Forums > Windsurfing Foiling

Old meets new

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Created by ZoltanL Two weeks ago, 4 Jan 2019
ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
4 Jan 2019 4:43AM
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Now using foil on 2009 RRD X-Fire 122L and as a 'winged keel' on 1990s Speed 250L race board.

I just needed to figure out how to use a 2017 foil designed for a deep Tuttle box on a 2009 board with a standard (shallow) Tuttle box that wasn't designed to take the load of a foil.

The solution* (*you can just buy a board with deep Tuttle box and get foiling) is to redistribute the load away from the standard Tuttle box and create a load-bearing 'sandwich' - to spread the load between the top (deck) and bottom of the board.

This should work for all foils with a flange - such as Starboard GT, Slingshot & Fanatic. It's a new option for people with older boards still in great condition and perfect for foiling, but limited by having a standard Tuttle box.

Note: It won't work on foils without a flange - such as Neil Pryde Alu Flight or Starboard racing foils.

This 'sandwich' method also works well with longboards with open centreboard boxes such as the 25-30 year old Speed 250L race board from the 1990s. You just need 150mm long M6 bolts.








Paducah
223 posts
4 Jan 2019 5:57AM
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For those looking for a more straightforward approach, Zeeko among others offers a regular tuttle compatible adapter.

zeeko-kites.com/gb/kitefoil-series/351-tuttle-deep-tuttle-adaptater-foil.html

Kudos for the effort, Zoltan! I'll be the first to confess having taken the less straightforward approach a few times.

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
4 Jan 2019 8:34PM
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Thanks Paducah,
thats great to hear - and maybe the best thing to come out of this whole forum thing is more people will be aware they can buy the deep Tuttle to Tuttle adapter from Zeeko and others, in which case I'll think I've done my job and will move on. I've been windsurfing 30+ years and never heard of or saw Zeeko before - but then I never had a reason to until now. I'll definitely check them out.
Thanks again!
z

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
5 Jan 2019 2:32AM
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Select to expand quote
Paducah said..
For those looking for a more straightforward approach, Zeeko among others offers a regular tuttle compatible adapter.

zeeko-kites.com/gb/kitefoil-series/351-tuttle-deep-tuttle-adaptater-foil.html

Kudos for the effort, Zoltan! I'll be the first to confess having taken the less straightforward approach a few times.












I checked out the Zeeko adapter. It's 100 euros which converts to $177 Australian dollars today including an extra 10% GST in AUS for online purchases made overseas.

The retail cost of parts for mine so far (excluding deck plate flange which I'm still trying to source) is considerably lower. I confirmed yesterday 150mm M6 bolts are fine even for the front half of the CB box. Which is great as 170mm bolts cost me $14 each, so a pair would more than doubled the current total cost for parts so far.

So for now, I'm happy to stick with my less straightforward 'sandwich' approach as it's more versatile and works with raceboard CB boxes as well as standard Tuttle boxes - albeit with different setups as the RB kit doesn't need the 'collar' for the bottom of the board, but uses an extra thinner, wider flange on the bottom of the board for added protection.

Paducah
223 posts
4 Jan 2019 11:57PM
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Zoltan, Thanks, that's very kind of you. I don't own a zeeko but they seem well regarded. As I mentioned, I think a few brands have something for regular tuttle. Hopefully, others with more knowledge will chime in.

But you have to tell us what a foil on a longboard is like.

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
5 Jan 2019 3:00AM
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OK. How does it feel?
Simply beautiful.
Super stable.
Super smooth.
The faster you go, the more stable it gets. If it gets too scary, I'll just drop down a sail size or 2! My go-to sails are 8.5m up to 20 knots and 7.7m over 20 knots. I've yet to use smaller.

The best local foiler here uses 9.5m sail on Formula boards and flies rings around the rest of us at 50-75 cm up on his 105cm racing foil carbon mast. Also super smooth & beautiful to watch! He's been foiling for 2 seasons now and has everything under perfect control.

Theres now about bout a dozen regular windsurfing foilers in Canberra that I know of. Probably more who just go to the coast. Also some Canberta kite foilers, but they usually chase the more steady sea breezes and avoid the more gusty winds we get here on the lake.

ZeeGerman
86 posts
6 Jan 2019 6:49PM
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Any pics or vids of you flying the raceboard on the foil?
I would love to see this!

joe windsurf
1421 posts
6 Jan 2019 9:26PM
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^ +1

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
7 Jan 2019 1:43AM
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ZeeGerman said..
Any pics or vids of you flying the raceboard on the foil?
I would love to see this!




Hahah... early days yet ZeeGerman & Joe Windsurf. I've only had it a month and still have a lot to learn on 5 very different boards.

As there's some interest, I'll buy a GoPro and shoot some helmet-cam videos so people can get an idea what it's like learning - and falling :D - on the RB & the 4 other boards. It would have been great having one for yesterday arvo's easterly!

