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evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
7 Oct 2008 7:43pm
Anyone got any insights into why it was so much? I think the RBA knows something we, and all the analysts, don't. I'm guessing commodity prices.

Personally I think it isn't even half way through yet, most of those sub-prime mortgages in the USA are yet to reset. Now there's Japan to add to the mix:
moneyweek.com/9353/what-is-the-carry-trade

I'm thinking of putting chickens in the back yard.

Edit:
If you bought $1000 of stock a year ago, you would now have:
- $91.28 if you bought Washington Mutual
- $37.50 if you bought Neomagic
- $21.29 if you bought Freddie Mac
- $20.79 if you bought Fannie Mae

But, if you had purchased $1,000 worth of beer one year ago, drank all the beer, then turned in the cans for the recycling REFUND... You would have $... 214.00 in cash.

So the best investment advice is to drink heavily and recycle.
wormy
wormy
QLD
679 posts
QLD, 679 posts
7 Oct 2008 6:50pm
Cause they are scared, very scared.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
7 Oct 2008 11:12pm
evlPanda said...

Anyone got any insights into why it was so much? I think the RBA knows something we, and all the analysts, don't. I'm guessing commodity prices.

Personally I think it isn't even half way through yet, most of those sub-prime mortgages in the USA are yet to reset. Now there's Japan to add to the mix:
www.moneyweek.com/investments/what-is-the-carry-trade.aspx



pretty sure it was a heavy handed apporach to see of a heavy handed recession.

subprime reset graph.
www.calculatedriskblog.com/2007/10/imf-mortgage-reset-chart.html

alan kohler suggested this over 6 months ago when he showed a graph on the abc news and basically said oh ****! he compared the problems in 2007 and then said now look at the amount of loans beng reset towards the end of 2008. actually alan is right a lot of the time.

i'm not sure about the commodities thing. completed infrastructure is meant to improve flow and increase exports. www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24382965-5005200,00.html
that may have changed now that most of western europe, newzealand, the USA are in recession and definately will if asia goes into recession.

i read an article today that the RBA cut was also aimed at protecting the asian markets. which seems to have a had some small positive effects.

i'm also thinking the rba cut is also linked to unemployment figures and retail spending. yet to be verified.

i'm glad the rate cut occurred and that it was fairly hefty. stevens was hand picked by costelloe so that gives me some confidence. but i do think rates went too high this year because things started stalling about 6 months ago

my guess is that next quarter we would have seen recession data released (unless of course we are already there) if the money market in australia wasn't kick started again. my guess would be another 50 points around xmas.

one thing is for sure. the ball is in labors court. lets hope they know what they are doing so we don't have to have another recession we had to have. at the moment i am wondering?

it's interesting that labor said that the banks could keep the rba reduction and turnbull said they should pass it all on. they passed on 80%.

www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,,24460951-2702,00.html

here is what labor said 2 weeks ago.
au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/mp/5041922/gillard-talks-depression-fears
BigFatMick
BigFatMick
273 posts
273 posts
7 Oct 2008 11:25pm
Invest in guns and ammo now, avoid the rush.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
8 Oct 2008 8:04am
BigFatMick said...

Invest in guns and ammo now, avoid the rush.


who will be the masters of the "war economy" ???? by by shrub
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
8 Oct 2008 2:02pm
evlPanda said...

Anyone got any insights into why it was so much? I think the RBA knows something we, and all the analysts, don't. I'm guessing commodity prices.

Personally I think it isn't even half way through yet, most of those sub-prime mortgages in the USA are yet to reset. Now there's Japan to add to the mix:
moneyweek.com/9353/what-is-the-carry-trade




panda, did you watch lateline + lateline business last night.

they explained a lot and said commodity based finances had taken a hit. ie. australia. they also said that was the reason the dollar took a dive.
Paradox
Paradox
QLD
1326 posts
QLD, 1326 posts
8 Oct 2008 3:11pm
evlPanda said...
Anyone got any insights into why it was so much?


Best effect and it was needed, the world markets are a different place to what they were a month or even a week or so ago. The RBA knew if they only did 50 points they would have to immediately back it up with at least another very soon and more.

The market was expecting 50 base points, if they did that it would have an effect, but not really divert peoples attention away from the current sentiment (and all markets are about sentiment). 50points would have been expected, noted and everyone focused back on the doom and gloom. But 100 points?? Different story - it shocked everyone, and may well have a much greater effect in turning around (or at least easing) negative sentiment than two 50's in rapid succession.

