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FSW vs freeride for bigginer on chop?

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Created by Nubie A week ago, 10 Mar 2019
Nubie
38 posts
10 Mar 2019 4:02PM
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What do you thing what is better option for average sailor who is learninng in choppy water fsw(freewave) or freeride?

I find on starboard website these terms; easy of use ,speed,wind range,early planning and "power"?
What this term "power" mean?

windsurf.star-board.com/products/carve-iq/

Mark _australia
WA, 18816 posts
10 Mar 2019 5:26PM
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What do you mean by learning in choppy water?
Do you mean learning to windsurf? Or do you mean you are good at planing fast on flat water and now want to progress to going fast in rough water?

Nubie
38 posts
10 Mar 2019 5:53PM
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Mark _australia said..
What do you mean by learning in choppy water?
Do you mean learning to windsurf? Or do you mean you are good at planing fast on flat water and now want to progress to going fast in rough water?



I ask generally ,does fsw is easier to sail than freeride in rough condition?

What term "power" mean in board description?

LeeD
388 posts
11 Mar 2019 6:22AM
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"Power"
usually means sail power. A flatter freeride board usually planes up with less sail power while a typical FSW needs more sail power due to it's more rocker and thinner rails

Mark _australia
WA, 18816 posts
11 Mar 2019 8:48AM
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^^^ I would also guess that's what they mean by power.

And yes in general a FSW is more comfortable at full speed in rough water

Nubie
38 posts
11 Mar 2019 12:55PM
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LeeD said..
"Power"
usually means sail power. A flatter freeride board usually planes up with less sail power while a typical FSW needs more sail power due to it's more rocker and thinner rails


CarveIQ has power 6 ,isonic has power 9..
Isnt isonic use less sail power to go planning than freride?

LeeD
388 posts
12 Mar 2019 8:48AM
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Isonic can handle bigger sail, and also needs a bigger sail to release and hit top speed.

sboardcrazy
NSW, 6455 posts
12 Mar 2019 2:25PM
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Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.

Shifu
QLD, 1022 posts
12 Mar 2019 5:01PM
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Don't know anything about your skill level, but boards like the CarveIQ are too wide for their volume. Great for beginners but just too wide to give satisfying performance in rough water.

Yves
WA, 120 posts
12 Mar 2019 5:38PM
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Wide thin freeride boards work in rough water. Some benefits include early planing, gliding though lulls and riding a smaller sail.

Nubie
38 posts
12 Mar 2019 11:53PM
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sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.


What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?

LeeD
388 posts
13 Mar 2019 7:45AM
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Like a race car for someone learning to drive..

sboardcrazy
NSW, 6455 posts
13 Mar 2019 11:52AM
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Nubie said..


sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.




What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?



+ 1 - less forgiving , possible harsher ride , accelerate quicker, prefer to be sailed powered up whereas freeride gear handles being underpowered better, footstraps harder to get into , generally less forgiving than freeride gear.
They are faster than freeride. If you're learning to sail, especially in chop, you don't want a racecar..

Gestalt
QLD, 11906 posts
13 Mar 2019 11:30AM
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Select to expand quote
ty Nubie said..


sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.




What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?



foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.

515
105 posts
13 Mar 2019 9:39AM
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Yes if keeping with Starboard my personal preference would be Kode over Carve IQ.
I did own an older Carve 99 that was awesome at the time.
Comes down to what locations and conditions and what you want to do.
Long blasting runs or bump jump

Mark _australia
WA, 18816 posts
13 Mar 2019 12:48PM
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I'm curious about what you mean by chop also.
On a river in 20kn and its bumpy (like knee high max chop, with chop mostly half that size) is very different to trying to do 30kn in open ocean

But sometimes its easiest to just forget the salesman talk and web specs (that the companies always write to appeal to you, after all their website is in fact advertising). Forget it all an go conventional:

(1)Wide beginner board.
(2) Once you can use the harness and it feels too scary to go fast on, get an easy freeride that is very popular (thinking like Carve, Rocket) about 40L over your bodyweight and go use it in 18-20kn a lot.
(3) After a season or two if you are then finding that scary fast and too much volume for the windier days, get a FSW about 10L more than your bodyweight but keep the freeride board. You will be planing much earlier on the freeride by then, and thus have a 2-board setup for 12-30kn.

That has worked for pretty much everyone on lakes / rivers / relatively flat ocean since like forever.



Nubie
38 posts
13 Mar 2019 2:36PM
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Select to expand quote
Gestalt said..

ty Nubie said..



sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.





What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?




foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.


Isnt it allways case that fsw is slower than freeride?
more rocker,more narrow,soft rails make them slower

westozwind
WA, 1250 posts
13 Mar 2019 2:49PM
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Best to stay clear of the marketing hype on brand websites. As mentioned before, can you give us an idea of where you are sailing (ocean/river/bay) and what your current skill level is?

can you uphaul/sail in non planing conditions and turn around using the sail (tack/gybe)?
planing, water start and in foot straps etc?

a free ride board will not always be faster than a FWS depending on conditions and rider ability.

