1 under Section 5 Deductibles on page 14.


Yep

julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 9:11PM
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Select to expand quote
r13 said..
In the PDS which was attached to the quote we received in Jan 2022 it was in Clause 5.1 under Section 5 Deductibles on page 14.


Yep
Select to expand quote
Madmouse said..
This is the Pantheus website






Well that is an outright lie then. The policy was sent to me last week.

garymalmgren
879 posts
Saturday , 6 Aug 2022 9:00PM
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Can I just take a moment here to point out that they have spelt commercial incorrectly.
As in "comercial towing fees" hehe.

Gary

UncleBob
NSW, 1009 posts
Sunday , 7 Aug 2022 7:46AM
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Kinora said..
.................
It's getting tough to be different, insurance is just one more pressure pushing us towards a blander society.

Good luck, julesmoto!

Cheers,
Kinora


Yep, a bit like the current crop of politicians, short sighted and bland as can be.

psychomub
402 posts
Sunday , 7 Aug 2022 6:22AM
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I believe insurance companies are also distancing themselves from boats with Lithium Ion batteries.

Also, boats over a certain age (30 years?) have massive "deductibles". I have friends with a 40 year old fibreglass boat that is quite frankly immaculate and in way better condition than most new boats. They have reverted to 3rd party insurance as a comprehensive policy will pay out virtually nothing .

welsh
NSW, 27 posts
Sunday , 7 Aug 2022 11:32AM
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I am just applying to anchorage insurance. Yet to receive the quote and special conditions
Will keep you guys posted when it comes through

julesmoto
NSW, 502 posts
Sunday , 7 Aug 2022 3:21PM
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welsh said..
I am just applying to anchorage insurance. Yet to receive the quote and special conditions
Will keep you guys posted when it comes through


I'm going to try them on Monday because I could only find a phone number. Have you found the way to do it online?

welsh
NSW, 27 posts
Sunday , 7 Aug 2022 4:20PM
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G'day Jules I rang Greg Fullerton directly on 9959 4422 and he seemed quite affable I used him because the previous owner of Maggie had been using him for several years so I thought it might be easier to keep the continued connection ,
policy pending of course

MorningBird
NSW, 2546 posts
Monday , 8 Aug 2022 9:50AM
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Jethrow said..

MorningBird said..
Basically telling you they don't want your business. MB was insured with them and the cover was very good, although I never claimed and that is the only test of insurance.



Actually, they're not saying they don't want your business, they're just saying pay your premiums until you claim, then we'll screw you!


A valid interpretation indeed. A pity, they were very good when I had MB.

cammd
QLD, 3113 posts
Monday , 8 Aug 2022 10:18AM
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I was mildy alarmed when I saw this thread having just paid for Pantaenius so been checking my PDS and looking at the website, there seems to be two different PDS documents, one for "All Risk" and one for "Prime". The "all risk" PDS does not contain the 50% deductible clause in question. Might be worth a call to discuss, they were half the price of New Wave when I got quotes and $1000 cheaper then the next best. Below is the clause regarding deductibles that states no deductible will apply if the boat is at it's usual berth, pontoon or jetty but not a swing mooring or anchor in which case the deductible would apply ($2800.00 on my policy schedule)

5. Deductibles:
The Deductibles specified in the Schedule will apply to each claim except that a Deductible will not apply in respect of:
5.1. a Total Loss or Constructive Total Loss of the entire Vessel under Section A?3.2;
5.2. any claim under Section A ?2. 11 for Loss of Charter Income; and
5.3. any claim for loss or damage arising whilst the Vessel is moored at its usual berth, pontoon or private jetty
providing the Vessel is not moored on a swing mooring or is at anchor.

there is a severe weather exclusion I don't like which involves the vessel being unattended at anchor during a severe weather event, guess I will have to be onboard.



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"PANTANEUS boat insurance appears to be totally USELESS and misleading" started by julesmoto