Great move IMO - shows they are forward and lateral thinkers.

The stingy banks are also a factor as the RBA knew they would not pass on the full cut....pricks, they should cut back on some CEO salaries first if they want to maintain their record profits.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
8 Oct 2008 9:27pm
here you go panda dude.

the man himself on 1% rate cut

www.abc.net.au/7.30/

click on the alan kohler interview.
evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
9 Oct 2008 12:02am
Gestalt said...

here you go panda dude.

the man himself on 1% rate cut

www.abc.net.au/7.30/

click on the alan kohler interview.


Cheers for that. The graph on the resets was very interesting. I guess now it's just a matter of waiting to see how insulated Australia is. Hopefully China has enough of its own momentum now to not have to rely on the US as much.

Looking at the graph again... holy ****! That's a very scary picture.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
12 Oct 2008 9:15am
i can't believe we have gone from being an economic super power to a bunch of followers.

I'm still waiting on pinky and perky to come up with a solution. any solution will do. enough of the media blitz saying we will be fine. clearly the potential for that not to be the case is huge. this will go down as the recession we weren't supposed to have.

it's not party politicing either. gordon brown has managed to show he is a real leader. currently the rest of the world, including the USA, is watching his lead. something we used to have with the former government that got us in 4th place on the world banking list.

for me labor's response in the media shows they got nothin. no solutions, no clues. they went from we will be uneffected, to we may experience some effects, to really bad, and now back to but we aren't going to have a recession.

blind freddie mac would be able to see the writing on the wall. markets have lost 40%, unemployment is on the rise, the asian markets are collapsing, half the western countries are in recession or technical recession. yet "australia will still be ok"

now mining is slowing too. china is beginning to try and cancel ore shipments from oz. this is what crucified australia during the great depression. commodities collapsed.

labor needs to pull finger and get it sorted.

what we need is more talk of solutions, plans, counter plans. hollow statements of she'll be right mate aren't really giving anyone confidence. (well, maybe one person)

how about they open up the purse and start spending some of the surplus, do what has been needed to be done after all other recessions and depressions. ie. start pumping money into the local markets via infrustructure and public works programs etc, get the money flowing by improving australia. change super to allow people to accelerate their mortgage repayments to reduce debt and first home buyers to access more funds as deposits etc.

evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
12 Oct 2008 1:17pm
Gestalt said...
how about they open up the purse and start spending some of the surplus, do what has been needed to be done after all other recessions and depressions. ie. start pumping money into the local markets via infrustructure and public works programs etc, get the money flowing by improving australia. change super to allow people to accelerate their mortgage repayments to reduce debt and first home buyers to access more funds as deposits etc.



They announced $20b infrastructure plans months ago, but...

"FEDERAL Labor's plan to fast-track its $20 billion infrastructure fund could be derailed by the Coalition, which is concerned the planned big spend could become a big slush fund."

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24442243-12377,00.html

I do agree though with the Libs though, caution needs to be shown. Infrastructure funds can be a big hole. Think of the French and the Panama Canal.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
12 Oct 2008 3:33pm
all true and bring it on i say!!!!!

however it will take months for this to flow through and the downturn started 12 months ago. edit** plus it was the states idea not K-Rud.....

i don't agree with turnbull trying to stop the bill. unfortunately i think he has been politicing a bit too much. my dream is that costelloe will return!!!!!!! one day

from what i understand the opposition rejected the bill because labor wanted to give the 20bil to a committee as a blank cheque and didn't actually tell anyone what it would be used for. edit*** you beat me to it. i think we sit on the same fence M

i hear perky has some announcements tonight. will be keen to hear what he hs to say.

libs announced another initiative today. saying increasing pension will have a positive effect.

this is the type of outcomes i am looking for. solutions that have multiple positive outcomes. pensions are clearly to low so this could be a win win situation.

as fas as infrestructure goes. why not start down the road to environmental recovery as well. make all new projects have a green bias.

ie. green power, green transport, green planning and so on.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
12 Oct 2008 4:33pm
i was emailed this today.

dunno if the facts are correct or not. an over view to market crashes. seems to be missing the asian market crash and the dotcom crash though.
funny to think i've already lived through 2 recessions that i can clearly remember and i'm not even 40 yet.


Widespread liquidity crises have been strangely absent in recent times, but they have a long and colourful history.