Nubie
38 posts
13 Mar 2019 5:43PM
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westozwind said..
Best to stay clear of the marketing hype on brand websites. As mentioned before, can you give us an idea of where you are sailing (ocean/river/bay) and what your current skill level is?

can you uphaul/sail in non planing conditions and turn around using the sail (tack/gybe)?
planing, water start and in foot straps etc?

a free ride board will not always be faster than a FWS depending on conditions and rider ability.


bay with chop ,gusty wind all the time.yes I know uphaul in non planning condition and turn with non planning tack or jibe,also use harness and footstraps when planning but I am not good in jibe when planning..

I find hard time on slalom gear in this condition,too fast too out of control...

Gestalt
QLD, 11906 posts
13 Mar 2019 9:46PM
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Select to expand quote
Nubie said..

Gestalt said..


ty Nubie said..




sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.






What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?





foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.



Isnt it allways case that fsw is slower than freeride?
more rocker,more narrow,soft rails make them slower


pre 2010 designs i think your pretty much correct but the last 6 years i don't see thats the case anymore. some fsw boards use freeride rockers as one example.

from what you have said of your experience level are better with freeride but not a a super wide freeride board because of the swells in the bay. something with a wide-ish tail to assist your gybes but inboard straps. possibly stay away from super short and wide shapes as they are more technical to sail.

depending on volume needs you can get fsw boards that also meet the above comments. depends on vintage and brand.

Nubie
38 posts
14 Mar 2019 12:34AM
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Select to expand quote
Gestalt said..

Nubie said..


Gestalt said..



ty Nubie said..





sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.







What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?






foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.




Isnt it allways case that fsw is slower than freeride?
more rocker,more narrow,soft rails make them slower



pre 2010 designs i think your pretty much correct but the last 6 years i don't see thats the case anymore. some fsw boards use freeride rockers as one example.

from what you have said of your experience level are better with freeride but not a a super wide freeride board because of the swells in the bay. something with a wide-ish tail to assist your gybes but inboard straps. possibly stay away from super short and wide shapes as they are more technical to sail.

depending on volume needs you can get fsw boards that also meet the above comments. depends on vintage and brand.


What is easier to sail on FSW inboard or outboard strap setup?

Faff
VIC, 633 posts
14 Mar 2019 8:45AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Gestalt said..

ty Nubie said..



sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.





What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?




foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.


Jeri beach in Brazil has incredibly rough water on the outside (will never complain about Port Philip Bay again). Club Ventos has JP and Starboard. JP FSWs were the first boards to disappear off the racks in the morning. You had to be there at opening time to get one (together with the Germans and their towels dashing for the sunbeds).

Modern JP FSWs in pro construction (S-glass!), are chop eating machines. Personally, I think they are a bit overfinned, but that's what makes them better blasters. They are very easy to ride. The starboard freewave kodes feel like more all around boards, but definitely less "gunny".

Faff
VIC, 633 posts
14 Mar 2019 8:48AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Nubie said..

Gestalt said..


Nubie said..



Gestalt said..




ty Nubie said..






sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.








What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?







foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.





Isnt it allways case that fsw is slower than freeride?
more rocker,more narrow,soft rails make them slower




pre 2010 designs i think your pretty much correct but the last 6 years i don't see thats the case anymore. some fsw boards use freeride rockers as one example.

from what you have said of your experience level are better with freeride but not a a super wide freeride board because of the swells in the bay. something with a wide-ish tail to assist your gybes but inboard straps. possibly stay away from super short and wide shapes as they are more technical to sail.

depending on volume needs you can get fsw boards that also meet the above comments. depends on vintage and brand.



What is easier to sail on FSW inboard or outboard strap setup?


Big sail, big fin - outboard.

Nubie
38 posts
14 Mar 2019 6:54AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Faff said..

Gestalt said..


ty Nubie said..




sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.






What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?





foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.



Jeri beach in Brazil has incredibly rough water on the outside (will never complain about Port Philip Bay again). Club Ventos has JP and Starboard. JP FSWs were the first boards to disappear off the racks in the morning. You had to be there at opening time to get one (together with the Germans and their towels dashing for the sunbeds).

Modern JP FSWs in pro construction (S-glass!), are chop eating machines. Personally, I think they are a bit overfinned, but that's what makes them better blasters. They are very easy to ride. The starboard freewave kodes feel like more all around boards, but definitely less "gunny".


jp fsw faster than kode?

is inbobard straps easier to ride for begginer?

MagicRide
87 posts
14 Mar 2019 7:40AM
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What Does FSW stand for?

Faff
VIC, 633 posts
14 Mar 2019 12:19PM
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MagicRide said..
What Does FSW stand for?


FreeStyle Wave. Some call them Freewaves.

MagicRide
87 posts
14 Mar 2019 9:42AM
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Thx Faff, I was wondering if that's what it was. So I wonder why a semi beginner would consider a fsw board? Aren't those more for experienced riders, or riders wanting to learn freestyle? Or, does a fsw board offer a semi beginner something that other boards don't? I know the fsw boards are more floaty in the back, is that a reason a beginner would want one?

Obelix
WA, 836 posts
14 Mar 2019 4:10PM
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Select to expand quote
Nubie said..


