Forums > Land Yacht Sailing Sail making

Mad66 Sail mod

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Created by mad66 > 9 months ago, 7 Aug 2010
mad66
VIC, 57 posts
7 Aug 2010 9:12PM
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I have a Gasstra speed foil pro 3.9 sail that needs to be recut here's the pic fitted on the mast witch is a 430 cut down to 415 due to being stuck in a mast extension, the mast will be extended top or bottom i still don't know


Landyaght ,i have unpicked the mast pocket and this is the pic.


That was step 1, what is the next step LY.

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
7 Aug 2010 8:38PM
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do drawings as we speak but will post tommorrow

aus230
WA, 1659 posts
8 Aug 2010 1:06AM
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Just thought I would mention something you told me paul.

Run a straight stich up the pocket before unpicking the sail. certinaly makes things easier when reataching.
Cheers
aus230

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
8 Aug 2010 7:32PM
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That pocket was a big oversized one with lots of sail and cam parts inside , so it will have to be done once unpicked

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
8 Aug 2010 8:00PM
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Heres what ive got so far. The foot needs cutting off where the old pocket finished, or even 30mm below. first unpick the grey edging back to 25mm below the rear eye. The luff needs some recutting also. this is the bit where you get the set of measurements from the "recutting windsurfer sails" sticky thread.
you can either mark the curve onto the sail, or a cardboard template,or onto the driveway? . I draw all my sails full size on the back verandah
save all your offcuts, as you will be adding part of the offcut back onto the sail

nebbian
WA, 6277 posts
8 Aug 2010 8:48PM
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This one looks like it's got a fair bit of seam shaping, would you recommend flattening it out a bit Landyacht?

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
9 Aug 2010 7:35PM
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Wow how lucky for me the mast pocket did have a straight stitch all the way up exept for where the cam locks i think thats what there called enterd the pocket so when i resew i just need to but the sail upto the straight stitch and it will be aligned with the pocket

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
9 Aug 2010 7:56PM
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nebbian said...

This one looks like it's got a fair bit of seam shaping, would you recommend flattening it out a bit Landyacht?

Posted 06/09/2009, 5:43 pm
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

GIZMO SAYS ""

Yes, a standard sailboard sail has normally got quite a lot of "draft", "belly", "shape" all the different names used for the same thing, this will give you a lot of power but not huge amounts of speed where as a flatter sail will give you speed but not huge amounts of power.
Think about a tractor with lots of power but not much speed where as a F1 race car has speed but couldn't tow a load.
Often a fuller sail works to your advantage on a landyacht, if you sail on grass areas or soft sand you need more power to get you up and going, where as a hard surface like a salt lake, hard beach or sealed carpark you would be wanting a flatter sail to obtain the maxium speed posible.
Often yacht design and sail shape are dependant on your local sailing area.


Nebbian i think your right but the places i will be sailing to start with will be 90% grass so i'm thinking if there is a bit of "belly" in it that might be ok to get started,i have another sail that will look good on my yaght it is a tushingham 5.2 with good amount of top, when i learn a bit more about recutting and sewing sails i will attack this one here it is



landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
9 Aug 2010 7:42PM
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You are right on the money there mad66, that 3.9 will be a big wind sail when used on grass, the 5.2 will probably more used sail

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
15 Aug 2010 3:58PM
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A little confused i made a life size template as per instructions in the sail cut post but i am not sure how to use it correctly, suppose i cut the foot off 30 mm below where the pocket ends (as per pauls recomendation) do i use the foot of the template there and match up the top of the template to the top of my sail,i made the template to the full 4.5 metres and my sail will be about a metre short of that will that still give me the correct cut line for the luff ?

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
15 Aug 2010 8:00PM
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match it at the cut base and then run it up the sail, dont worry about the top.try to match it where you stopped unpicking the top of the pocket.
the full length template was designed to fit class 5 sails as well

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
16 Aug 2010 8:19PM
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Ok i'm sure i know whats going on there
Questions !
1: Should i cut the foot at 72` (L/B angle)?
2: Should i lower the foot cut at the luff so that the cut at the clew is below the bottom batten ?

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
16 Aug 2010 6:55PM
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have a look at where I put the dotted line on the drawing, I drew as many ogf the panels on as i could

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
2 Oct 2010 1:18PM
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Ok here goes the cut,laid sail out flat and refered to pauls drawing located the foot cut and drew the line where it was on the drawing this pic you can just see the line


Looked ok so went ahead and cut



Now for the luff. Laid template over sail so the bottom of the template matched the base cut then lined it up to where i stoped unpicking the mast sleave then drew the line along it looked ok so then cut it.


Only a small strip was removed from the luff edge.



So far happy with progress just have to figger out now the rest

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
2 Oct 2010 3:50PM
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time to do some work on the pocket. the bottom of the pocket will wnt to be wide enough to go around the mast. when doubled and laid flat allow 90mm for the pocket plus 15mm for the strip to be sewn. You might want to taper it towards th top. i wouldnt worry about the old boom hole, but you could fill it in . how heavy are the layers at the head where the pocket is still in place . it may be worth trialing the sewing machine there, and if it can sew it pull the rest of the pocket off to make it easier to sew

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
10 Oct 2010 7:27PM
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Landyaght ,Hi the mast pocket is cut and sewin at the leading edge at the top 1/4 of the sail to give it a bit of curve do i need to remove that curve and have the mast pocket
straight, and also are we going to get rid of the batton locks ?

