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Prototype goya sail ?

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Created by windaddict Tuesday, 10 Oct 2017
windaddict
VIC, 1052 posts
Tuesday , 10 Oct 2017 7:11PM
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Goya sail with cutout below the boom ??!!?

Mark _australia
WA, 16825 posts
Tuesday , 10 Oct 2017 5:09PM
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After years and years of trying to have a controllable CoE down low..... WTF!?
Getting a bit tired of distorting sails with not enough battens that only feel good on the 10% perfect days..... but can live with it if I have to.
Three battens = specialist. This is taking it even further
If the above is a true pic, it would be pig for normal people on normal waves most of the time. Not only floppy, but all power up high (when you do actually have any power)



Stuthepirate
WA, 3085 posts
Tuesday , 10 Oct 2017 5:22PM
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They must of had a bet on in the Goya loft as to who can make the most ridiculous sail and still catch a wave with it.

Mark _australia
WA, 16825 posts
Tuesday , 10 Oct 2017 8:46PM
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^^yeah agreed thats why I said if it is a true pic. Surely its a joke or photoshopped or something?

gorgesailor
3 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 3:34AM
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Mark _australia said..
After years and years of trying to have a controllable CoE down low..... WTF!?
Getting a bit tired of distorting sails with not enough battens that only feel good on the 10% perfect days..... but can live with it if I have to.
Three battens = specialist. This is taking it even further
If the above is a true pic, it would be pig for normal people on normal waves most of the time. Not only floppy, but all power up high (when you do actually have any power)





You have obviously not sailed any newer sails.

HotBodMon
NSW, 85 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 9:41AM
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Finally a duckgybable sail that misses my chiseled serratus anterior

windaddict
VIC, 1052 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 9:49AM
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Definately not photoshopped, I will post a link to the video that I sceen cap'd it from as soon as I find the link to it again.

windaddict
VIC, 1052 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 10:05AM
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@ 1:20 - 1:30





KDog
18 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 7:08AM
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If that thing hits the market then I'll just start rigging my bedsheets!

Mark _australia
WA, 16825 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 9:21AM
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gorgesailor said.. You have obviously not sailed any newer sails.


Yeah I have actually. On their day a 3 batten is awesome.

But most wavesailors, most of the time are not in nice constant winds or on great waves in cross shore. The vast majority need stability.

The very on-off feeling that makes a 3 batten pure wave sail so wonderful on a wave, is a pain in the arse when it is gusty, or you are a heavy guy trying to get out thru a big break and the power just switches off. Additionally, they don't have the wind range.

My 5 batten Combats (5.0, 5.3 and 5.6) feel great and when I drop down to the 4 batten 4.5m it is immediately apparent it has less range. They just simply distort more. I like the 4.5 on a wave but you can feel the difference. Many sails make up for that with a 100% mast, the reflex response helps a lot but again, not everyone wants that. Some people want the 60 - 75% mast for cost reasons. Bit like the cars that need premium fuel get rated a bit lower in reviews.

I can't think of anything worse than combining a flexier foil (high skin tension or not) with less battens AND now sticking the CoE even higher.
Too specialist.

I'd love to be proven wrong though.

azymuth
WA, 319 posts
Wednesday , 11 Oct 2017 2:26PM
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That video is great - nice to see mortals sailing for a change - check out 2.48 mins

gorgesailor
3 posts
Thursday , 12 Oct 2017 12:18AM
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Mark _australia said..


gorgesailor said.. You have obviously not sailed any newer sails.




Yeah I have actually. On their day a 3 batten is awesome.

But most wavesailors, most of the time are not in nice constant winds or on great waves in cross shore. The vast majority need stability.

The very on-off feeling that makes a 3 batten pure wave sail so wonderful on a wave, is a pain in the arse when it is gusty, or you are a heavy guy trying to get out thru a big break and the power just switches off. Additionally, they don't have the wind range.

My 5 batten Combats (5.0, 5.3 and 5.6) feel great and when I drop down to the 4 batten 4.5m it is immediately apparent it has less range. They just simply distort more. I like the 4.5 on a wave but you can feel the difference. Many sails make up for that with a 100% mast, the reflex response helps a lot but again, not everyone wants that. Some people want the 60 - 75% mast for cost reasons. Bit like the cars that need premium fuel get rated a bit lower in reviews.

I can't think of anything worse than combining a flexier foil (high skin tension or not) with less battens AND now sticking the CoE even higher.
Too specialist.

I'd love to be proven wrong though.



I was very skeptical myself but proved myself wrong. Try a KS3. I bet it has as much or more range than the Combat. You may not like the feel as much as your Combat, but I bet it will change your view of the wind range & versatility of 3 battens. The Power is very low & forward. It is a bit squirelly due to the very defined C.O.E but super fun even in B&J. That said, I agree about that Goya proto ...

NordRoi
186 posts
Thursday , 12 Oct 2017 12:40AM
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said..

d love to be proven wrong though.




I was very skeptical myself but proved myself wrong. Try a KS3. I bet it has as much or more range than the Combat. You may not like the feel as much as your Combat, but I bet it will change your view of the wind range & versatility of 3 battens. The Power is very low & forward. It is a bit squirelly due to the very defined C.O.E but super fun even in B&J. That said, I agree about that Goya proto ...


I was also very skeptical going for a Ezzy Taka3 (3 battens + 3/4). I tested it first on Maui and was blown away how the low end was! I also liked a lot the lively feeling and the upwind was insane. I pulled the trigger for the 5.3 and the 4.7 and was not confident in ordering a 4.1.

