Forums > General Discussion   Shooting the breeze...

Apprenticeship, am I too old?

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Created by SuperPoop > 9 months ago, 29 Jan 2013
SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
29 Jan 2013 9:07PM
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Yes. I'm asking a half cereal question on seabreeze.
But surely there'd be some blokes on here in the know with apprenticeships.

It finally hit me today that retail is not something I want to be doing for the rest of my life. As I'm sure a lot of people come to realize.

But I've just turned 20 last week. I've always assumed most apprentices were either 16 year olds that finished up school in year ten, or fresh out of school 18 year olds.

Am I to old at 20? Would a tradie be willing to take me on at 20? I assume I'd cost more then a 16/18 year old?


Itch
NSW, 107 posts
29 Jan 2013 10:15PM
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Hi SuperPoop,

No you are not too old and you would be paid the same as any first year apprentice. If you are really serious go enrole yourself at Tafe and do a pre apprenticeship course in the trade of your choice until you can secure an apprenticeship.

Zuke
901 posts
29 Jan 2013 7:16PM
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Never too old. The pay is a percentage of a tradies which is quite low for a first year so you will have to ask yourself if you can live on it.

Scotty88
4214 posts
29 Jan 2013 7:27PM
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When I read the tile, I thought you must be 30+.
Are you kidding me when you say 20 is too old ?
An employer would generally prefer a 20 year old for the maturity over a 16 year old. I left year 12 after repeating year 11 so I was 18 & 1/2 when I started my apprenticeship and I needed the additional 3 years to mature.
You may need a night job to compensate the year 1 wages though.
Good luck.

62mac
WA, 24860 posts
29 Jan 2013 7:35PM
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Good advice already given,24/25 and your a tradesmen go for it mate but hook up with a good company and strive to be the best they have ever signed on.Give it your all and the rewards will come,think long and hard about which trade tho,I did the trade thing which was all good until China smashed our trade,saw many a good company go under

Sailhack
VIC, 5000 posts
29 Jan 2013 10:47PM
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I know a guy that left retail (retravision) at 25 and did his carpentry apprenticeship with a mate. Turned out to be a great chippy and asset to his boss. Go for it mate!

SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
29 Jan 2013 9:57PM
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I knew there'd be some knowledgeable folks on here. But boy do I feel like a dumbass now.

I'd love to be a carpenter, but I was ****house at woodwork in school.

Supersonic27
NSW, 235 posts
29 Jan 2013 11:10PM
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I was a postie and at 26 did a pre apprenticeship in carpentry and joinery. Never looked back. Had my builders license about 5 year later.

You are paid a little more than a 16 year old as you are an adult, so minimum wages comes into it.

And at that age, if you are going to do it, don't aim too low, keep going while you are young and use it as a stepping stone......it just gets harder when you are older....believe me I know from experience!

gazman2
VIC, 112 posts
29 Jan 2013 11:49PM
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I am 42 and just starting my second year as a apprentice chef.This will be my second apprenticeship did my first apprenticeship when i was 18.Nothing has changed ,schools the same ,and you get paid **** money.but it will be worth it in the long run.hopefully

Simon100
QLD, 490 posts
29 Jan 2013 11:29PM
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i have a mate who stated one at 27 , 20 is nothing . Just pick one that pays well and that wont be anything to do with cars . Dont stress if your not good at the trade you want to do i know alot of people that suck at there trade and still have jobs and im sure you will figure it out if you try .

cisco
QLD, 12072 posts
30 Jan 2013 2:51AM
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If you are going to do an apprenticeship, pick a trade in which you will most likely in your lifetime ever be replaced by a machine.

Fitting and machining is a highly technical trade but fitter/machinists, particularly machinists are a dime a dozen these days. To earn his keep a machinist needs to be a computer whizz as well.

Any decent fitter can out plumb a plumber but the plumber gets paid more.

Motor mechanics are charged out at $100/hour but the guy is lucky to get $20 out of the $100 and then taxed.

More often than not today low skilled people (eg operaters) get paid much more than high skilled people (eg maintainers).

Where is the justice and pay margin for skill??

Do I sound like a disgruntled fitter and machinist. That is what I am and that is why I got out of it and made my fortune in real estate (commission only) and my investments.

True salesmanship cannot be replaced by a computer program or machine.