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
10 Oct 2010 8:06PM
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I would have the mast pocket straight to the sail. cammed sails are really difficult to get to work on this type of rig.

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
14 Oct 2010 6:02PM
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I am starting to see what you mean about the fiddly bits when it comes to sails with batton cams the mast pocket in this one is a bit of a problem let me explain.

1/ The leading edge of the pocket tappers in at the top and bottom (refer top photo)and is sewin down the leading edge.

2/ To make a straight pocket i will have to cut off the leading edge and sew down the middle of the pocket instead of removing material from the edge.

3/ 4 zippers have to be removed where the cam locks used to be,other wise they will sit right on the front of the mast and end up wearing out the mast.

4/ to remove the pocket at the top of the sail will require the removal of the stainless eyelet,problem being i can't find where to get a 3/4 inch id eyelet tool ,the crappy cheap brass tarp eyelet tools are a joke.

5/ There is mono film sewin ino the pocket where the cam locks were to reduce where and will have to be removed.

So there is quite some work to do just on the mast pocket,Landyaght have you ever had a seam down the leading edge of a pocket and does anyone know where to get a desent eyelet tool?

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
15 Oct 2010 7:43PM
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happens all the time.
turn the pocket inside out, and stitch it up in 2 rows of straight stitch, rather than cutting the pocket, If your not happy with how it sits on the sail you can redo it. usually I just leave the zips in
now you know why i dont recommend cammed sails for recutting

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
16 Oct 2010 11:32AM
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landyacht said...

happens all the time.
turn the pocket inside out, and stitch it up in 2 rows of straight stitch, rather than cutting the pocket, If your not happy with how it sits on the sail you can redo it. usually I just leave the zips in
now you know why i dont recommend cammed sails for recutting


Sounds like a good plan to me LY thats what i will do ,is there an easy way of removing the eyelet and do you know a source for good eyelet tools

iand
QLD, 243 posts
16 Oct 2010 6:48PM
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Here's an alternative to an eyelet

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
18 Oct 2010 7:59PM
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Thanks iand ,as i have little clue as to what i'm doing with sails thats an option worth looking at i still can't find a eyelet tool,saw another option and that was to sew on some tape with a D ring

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
20 Oct 2010 8:05PM
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Cammed pocket rebuild
I thought i would show you some pics of the pocket work so far.

Starting with the top of the sail, to remove this pocket i will have to remove the eyelet


Using ball type grinding wheel on a drill it took a couple of minuites to
remove eyelet



The top and bottom tapes are sewin in like this





Here is the pocket ironed and laid flat so you can see the curves ,you can't see the taper in but can see where it's sewin at the top and bass of pocket.


mad66
VIC, 57 posts
28 Oct 2010 8:44PM
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HI guys been flat out and havn't had time to do whats needed

to be done, my yaght is almost finished and need to get cracking

on the sail ,anyway (this the is cool bit) when i cut the foot as

per Pauls drawing "have a look at where I put the dotted line on

the drawing, I drew as many ogf the panels on as i could "

I was thinking about his post on sail making

tp://www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Sail-making/How-I-recut-sailboard-sails-to-suit-landyachts/

and about the angle of cut on the sail see next pic


Well all i can say to that is wow you have an excellent eye, i pulled out the

sail to get it ready for some sewing and thought i would measure the angle

of th L/b cut and this is what i found



With his drawing and my interpritation of it the cut was 73 degrees thats amazing

Test pilot 1
WA, 1430 posts
28 Oct 2010 7:59PM
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Is it just "amazing" or could it even be "amazingly amazing" [}:)]

mad66
VIC, 57 posts
6 Nov 2010 9:17PM
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The piece that was cut off couldn't be directly sewn on it didn't fit so i had to
delaminate the pieces and recut them to suit the the original sail look.

This the part cut from the bottom of the sail



And the delamination process



There was 10 layers that needed to be unpicked to seperate all the pieces



Once it was all seperated i then arranged the pieces to fit the gap in the clew
also to reinforce the downhaul part of the sail,the mast pocket no pics sorry
was cut and with 3 strips left over was able to fill original boom hole i used
new strapping at base and top of sail as the old stuff was as stiff as as a board
the sewing machine that we(my mum) used was circa 1960's and it did a fair
job on the thin sections it realy struggled on the thick stuff 10 layers of sail and
2 layers of strapping we(mum) had to force the work under the foot of the machine.Any way this is how it turned out.


A couple of corner shots




And flip side







I think it looks ok just need to do a fitting that i will do tomorow see you soon.

Test pilot 1
WA, 1430 posts
6 Nov 2010 7:29PM
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Where would we be without our mums eh!
If it wasn't for my mum Landyacht would not have a sewing machine for his sail work.

landyacht
WA, 5921 posts
7 Nov 2010 8:46PM
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that is lookin so good. I think you will find on future sails that you dont need all 10 layers as we are not straining the sail as much as the windsurfers do. buy your mum a nice bottle of wine as a thanx , or dinner, , and flowers of course



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"Mad66 Sail mod" started by mad66