Aldous Huxley wrote that 'the charm of history and its enigmatic lesson consist in the fact that, from age to age, nothing changes and yet everything is completely different'.

The current credit crisis is certainly completely different from those that have gone before it. Never before have the world's financial institutions been so closely intertwined, and never before have there been dysfunctional markets in credit default swaps and speculators sitting at home gambling on contracts for difference over the internet. But it's the usual blend of greed and arrogance, and fear and panic, that have got us into this mess, and we'll need the usual bail-outs and blind faith to get us out of it. So we decided to trawl back through the history of banking panics and here's what we found.

The panic of 1819
Ever since people have been giving their savings to other people they've been anxious about getting it back, but we'll pick up the story in the early 19th Century, with the American panic of 1819. The US had been enjoying boom conditions in the aftermath of the War of 1812, as ever with an associated expansion of debt. But it all came to a shuddering halt in 1818 when the Bank of the United States started to rein in its lending in order to make repayments on overseas loans which had financed the 'Lousiana Purchase'.

The rush for cash caused a collapse in prices, and a brutal depression quickly followed, with staggering rates of unemployment: 75% in Philadelphia at its peak. But the depression seems to have raged so fiercely that it quickly burnt itself out, and by 1823, the economy was back on track.

The panic of 1837
The US suffered another major panic in 1837 after a boom financed largely from overseas, particularly the UK. Several factors then combined to tighten the money supply: US crop failures in 1835 and 1837; a directive from President Andrew Jackson that government agents should accept only 'specie' (that is gold and silver coins) in payment; and a reversal of money flows from the UK following a rise in interest rates by the Bank of England.

'What is wanted and what is necessary to stop a panic is to diffuse the impression, that though money may be dear, still money is to be had... Either shut the Bank at once ... or lend freely, boldly, and so that the public may feel you mean to go on lending.' Walter Bagehot, Lombard Street: A Description of the Money Market, 1873.

Businesses began to fail in April 1837 and by May there was outright panic, when every bank in New York stopped payment in specie. With the Second Bank of the United States (formed to finance the boom that led to the 1819 panic) having been scrapped by Andrew Jackson in 1836, and President Van Buren ideologically opposed to interfering in the business cycle, there was little to stem the flow. Ultimately almost half of America's banks went out of business and a severe depression followed, lasting until 1843.


Australian panics of the early 1800s
Australia suffered its own problems during this period. The Bank of NSW got into trouble after expanding its lending in the boom of the early 1820s, from £23,577 in 1820 to £95,408 in May 1826. A surge in imports then led to a severe shortage of coinage in the colony and the bank was forced to seek help from the NSW Governor in 1826 and 1828. On both occasions, confidence was restored by loans to the bank, alongside undertakings to reduce lending and rebuild capital.

The next serious episode in Australia came in 1843, when several banks failed following a boom in the 1830s and another surge in imports (of wheat following a severe drought in 1838-40). The largest victim was the Bank of Australia, but its depositors were repaid in full after a controlled liquidation. Fearing that it had lost money in Bank of Australia, depositors staged a run on the Savings Bank of NSW, but confidence was restored after the government guaranteed its deposits.

The 'founders' crash'
There were further panics in 1847 and 1866, centred in London, and in 1857 in the US, with the bursting of a speculative bubble in US railroads. But the next major global liquidity crisis began in May 1873 when several Viennese banks failed in the aftermath of the 'founders' crash' on the Vienna Stock Exchange. The crisis quickly spread throughout Europe, and in September it reached the US, where the banking system was already weakened by overinvestment in railways (again). The ensuing panic forced the closure of the New York Stock Exchange for ten days and marked the beginning of the 'Long Depression' of 1873-96.

There were several other notable panics in this period. In 1890, Barings Bank was bailed out by the Bank of England after investment losses in Argentina threatened it and the entire London banking system. (Of course Barings wasn't so lucky in 1995, when it was alone in its troubles after Nick Leeson's trading losses and the Bank of England allowed it to fall.) And in 1893 it was railways again, when the collapse of the Philadelphia and Reading Railroad in February sparked a series of bank runs. In the credit contraction that followed, 15,000 companies and 500 banks failed in the US, pushing the unemployment rate up into the high teens.