Faff said..



Gestalt said..




ty Nubie said..






sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.








What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?







foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.





Jeri beach in Brazil has incredibly rough water on the outside (will never complain about Port Philip Bay again). Club Ventos has JP and Starboard. JP FSWs were the first boards to disappear off the racks in the morning. You had to be there at opening time to get one (together with the Germans and their towels dashing for the sunbeds).

Modern JP FSWs in pro construction (S-glass!), are chop eating machines. Personally, I think they are a bit overfinned, but that's what makes them better blasters. They are very easy to ride. The starboard freewave kodes feel like more all around boards, but definitely less "gunny".




jp fsw faster than kode?

is inbobard straps easier to ride for begginer?



Inboard straps help with the board control in choppy waters. A single strap at the back allows for easier foot steering.

25knts and up, I use a FSW - straps inboard
Up to 25 knts I use a freeride - straps out.

Faff
VIC, 633 posts
14 Mar 2019 8:35PM
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Select to expand quote
MagicRide said..
Thx Faff, I was wondering if that's what it was. So I wonder why a semi beginner would consider a fsw board? Aren't those more for experienced riders, or riders wanting to learn freestyle? Or, does a fsw board offer a semi beginner something that other boards don't? I know the fsw boards are more floaty in the back, is that a reason a beginner would want one?


FSW (or FW) boards are supposed to be jacks of all trades, according to their fans, and masters of none, according to their detractors. But even the detractors will concede that overall they are the best boards for handling chop. The guy who coached me in Jeri said they are the ideal Jeri board - wave jumping, wave riding, freestyle on the inside, blasting through the chop on the outside.

Different FSW boards emphasise different things... even boards of the same model, but different volume. You have to look at the outline and how much volume the board has in the tail, as well as the footstrap options. Some are faster in a straight line, some turn better, some have more volume in the tail for freestyle (early planing, popping the board). If you read the reviews on windsurf.co.uk, since they can never really criticise, they will emphasise the strengths of the board, so you can sort of work out what the board is geared towards.

As a rule, a FSW, will turn better than a free-ride, but will be stiffer than a wave board. It will be faster and go upwind better than a wave board, but slower than a freeride. It will pop better than a wave board, but definitely not as well as a freestyle. And they are definitely easier to ride than FS or wave boards.

One thing that I found was that whatever the brand, 92-95 sizes and up are freeridey and the smaller sizes turn better. Personally I think FSWs are 18+ knots boards. If it's less than that, get a freeride/freerace/slalom rather than a big FSW.

Gestalt
QLD, 11906 posts
14 Mar 2019 8:10PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Faff said..

Gestalt said..


ty Nubie said..




sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.






What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?





foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.



Jeri beach in Brazil has incredibly rough water on the outside (will never complain about Port Philip Bay again). Club Ventos has JP and Starboard. JP FSWs were the first boards to disappear off the racks in the morning. You had to be there at opening time to get one (together with the Germans and their towels dashing for the sunbeds).

Modern JP FSWs in pro construction (S-glass!), are chop eating machines. Personally, I think they are a bit overfinned, but that's what makes them better blasters. They are very easy to ride. The starboard freewave kodes feel like more all around boards, but definitely less "gunny".


i guess if the OP wants a board for Jeri then the JP will do the job well or he could even look for a wave board.

Is that what the OP is after?
Jeri is an open ocean wave spot where it howls consistently. 4.2-4.7 being pretty common sail sizes.

Gestalt
QLD, 11906 posts
14 Mar 2019 8:20PM
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Select to expand quote
Nubie said..

Faff said..


Gestalt said..



ty Nubie said..





sboardcrazy said..
Isonics aren't for learners. They are designed to go fast. I'd choose something else for chop.







What is biggiest problem in slalom board for bigginers ,footstraps on the edge?






foostraps on the rail,
hard rail extends to front strap or further
rails are fuller
finbox is usually tuttle


all of those things combine to create a board that is less forgiving.

in choppy water a more forgiving board is sometimes faster because you have more control to push the limits.

I would choose freeride over fsw for older model boards. Older model fsw boards were not a lot of fun to blast on because they were slow. In particular older jp fsw.

starboard have always had pretty good fsw blasting boards. The kode being an example.




Jeri beach in Brazil has incredibly rough water on the outside (will never complain about Port Philip Bay again). Club Ventos has JP and Starboard. JP FSWs were the first boards to disappear off the racks in the morning. You had to be there at opening time to get one (together with the Germans and their towels dashing for the sunbeds).

Modern JP FSWs in pro construction (S-glass!), are chop eating machines. Personally, I think they are a bit overfinned, but that's what makes them better blasters. They are very easy to ride. The starboard freewave kodes feel like more all around boards, but definitely less "gunny".



jp fsw faster than kode?

is inbobard straps easier to ride for begginer?


i would say no a JP fsw is not faster than a kode. the kodes been around a long time now. although the design has changed over the years it's always been a fast board.

inboard straps are better for beginners. less pressure on the fin. easier to get into because you need less balance and rig control.



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"FSW vs freeride for bigginer on chop?" started by Nubie