And please excuse the "Oh $&@!... Holy F$@#+? S&@!!!" in advance

The fleet:
1. 170L Bic Kevin Pritchard Replica Formula Board (deep Tuttle).
2. 148L Bic Techno 2 (deep Tuttle).
3. 122L RRD X-Fire (shallow Tuttle).
4. ~115L Extreme Slalom by Steve Hayden (RIP) Torquay, VIC (shallow Tuttle).
5. 250L Speed Race Board by Steve Mcgeary, Brisbane, QLD (US Box + CB slot).




joe windsurf
1421 posts
7 Jan 2019 1:52AM
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thanks Zoltan - needed a pic of the FW 1.4 to update my list of BIC boards over time !!

joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/2017/07/bic-windsurf-boards.html

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
7 Jan 2019 5:29AM
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joe windsurf said..
thanks Zoltan - needed a pic of the FW 1.4 to update my list of BIC boards over time !!

joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/2017/07/bic-windsurf-boards.html




Welcome Joe. It's the best & easiest of the fleet to foil on.

Your Bic history blog is great!!!

FW1.4 Dimensions: 170L
Length: ~265 cm
width: 100cm

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
7 Jan 2019 8:28PM
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Foil adapter kit on 2009 RRD X-Fire with standard Tuttle box. Mon 7.1.19

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1266493463501686/

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
8 Jan 2019 7:30AM
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ZoltanL said..
Foil adapter kit on 2009 RRD X-Fire with standard Tuttle box. Mon 7.1.19


FB link in previous post no longer works. Also, it's a 2010 X-Fire V2.
See my new update at:
www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1266699106814455/

Board review available at:
www.windsurfing44.com/matos/RRD/2010/RRD_2010_Boards_X-Fire_LTD_V2_en.pdf


ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
9 Jan 2019 2:33AM
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Tues. 8.1.19 update: Foil switch from 2010 RRD X-Fire V2 122L (standard Tuttle box) to 1990s Speed 250L Race Board (Centreboard slot) demonstrating my new Foil Adapter Kit.

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1267199733431059/

joe windsurf
1421 posts
9 Jan 2019 5:35AM
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waitin for the video in action on the raceboard
where did you get the top black plate ??

no comment on the grass - know others will cover that for me !!

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
9 Jan 2019 8:48AM
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Select to expand quote
joe windsurf said..
waitin for the video in action on the raceboard
where did you get the top black plate ??

no comment on the grass - know others will cover that for me !!





Hey Joe Windsurf. Won't be long now. Bought a GoPro and mounted it on a helmet for helmet cam video. Just waiting for wind now. Yesterday on the RB after the storm was a total fizzer and turned into an extreme pumping workout.

I got the top black plate from the re-use shop (Green Shed) at the local rubbish tip. It's a roof top flange from an old Rhino Roof Rack system. They aren't made any more, but there are heaps of other options. Nylon bread/cheese/fish cutting board from your kitchen will do very nicely. Just cut to size and drill 2 holes to align with Tuttle box bolt holes.

joe windsurf
1421 posts
9 Jan 2019 7:39AM
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while you are experimenting with this ...
i am experimenting with third person videoing on ice n snow
naturally the wind died when i filmed at the end of my session !!
but i am sailing into the sunset :-)



if you are interested in full discussion ...
joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/p/2019.html

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
10 Jan 2019 12:51AM
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joe windsurf said..
while you are experimenting with this ...
i am experimenting with third person videoing on ice n snow
naturally the wind died when i filmed at the end of my session !!
but i am sailing into the sunset :-)

WOW

if you are interested in full discussion ...
joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/p/2019.html


WOW!!! on ice & snow sounds like an episode of Game of Thrones. Total opposite to here in summer. I'll check out your blog. Thanks heaps!

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
11 Jan 2019 5:57AM
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Got GoPro video on the Speed 250L RB + foil using 8.5m sail in a 20 knot easterly that was bloody awesome.

And just as evil boy King Joffrey in Game of Thrones named his newly forged Valarian steel sword "HEART EATER" - made from half the melted steel from the innocent yet executed Eddard Stark's noble sword; I'm re-naming my Speed RB "BOLT BREAKER" after it broke a second back bolt on the foil mast head. But this was no ordinary 80c bolt from Bunnings. This was a $14 High Tensile Steel bolt !!!

So, I'll edit down 2 hours of GoPro video and upload Friday night. Stay tuned.

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
11 Jan 2019 5:57AM
Thumbs Up

Got GoPro video on the Speed 250L RB + foil using 8.5m sail in a 20 knot easterly that was bloody awesome.

And just as evil boy King Joffrey in Game of Thrones named his newly forged Valarian steel sword "HEART EATER" - made from half the melted steel from the innocent yet executed Eddard Stark's noble sword; I'm re-naming my Speed RB "BOLT BREAKER" after it broke a second back bolt on the foil mast head. But this was no ordinary 80c bolt from Bunnings. This was a $14 High Tensile Steel bolt !!!