In Australia, a combination of drought and the bursting of the 1880s real estate bubble led to a collapse in confidence in 1892, particularly in Victoria. The Associated Banks of Victoria (constituted in 1877 as the banks undertaking government banking business in the state) issued a statement in March 1892 that its members would offer each other mutual support. But it went back on its word by allowing its smallest member, the Federal Bank, to fail in January 1893. Unsurprisingly, this undermined confidence and prompted runs on the remaining members. At the height of the panic, banks counting for 56% of Australia's deposits were forced to suspend operations.

The Bankers' Panic of 1907
If you feel mad at the overpaid bankers for the current crisis, spare a thought for those affected by the US 'bankers' panic' of 1907, which resulted from an attempt by Otto Heinze and Charles Morse to corner the market in United Copper shares and force a 'bear squeeze'.

'If people will keep their money in the banks, everything will be all right.' John Pierpont Morgan, 24 October 1907.



The scheme failed and so did its backers. Serves them right, you might say; and you'd be right. But the crisis then spread to other institutions that were guilty only by association, including the unfortunately named Knickerbocker Trust Company. The Knickerbocker's collapse sparked a major panic and other trusts started dropping like flies. The US didn't have a central bank at the time and the crisis was instead resolved by the original J P Morgan, who was able to organise a concerted operation to restore confidence.

The Great Depression
As ever, it's hard to be sure about which is the chicken and which the egg, but the Great Depression began with the crash in 1929 and the contraction of credit that followed. The general contraction was marked by four heightened panics in the US, three in 1930-1 and an outlier in 1933, when various states, and then the national government, declared 'bank holidays' to give banks time to demonstrate their creditworthiness (or otherwise). The plan backfired, as depositors rushed to withdraw funds from their banks before they too were given holidays.

'As the Commonwealth Bank has control of the note issue, it can command resources in the form of currency to any extent which in the opinion of the Bank Board is deemed necessary... I am authorised by the Prime Minister, Mr Scullin, to say that his government will support the Bank Board in any measure which it deems advisable to take... The bank will never close its doors, so long as the nation itself stands!' Robert Gibson, Commonwealth Bank chairman, 3 May 1931.



The Great Depression affected the whole world, as Europe and America pulled their money home, and Australia was no exception, but the nation's banking system proved relatively resilient. The most notable panic surrounded the failure of the Government Savings Bank of NSW (GSBNSW). Confidence was knocked in February 1931 when the NSW Treasury defaulted on its bonds (of which the GSBNSW was the largest holder), and the bank was forced to suspend payments in April.

The shock prompted runs on other savings banks, but calm appears to have been restored following assurances in a radio broadcast by the chairman of the Commonwealth Bank.

The 1973-5 credit crisis
The last serious liquidity crisis, in 1973-5, bore a particular similarity to the current situation because it was associated with a commodities boom and a sharp rise in the price of oil - on top of the traditional debt binge in the preceding few years.

After the 1971 collapse of the Bretton Woods Accord - which linked the world's currencies to the US dollar and therefore, theoretically, gold - money supply had surged around the world, leading to a commodity price boom and a sharp bout of inflation. Between January 1971 and January 1975, the price of gold jumped from US$38 to US$177, but that was nothing compared to oil which, with supply disrupted by the Yom Kippur War and the resulting Arab oil embargo, leapt from US$3 to almost US$12 in six months from October 1973 and March 1974.

International debt markets became tight during the northern summer of 1973, but the crisis reached a peak in the UK in November, with the failure of London and County Securities. This sparked a series of insolvencies among London's 'secondary' banks - the equivalent of 'sub-prime' mortgage lenders at the time.

In December, with rumours abounding that the crisis was set to move to the major banks, with NatWest in particular said to be at risk, the Bank of England organised a 'lifeboat' package, in which it gave assistance to some sixty institutions, apparently at a cost of around £100m. This action stemmed the flow of insolvencies in London, but during 1974 the crisis spread around the world, with the US's Franklin National Bank going under in October.

Australia in the 1970s
In Australia, the collapse of property developers - notably Cambridge Credit in September 1974 - prompted runs on building societies across the nation, with the Hindmarsh Building Society in South Australia most severely hit. After assurances that the Reserve Bank would stand behind any banks providing liquidity to soundly managed building societies, the National Australia Bank stepped in to help Hindmarsh, but soon it too was short of cash.

Calm was eventually restored when the South Australian Premier, Don Dunstan, spoke to queuing customers outside the Hindmarsh's offices, assuring them that their funds were safe. However, problems among building societies continued for several years, with a number of failures, including the optimistically named Queensland Permanent Building Society in 1977.