Now, I only sailed the 4.1 once in a very gusty and super overpower wind, but it delivered more stability that I was thinking, but need to test it again to make sure I don't go for a 4 battens next time. BUT, for sure the 5.3 and 4.7 is the sweet spot for the taka3. Even in strong wind, the range is impressive!! For now, I did not missed the 4 or 5 batten on the 5.3 and 4.7 but maybe on the 4.1.

bowsa
QLD, 488 posts
Thursday , 12 Oct 2017 12:29PM
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guys - without innovation and prototypes/new ideas nothing changes - where's the positive vibes?

Imax1
VIC, 835 posts
Thursday , 12 Oct 2017 2:50PM
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bowsa said..
guys - without innovation and prototypes/new ideas nothing changes - where's the positive vibes?


Less material , should be cheaper.
Does anyone know the advantages of this sail , less fouling in the whitewash ?

Mark _australia
WA, 16825 posts
Thursday , 12 Oct 2017 12:35PM
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bowsa said..
guys - without innovation and prototypes/new ideas nothing changes - where's the positive vibes?


Agreed - but we won't see 1 batten wave sails anytime soon I hope.

bowsa
QLD, 488 posts
Friday , 13 Oct 2017 11:15AM
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classic example is when stoney did that really short tomo style board and everyone was like woah man whats this ****. Now nearly all brands have a stubby style board
I say go for it, try new stuff, we as the consumers then get better products

stehsegler
WA, 2822 posts
Friday , 13 Oct 2017 11:32AM
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bowsa said..
I say go for it, try new stuff, we as the consumers then get better products


The problem is that most production boards these days cost around $3k, production sails anywhere from $900 to $1500. That's a lot of money to spend on a fad or half baked idea.

bowsa
QLD, 488 posts
Friday , 13 Oct 2017 1:59PM
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stehsegler said..

bowsa said..
I say go for it, try new stuff, we as the consumers then get better products



The problem is that most production boards these days cost around $3k, production sails anywhere from $900 to $1500. That's a lot of money to spend on a fad or half baked idea.


very valid point

philn
177 posts
Friday , 13 Oct 2017 8:34PM
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If the brands don't try new ideas we'd still be using wooden tie on booms and having our mast feet pop out all the time.

Mark _australia
WA, 16825 posts
Friday , 13 Oct 2017 8:55PM
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^^

on the other hand, stuff becoming too hardcore in the 1990's and early 2000's killed off a lot of windsurfing. We went back to easy boards, freeride, camless etc and it helped a lot. Are wavesails almost going the other way? (ie only for the hardcore places...?)

OTOH #2 is we don't use winged fins, footy fins, fenced fins, kitewings, removable external cam things, various box types, polypropylene, full Dacron sails with the zip-off leech for storms , glass masts, Z- booms, chest harnesses, etc................ all "innovations"

Innovation is great, but I simply suggest there is a practical limit, and the 3 batten sail is most likely it (in its current form). Much like there is no point trying a 13 batten configuration in a 9m race sail. We know that. We know that a high CoE is not comfy so why deliberately do it?

I love the bottom end of a S-3 or Fly. I love them on the wave in cross to cross off. The other 80% of the time they are a PITA. Goya 3 batten must be the emporers new clothes for Yanks the way they froth about it Magicride was telling us they're a great freeride sail FFS.

gorgesailor
3 posts
Saturday , 14 Oct 2017 12:19AM
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If it was up to my preference I would say Hotsails could drop the 4 & 5 batten sails. It is down to feel & personal preference - not wind range. My buddy used to only have the 5.2 & 4.0, he would sail the 5.2 right down till he needed the 4.0, the range is that good. Again not everyone will like the feel but its not about range or C.O.E. In fact the 3 batten has a lower C.O.E than the 5 batten in this case.

philn
177 posts
Saturday , 14 Oct 2017 12:40AM
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Mark _australia said..
^^

on the other hand, stuff becoming too hardcore in the 1990's and early 2000's killed off a lot of windsurfing. We went back to easy boards, freeride, camless etc and it helped a lot. Are wavesails almost going the other way? (ie only for the hardcore places...?)

OTOH #2 is we don't use winged fins, footy fins, fenced fins, kitewings, removable external cam things, various box types, polypropylene, full Dacron sails with the zip-off leech for storms , glass masts, Z- booms, chest harnesses, etc................ all "innovations"

Innovation is great, but I simply suggest there is a practical limit, and the 3 batten sail is most likely it (in its current form). Much like there is no point trying a 13 batten configuration in a 9m race sail. We know that. We know that a high CoE is not comfy so why deliberately do it?

I love the bottom end of a S-3 or Fly. I love them on the wave in cross to cross off. The other 80% of the time they are a PITA. Goya 3 batten must be the emporers new clothes for Yanks the way they froth about it Magicride was telling us they're a great freeride sail FFS.


That's the great thing about a free market - if they try to sell something that doesn't make sense you don't have to buy it, and pretty soon they'll stop trying to sell it.

joe windsurf
1139 posts
Saturday , 14 Oct 2017 4:09AM
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just need more marketing and advertising if you're selling crap
Coke is still IT !!
more scantily clad women and perhaps Horue will sell more foils than anyone else ??
.
btw NOT saying Horue is crap - just Coca-Cola



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"Prototype goya sail ?" started by windaddict