So, I'll edit down 2 hours of GoPro video and upload Friday night. Stay tuned.

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
11 Jan 2019 9:29AM
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Select to expand quote
joe windsurf said..
while you are experimenting with this ...
i am experimenting with third person videoing on ice n snow
naturally the wind died when i filmed at the end of my session !!
but i am sailing into the sunset :-)



if you are interested in full discussion ...
joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/p/2019.html



You're $&@?! KIDDING me... Wind-skiing on snow over iced-over frozen river/lake in -20*C!!! My mind is boggling... Beautiful camera work by the way Joe. It's like the perfect death for a windsurfer... sailing into the light towards heaven. Total bliss. That's the way I want to go... just not for another 50 years or so.

Imax1
VIC, 1616 posts
11 Jan 2019 7:05PM
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no comment on the grass - know others will cover that for me !!

That's not grass , that's the outback

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
11 Jan 2019 7:22PM
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Imax1 said..



no comment on the grass - know others will cover that for me !!


That's not grass , that's the outback


Imax is right. It's just the grass at the rigging area by the lake. Not my back yard grass patch - which is really a glorified dog toilet lol.

just a coincidence, but yesterday I left the 8.5m clear monofilm arrows sail on it for a few hours in the hot mid-day Aussie sun... and viola: bloody well cooked the grass to crispy toast! See pic. Green line = batten lol


Pic below is before shot.


Imax1
VIC, 1616 posts
11 Jan 2019 7:50PM
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^^^^
petermac33 will tell you it's crop circles.
ps: pup looks chuffed with his loo.

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
12 Jan 2019 1:06AM
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Sat 12.1.2019 New Videos:

1. Speed 250L Race Board + Foil - Passing yacht:

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1269479619869737/

2. Speed demo + short flight & touchdown

To be added.

* More to follow over time.w

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
12 Jan 2019 7:16AM
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Sat 12.1.2019 New Videos:

1. Speed 250L Race Board + Foil - Passing yacht:

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1269479619869737/

2. Short flight & touchdown at high speed on race board with foil:

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/126954832986

3. Search & Destroy on Speed 250L race board with foil:

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1269682933182739/


CAN17
125 posts
12 Jan 2019 5:07AM
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joe windsurf said..
while you are experimenting with this ...
i am experimenting with third person videoing on ice n snow
naturally the wind died when i filmed at the end of my session !!
but i am sailing into the sunset :-)



if you are interested in full discussion ...
joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/p/2019.html


How thicks the ice there Joe. I was skating at Lagoon city off of lake simcoe a few weeks ago, it was a bit thin in some spots near bridges like at your spot there.

I wish I put together a ice windsurfer this winter, talk about doing it every year but just end up sitting on my ass watching nfl or nhl.
Would be foiling every day...only if I lived in a warn climate

joe windsurf
1421 posts
12 Jan 2019 5:20AM
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hey CAN17
where on Lake SImcoe are you ??
spent my teenage years in Keswick/Sutton/Jackson's Point
and NO windsurfing - were on motor boats - crazy teens
now dream of windsurfin on water and ice there

ice was > 12 inches thick where fisherman was
in the middle of the river were snowmobile tracks
less than -20 degrees C this weekend
with westerlies and 10 cm snow on ground
ALL are telling me to stay home :-)
we will see ...

CAN17
125 posts
12 Jan 2019 8:05AM
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joe windsurf said..
hey CAN17
where on Lake SImcoe are you ??
spent my teenage years in Keswick/Sutton/Jackson's Point
and NO windsurfing - were in motor boat - crazy teens
now dream of windsurfin on water and ice there

ice was > 12 inches thick where fisherman was
in the middle of the river were snowmobile tracks
less than -20 degrees C this weekend
with westerlies and 10 cm snow on ground
ALL are telling me to stay home :-)
we will see ...




I was just visiting relatives. But may get out for a skate again this weekend on the canals in lagoon city( west side of the lake), ice is super smooth I hear.
Saw someone using a umbrella like a windsurf sail with his skates. May have to give it a try

Will try to make it to the lake and see if any windsurfers are out. I have always wanted to try it on snow.

Ps, sorry for the brief thread hijacking ZoltanL.

joe windsurf
1421 posts
12 Jan 2019 8:10AM
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Georges used to windsurf and went to the dark side
in the winter, kiting on snow makes SO much more sense !!

&t=299s

i am one of VERY few who windsurf in the winter on ice n snow
even Yvente of quebecwind now uses kites in the winter ...



but has been known to windsurf in crazy cold condtions



but all this is NOT about foiling nor old versus new
will stop here now

ZoltanL
ACT, 92 posts
12 Jan 2019 12:10PM
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Sat 12.1.2019 New Videos:

1. Speed 250L Race Board + Foil - Passing yacht:

www.facebook.com/100004231339520/posts/1269479619869737/

2. Short flight & touchdown at high speed on race board with foil:



3. Search & Destroy on Speed 250L race board with foil:





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"Old meets new" started by ZoltanL