The 1980s/90s and the current crisis
The 1980s boom caused problems all over the world, in the form of the Savings and Loans Crisis in the US and 'corporate cowboys' such as Alan Bond and Christopher Skase in Australia. But although numerous 'thrifts' failed in the US (747 of them, apparently) and several banks needed rescuing in Australia - notably the State Bank of Victoria and the State Bank of South Australia - there was no widespread panic and no threat to the overall financial system.

And that brings us to the current crisis, which is the same as all those that have gone before, but at the same time completely different. The major new ingredient this time around seems to be the degree to which the global financial system has become interdependent, but we've also never before seen the same level of concerted intervention by the world's central banks.

History suggests that the odds of escaping unscathed from a major credit contraction aren't good, but then the sharemarket already seems to be discounting a serious recession - even if the nation's economists generally aren't. Of course, history also shows that there will be an eventual recovery, and the market will also no doubt factor that in long before it appears. Quite where we lie on that path at the moment, however, is anybody's guess.
evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
12 Oct 2008 9:22pm
Prior to reading your post: Bloody hell, Is that a record?
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
12 Oct 2008 9:01pm
evlPanda said...

Prior to reading your post: Bloody hell, Is that a record?


impressive record hey.

have you seen perky's (k-rud) interview on 7.30 report i only just saw it.... says it all really, and kerry grills him.

www.abc.net.au/7.30/

click on krud interview.

if you want a good laugh let it keep playing for the clarke and daw parody.....
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
13 Oct 2008 6:57pm
does the dead cat bounce
evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
14 Oct 2008 12:35am
General Note: Easy money, ie liquidity, got us here in the first place, I'm not convinced it is going to get us out. Everything is simply deleveraging. It won't go (far) past 1:1.

____

Kerry O'Brien: What advice do you have for people who feel they are at the mercy of the markets?

WTF? How the hell can he answer that? People ARE at the mercy of the markets. He might as well ask what advice does he have for the terminally ill. Kerry Brian -1

____

General Note: If Australian banks have been lending out just a little too easy, and they certainly have the past 8 years or so, is it a) the essence of the free market b) lack of government regulation? It's the old left and right again really, you could say both a & b, which is interesting.

____

Kerry O'Brien: Private debt levels are far greater than they were going into and during the '29 great depression. That must worry you.

Translation: Many people have been too greedy (or optimistic?) and are in over their heads. Looks like the **** is gonna hit the fan! Are you worried people (like me, EP) will place some/all of the blame for their greed and incompetence on you? -1

Rudd: Thank god for the surplus!

Personally: I'm running to Russia if it gets too bad. $100b surplus and mortgages are a rare, exotic thing. It's all cash baby! yasno.media/

____

Kerry O'Brien (translation): House prices are going to fall, aren't they? Fear sells programs like mine so please Prime Minister tell us where you think house prices are going. -2

Rudd: <watches Kerry swing wildly into air where Rudd once was> I can't give you a prediction for house prices (you idiot). +2

We've got a completely inept and ill conceived house saver plan that is like pissing on a ... well like pissing on a house on fire. -1

blah blah, working families, blah -1

____

General Note: House prices = Supply/demand. I don't know.

____

General Note: Can somebody gag O'Brien? No really. This interview is being watched by people, not mums and dads, who are considering where to park what's left of their planets of money in what is amounting to a financial core meltdown. A lot of it is about having confidence in a country, and O'Brien is trying his best to get the Prime Minister to say we are screwed. These interviews end up all across the world of media. Nice one O'Brien, you're trying to fook us all over. -10

____

On a big enough scale it kind of all boils down to left and right wing doesn't it? The right gets given too much freedom, becomes a little greedy, which is just natural a human trait after all, then the left has to come and bail them out, which is what the left is really all about anyway, picking up the pieces. You go too far left and you get this horrible mob mentality, too far right and it's all about me, me, me. You're damned if you do, and damned if you don't. It's a game you can't win and you can't leave. I'd hate to be in politics.

Fook it dude, let's go bowling.






















Pugwash
Pugwash
WA
7733 posts
WA, 7733 posts
14 Oct 2008 11:25am
Gestalt said...

does the dead cat bounce


Apparently, yes....
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
14 Oct 2008 10:18pm
Gestalt said...

woohoo!!!! we now have solutions. nice one.


i reckon you're a little harsh on O'brien mate. he is a top notch journalist. very fair and impartial. he's grilled all sides of politics. i thought you could see his frustration as rud did another interview which lacked any content and gave no solutions.

evlPanda said...