Once you have learnt how to make money, you can do anything else in life that you want.

Beaglebuddy
1595 posts
30 Jan 2013 3:40AM
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Yes you can be too old but you are not too old at all. I started as a plumber & HVAC tech at 22 after military service, I'm now 49 and it's been a great profession.
Carpentry is not the best trade to learn IMHO, there are heaps of them and it's hard on the body as you get older.
Something more technical is better, look into being a plumber, electrician or HVAC tech.
Just look at the wage scales, the lowest paying trades will involve less thinking and be harder on the body.

SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
30 Jan 2013 3:43PM
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You guys have given me the kick in the ass I needed.

Does anyone know anything about doing a trade through the army. Would they then require me to become a soldier and enter combat? Or are they two different areas?

japie
NSW, 6398 posts
30 Jan 2013 5:55PM
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Bechtel were, don't know if they still are, taking on mature age apprentices at $32 an hour plus penalties in Gladstone Their next big project is in Darwin.

dantren
QLD, 199 posts
30 Jan 2013 5:01PM
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You are definitely not too old....
I tried the Navy application thing. Thankfully i failed the first interview on medical grounds and cause I couldn't name any battleships. Only consider the forces if you LOVE discipline. Then i started my HVAC time at 21. From memory I was paid a little extra on top of the measly wage. Do a search for mature age apprenticeships.......?
Did my 4 years and went out on my own, 10 years of successful small business later I'm pretty much unemployable. There is no way I could go back to employee status. The freedom is superb.
The most important thing is to do somthing you enjoy. The skills will come....

Gorgo
VIC, 4669 posts
30 Jan 2013 6:25PM
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Just thinking out loud on the subject:

- Are you too old? At 20? You're not even fully grown and your brain is only half formed. What are you talking about. There are people who have started trades in their 50's (although they had earned their money by then).

- Crap at wood work at school? School doesn't teach much of any use when you're working, especially in trades. The apprenticeship and the time after is when you really learn stuff.

- What to do? Dunno. You want something where you have to go and do it so it can't be outsourced to another country. You want something essential (electrician, plumber). You want something relatively clean (no asbestos, no dust or other toxic chemicals). The rest is up to you.

I have some mates who have done apprenticeships but now live in big houses and drive nice cars and have nice toys:
- install TV antennas and computer cabling
- joins fibre optic cable
- installs process automation technology
- my nephew is a mechanic but now he works for Porsche doing quality control. That is a cool job.

pierrec45
NSW, 2005 posts
30 Jan 2013 11:45PM
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If you're too old at 20yo, our society is in deep s@#t.

There was an article after the 2011 census describing the new phenom of a big demographics 20-25yo, not working, not at Uni, not on the dole, just no nothing. Prob. living in mom's basement.

For the first few years, you're on a par with the younger guys, then it's your drive that will take over. See it was an investment with a mid-term ROI, go for it !

mineral1
WA, 4564 posts
30 Jan 2013 8:59PM
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SuperPoop said...
You guys have given me the kick in the ass I needed.

Does anyone know anything about doing a trade through the army. Would they then require me to become a soldier and enter combat? Or are they two different areas?


"DONT!!!!!!!"
You will be far better off doing an adult trade in civy street. I was in and tried to go down same parth. What a bloody wast of time. In the end, got out, did a heavy duty plant trade. Havn't looked back since
As the crew highlighted, sign up for pre-apprentiship at TAFE, get stuck in, and this years intake, you will be plumb for a start.
Oh, and ex green machine lads, when I hire them into our field, 90% struggled big time.

tgladman
WA, 500 posts
30 Jan 2013 9:29PM
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Definitely not too old. My apprentice carpenter just finished a 3 year apprenticeship and he's 34! -And older than me. Haha!

SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
31 Jan 2013 6:40PM
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Sorry to keep this thread going..

But I went into my local tafe today and sussed out what courses they do. These are all pre-apprenticeships.
Cert 1 in construction/ White card.
Cert 1 in engineering
Cert 1 in auto electrical
Cert 1 in auto mechanic
Cert 1 in heavy auto mechanic
Cert 2 in electrotechnology

I'm leaning towards the cert 1 in construction, but the bloody thing starts on the 4th of feb.

Gizmo
SA, 2840 posts
31 Jan 2013 7:32PM
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And the problem is ???????
If your working days, do night classes. Most TAFE colleges do nights.
Construction Industry white card is BASIC OH&S stuff.

SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
31 Jan 2013 7:09PM
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No problem. I'm actually extremely keen.
It just states that the next available intake is on the 4th feb. So I think I may be alittle late

ok
NSW, 904 posts
31 Jan 2013 8:35PM
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i suggest you go and do some labouring on a building site before you start anything.
Also make sure you have very thick skin for the abuse and **** you will cop at work.
Its not always as dreamy as you expect it is going to be! As for today im a carpenter and the worst thing was i got a sunburnt nose.

Surfer62
1357 posts
31 Jan 2013 6:03PM
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Too old, no !

I started apprenticeship at 16 stuck at it for 9 years then started a completely different career at 25 and still there.

I wish I had the following advice when I was 20 !

Ladies and Gentlemen of the class of 2013

If I could offer you only one tip for the future, sunscreen would be it. The long term benefits of sunscreen have been proved by scientists whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable
than my own meandering experience…I will dispense this advice now.

Enjoy the power and beauty of your youth; oh nevermind; you will not understand the power and beauty of your youth until they have faded. But trust me, in 20 years you'll look back at photos of yourself and recall in a way you can't grasp now how much possibility lay before you and how fabulous you really looked….You're not as fat as you imagine.

Don't worry about the future; or worry, but know that worrying is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing bubblegum.

The real troubles in your life are apt to be things that never crossed your worried mind; the kind that blindside you at 4pm on some idle Tuesday.

Do one thing everyday that scares you,

Sing

Don't be reckless with other people's hearts, don't put up with people who are reckless with yours.

Floss

Don't waste your time on jealousy; sometimes you're ahead, sometimes you're behind…the race is long, and in the end, it's only with yourself.

Remember the compliments you receive, forget the insults; if you succeed in doing this, tell me how.

Keep your old love letters, throw away your old bank statements.

Stretch

Don't feel guilty if you don't know what you want to do with your life…the most interesting people I know didn't know at 22 what they wanted to do with their lives, some of the most interesting 40 year
olds I know still don't.

Get plenty of calcium.

Be kind to your knees, you'll miss them when they're gone.

Maybe you'll marry, maybe you won't, maybe you'll have children,maybe you won't, maybe you'll divorce at 40, maybe you'll dance the funky chicken on your 75th wedding anniversary…

what ever you do, don't congratulate yourself too much or berate yourself either – your choices are half chance, so are everybody else's.

Enjoy your body, use it every way you can…don't be afraid of it, or what other people think of it, it's the greatest instrument you'll ever
own..

Dance…even if you have nowhere to do it but in your own living room.

Read the directions, even if you don't follow them.

Do NOT read beauty magazines, they will only make you feel ugly.

Get to know your parents, you never know when they'll be gone for good. Be nice to your siblings; they are the best link to your past and the people most likely to stick with you in the future.

Understand that friends come and go,but for the precious few you should hold on.

Work hard to bridge the gaps in geography and lifestyle because the older you get, the more you need the people you knew when you were young.

Live in Melbourne once, but leave before it makes you hard; live in Sydney once, but leave before it makes you soft.

Travel.

Accept certain inalienable truths, prices will rise, politicians will philander, you too will get old, and when you do you'll fantasize that when you were young prices were reasonable, politicians were
noble and children respected their elders.

Respect your elders.

Don't expect anyone else to support you. Maybe you have a trust fund, maybe you have a wealthy spouse; but you never know when either one might run out.

Don't mess too much with your hair, or by the time you're 40, it will look 85.

Be careful whose advice you buy, but, be patient with those who supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the
ugly parts and recycling it for more than it's worth.