General Note: Easy money, ie liquidity, got us here in the first place, I'm not convinced it is going to get us out. Everything is simply deleveraging. It won't go (far) past 1:1.

yeah, i'm not convinced either but i am convinced it was US regulation that got us here.

this is what rud could have said.

Kerry O'Brien: What advice do you have for people who feel they are at the mercy of the markets?

WTF? How the hell can he answer that? People ARE at the mercy of the markets. He might as well ask what advice does he have for the terminally ill. Kerry Brian

well like this maybe.

Rud : As a governement we are focused on protecting australia by stimulating markets within our own borders. our view is that the previous governments tight fiscal regulations and our own surplus increases have put us in a very good position to see that australia doesn't move into recession.

although we are all in some way tied to the markets our surplus allows us to invest in australia to help minimise the predicted unemployment which can sometimes results from market crashes.

to do this we will.

a. increase the pension
b. re-introduce the first home buyers grant
c. provide green building and development grants to the private sector.
d. provide hybrid automobile rebates to buyers to stimulate the automobile sector
e. reduce taxes
f. encourage the banking sector to pass on all rba cuts.
g. spend on green transport infrastructure
h. spend on green power infrastructure.
i increase spending on educational infrastructure
j. change super regs to allow part super to be payed into mortgages
h. provide grants for low cost housing schemes.

we believe all of these outcomes will positively contribute to the opportunities a global downturn can present us with.


____

General Note: If Australian banks have been lending out just a little too easy, and they certainly have the past 8 years or so, is it a) the essence of the free market b) lack of government regulation? It's the old left and right again really, you could say both a & b, which is interesting.

c) the responsibility of the RBA to increase and decrease rates to control these things and the responsibility of government to regulate as a precurser.

Kerry O'Brien: Private debt levels are far greater than they were going into and during the '29 great depression. That must worry you.

Translation: Many people have been too greedy (or optimistic?) and are in over their heads. Looks like the **** is gonna hit the fan! Are you worried people (like me, EP) will place some/all of the blame for their greed and incompetence on you? -

Rudd: Thank god for the surplus!

or yes it does worry me as the leader of this country. However we are in a fortunate position as our banks are stable and we have a surplus. we can use the surplus to stimulate our economy with the plan outlayed previously, the big issue here is unemployment. for an analogy, the crash was the earthquake and the unemployment the psunami. Our focus is fiscale stimulation which will help decrease the unemployment and help the average australian to keep there home.

Personally: I'm running to Russia if it gets too bad. $100b surplus and mortgages are a rare, exotic thing. It's all cash baby! yasno.media/


Kerry O'Brien (translation): House prices are going to fall, aren't they? Fear sells programs like mine so please Prime Minister tell us where you think house prices are going. -2

Rudd: <watches Kerry swing wildly into air where Rudd once was> I can't give you a prediction for house prices (you idiot).

or - We've got a completely inept and ill conceived house saver plan that is like pissing on a ... well like pissing on a house on fire so to resolve this we have decided to copy the rest of the world and introduce all of the measures the the opposition has come up with.

____

General Note: House prices = Supply/demand. I don't know.

____

General Note: Can somebody gag O'Brien? No really. This interview is being watched by people, not mums and dads, who are considering where to park what's left of their planets of money in what is amounting to a financial core meltdown. A lot of it is about having confidence in a country, (and that confidence comes from a solid leadership)and O'Brien is trying his best to get the Prime Minister to say we are screwed. (or to answer the basic questions people have that will give them more confidence when they hear the government is addressing them) These interviews end up all across the world of media. Nice one O'Brien, you're trying to fook us all over.

____

On a big enough scale it kind of all boils down to left and right wing doesn't it? The right gets given too much freedom, becomes a little greedy, which is just natural a human trait after all, then the left has to come and bail them out, which is what the left is really all about anyway, picking up the pieces. You go too far left and you get this horrible mob mentality, too far right and it's all about me, me, me. You're damned if you do, and damned if you don't. It's a game you can't win and you can't leave. I'd hate to be in politics.

for me it's more about policy. good on labor for finally unveiling a solution.

Fook it dude, let's go bowling.



Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14968 posts
QLD, 14968 posts
14 Oct 2008 10:21pm
Pugwash said...

Gestalt said...

does the dead cat bounce


Apparently, yes....


that would mean it's going down again then.
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