But trust me on the sunscreen…



frothman
9 posts
31 Jan 2013 7:08PM
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first post on seebreeze here
mate if you have any mechanical aptitude approach a shipping company and ask for a marine engineering cadetship
there is a huge shortage of marine engineers in this country and at the same time a huge demand
i did it the hard way,first an apprenticeship as a fiiter/turner the 20 years slugging it out at sea and studying to get the ticket i have now
get a cadetship and you basicly walk out of there 4 years later with a ticket which enables you to travel the world have plenty of time off and get ****loads of cash.
teekay shipping are advertising for cadets now
squires,shell,p&o,faastad,etc all screaming for marine engineers and cant find any
good luck,
20 to old ?,**** me i'm in my 40's and still think i could take on another career once i get bored with my current job

fingerbone
NSW, 921 posts
31 Jan 2013 10:08PM
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I am a tradie roofer..Last year I started TAFE part time evenings,Its twice a week for 3 hrs a night and after 2 years you are a fully qual chippy. TAFE doesnt advertise the fact that after 2yrs part time you can actually contract ( and I think it is wrong ) however you could keep your job and do TAFE whilst looking for an apprenticeship, its sure to be a big foot in the door.
Prior experience is not necessary and the course i am in had people drop out and newbies joining all the way to late April.
Carpentry or any building trade is great even if you dont do it all your life you always have something to fall back on if needed.
Cheers Billy.

dinsdale
WA, 1227 posts
31 Jan 2013 7:46PM
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One of my sons in law has just begun his 2nd year as a heavy diesel fitter with Westrac Cat. He's 32, he loves it and they love him. Top o' the class all the way so far, out of a 119 in his intake.

zarb
NSW, 603 posts
1 Feb 2013 10:03PM
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You asked earlier if the Army idea was a good idea.

Yes it is.

You can join off the street with no trade experience, just have to pass some easy questions and a medical test. Then you do the same recruit training as everyone else (which is a **** load of fun).

After that you a couple of years of trade training depending on the trade you want to do and bam you're fully qualified with the civilian credentials.

Yes you have to then be a full time defence employee. 7 years including all your training. No you don't really go on to the front lines. That's what grunts are for


You will have a blast in the military. You can do some awesome courses all throughout your career, your superiors will always make a massive effort to get you follow up training, even training you in things not relevant to your trade (driving the 4wds and Army trucks are sweet).
The time they give you for sport is a sweet deal. You can join up to any of the Army sporting teams and they give you time off work to go overseas and around Aus to compete.
You meet tonnes of interesting people and make lots of friends for life.

In summary... go for it. Can't recommend it enough.

Gateman
QLD, 407 posts
1 Feb 2013 10:16PM
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Here's my story:
Age 20 - waiter in restaurant working up to manager of 490 seat place by 26(hated working at night)
Age 26-28 worked in sales, mostly business to business (got bored, not for me)
Age 28-35 worked in marine industry all over the world (wanted kids and shore based life but loved it)
Age 35-41 worked for gate company, now own my own business doing servicing and repairs to automatic gates (great freedom for extra activities and family life but if I'm not working I'm not earning)
Age 42- only just turned 41 so not there yet but who knows......

Go for the trade mate, I investigated a mature age apprenticeship in ship building a few years ago but could not support a wife and 2 kids on the first year wages. Would have done it if I could.

Cheers

dinsdale
WA, 1227 posts
2 Feb 2013 3:17PM
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zarb said...
You asked earlier if the Army idea was a good idea.

Yes it is.

You can join off the street with no trade experience, just have to pass some easy questions and a medical test. Then you do the same recruit training as everyone else (which is a **** load of fun).

After that you a couple of years of trade training depending on the trade you want to do and bam you're fully qualified with the civilian credentials.

Yes you have to then be a full time defence employee. 7 years including all your training. No you don't really go on to the front lines. That's what grunts are for


You will have a blast in the military. You can do some awesome courses all throughout your career, your superiors will always make a massive effort to get you follow up training, even training you in things not relevant to your trade (driving the 4wds and Army trucks are sweet).
The time they give you for sport is a sweet deal. You can join up to any of the Army sporting teams and they give you time off work to go overseas and around Aus to compete.
You meet tonnes of interesting people and make lots of friends for life.

In summary... go for it. Can't recommend it enough.

Absolutely!! Only I'd suggest the RAAF if you're not so much into dust and flies. If I'd known then what I know I'd still be there.

SuperPoop
QLD, 73 posts
2 Feb 2013 6:19PM
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I'm to much of a pussy for the army. I'd probably break down and cry on the first day.

I ended up putting my name down for a pre-apprenticeship through skillstech Australia. Went with the certificate 1 in construction. Just have to wait for it to start in July now.

Thanks for all the help guys.



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Forums > General Discussion   Shooting the breeze...


"Apprenticeship, am I too old?" started by SuperPoop