Where's the Assange thread?

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NotWal
NotWal
QLD
7436 posts
QLD, 7436 posts
11 Dec 2010 11:47pm
Why isn't there one? Was it expunged?
ginger pom
ginger pom
VIC
1746 posts
VIC, 1746 posts
12 Dec 2010 2:20am
there should be one...

nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
11 Dec 2010 11:34pm
I could tell you that the FBI asked us to delete it, but then they'd kill me.
sausage
sausage
QLD
4874 posts
QLD, 4874 posts
12 Dec 2010 2:31am
nebbian said...

I could tell you that the FBI asked us to delete it, but then they'd kill me.


Nebs,
You must be getting worried that should something happen to Julien then Wikileaks will release the doomsday file with all those GPSTC confidential cables between you and Hardie.
busterwa
busterwa
3782 posts
3782 posts
12 Dec 2010 12:44am
lol proud to Australian!@
dudes a legend set it up well.
people power .. terrorist maybe? dont think so.This guy can rewrite the internet
unfortunately for the government he has to much support now of everyday people .. he know he is expendable
good to see his followers target greedy banks.
www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au/nocookies?a=A.flavipes
j murray
j murray
SA
947 posts
SA, 947 posts
12 Dec 2010 9:44am

He is placing the big "A" in ustralia, creating more good vibes

Than OPRAH ???. He must be supported by us all. or we go under.
Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
12 Dec 2010 10:22am
It was bad to see Gillard and co go off at him and basically cast him adrift. You could expect such a reaction from Howard and Downer but Gillard should have known better. Then we realise she is beholden to the same power groups and lobbyists that affect all politicians besides ones like Mark Latham.

The released leaks haven't really said much thats not already known. Rudd is a micro manager who fails to consult, does not take advice and fails to achieve results. American foreign policy is based on group think and Mossad counter intelligence. The people in power are pettier and meaner than the average citizen.

japie
japie
NSW
7146 posts
NSW, 7146 posts
12 Dec 2010 12:23pm
I have let it go until now in case the New Seabreeze Order deemed that any talk of Wikileaks sailed close to conspiracy. However there seems to be a fair bit of support for what they are trying to achieve.

I am still "out" as to whether there is some nefarious organisation and objective behind Wikilieaks.

That said I have put my name to this petition: http://www.getup.org.au/campaign/Wikileaks&id=1489

It seems to be a very worthy thing to do but that is obviously up to the individual.
NotWal
NotWal
QLD
7436 posts
QLD, 7436 posts
12 Dec 2010 5:22pm
Mobydisc said...

It was bad to see Gillard and co go off at him and basically cast him adrift. You could expect such a reaction from Howard and Downer but Gillard should have known better. Then we realise she is beholden to the same power groups and lobbyists that affect all politicians besides ones like Mark Latham.

The released leaks haven't really said much thats not already known. Rudd is a micro manager who fails to consult, does not take advice and fails to achieve results. American foreign policy is based on group think and Mossad counter intelligence. The people in power are pettier and meaner than the average citizen.




I have to agree. Julia's lack of political acumen in this instance was staggering. Julia, Julia, Julia, what were you thinking (face palm), hanging a countryman out to dry, dumping on a folk hero, spitting on free speech. The more we see of Julia the less substance there seems to be. More suck hole than dill, or more dill than suck hole? It hardly matters. I'm pretty sure Howard would have taken the same line but he would have been aware of the moral breaches and attempted to justify them. Politicians, they never fail to disappoint.
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23684 posts
WA, 23684 posts
12 Dec 2010 5:16pm
Bl00dy disgraceful the way they have hung him out to dry.
Even if you don't like him or think he may have committed offences in some country/ies by releasing doc's he is still due the same support as any citizen.

Compare to David Hicks - he committed Australian Commonwealth offences by being a member of a terrorist group and fighting in an overseas war. He fought against our own blokes. The Govt screamed and shouted to bring him home from the Bay as it appeased some of the community and made them look good.

Compare to Schappelle Corby or the Bali Nine, or even Holly Deane-Johns in Thailand (?). All were walk up starts for the prosecution but we still gave assistance.

Assange has been dropped like a hot potato the Govt, which is awful given the precedent we have set in other cases.
choco
choco
SA
4186 posts
SA, 4186 posts
12 Dec 2010 8:02pm
Mark _australia said...

Bl00dy disgraceful the way they have hung him out to dry.
Even if you don't like him or think he may have committed offences in some country/ies by releasing doc's he is still due the same support as any citizen.

Compare to David Hicks - he committed Australian Commonwealth offences by being a member of a terrorist group and fighting in an overseas war. He fought against our own blokes. The Govt screamed and shouted to bring him home from the Bay as it appeased some of the community and made them look good.

Compare to Schappelle Corby or the Bali Nine, or even Holly Deane-Johns in Thailand (?). All were walk up starts for the prosecution but we still gave assistance.

Assange has been dropped like a hot potato the Govt, which is awful given the precedent we have set in other cases.



so true, he isn't leaking these files, insiders in government are
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
12 Dec 2010 8:35pm
It is difficult to conceive that exposing lies could be a crime and J.A. didn't do the exposing. He just spread the word.

The biggest expose is just what a bunch of sick pricks politicians are world wide.
SandS
SandS
VIC
5904 posts
VIC, 5904 posts
12 Dec 2010 9:38pm


hang on a miniute... I,ll be back soon , just got to go for a wikki.
Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
12 Dec 2010 9:40pm
cisco said...


The biggest expose is just what a bunch of sick pricks politicians are world wide.



Is that such an expose? Politics under the two party system increasingly appear to attract only certain types. These types rarely have attributes that are rarely seen as positive characteristics.

Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23684 posts
WA, 23684 posts
12 Dec 2010 9:03pm
Those who red thumbed my post: do you think that we should have given assistance to the Bali Nine or Holly Deane-Johns ........ but NOT to Assange?

theDoctor
theDoctor
NSW
5786 posts
NSW, 5786 posts
13 Dec 2010 9:24am


well for starters, David Hicks didn't commit australian commonwealth offences.

nor did he fight against our own 'blokes'.

what assistance have we given the bali 9, whose family members contacted authorities BEFORE the act and asked for for federal assistance in intervention before the crimes were commited.

our assistance amounted to dobbing them in.

everything else from that point on is nothing more than diplomatic lip service

same with Holly Dean-Johns.

our government is so far up the bums of the likes of u.s & isreal we mistake farts for fresh air.

countless other 'whistle blowers' have disappeared or have beed disappeared alot quicker and with a lot less media attention for leaking nothing compared to Julian Assange,

Dr David Kelly for example.



saltiest1
saltiest1
NSW
2574 posts
NSW, 2574 posts
13 Dec 2010 10:00am
it should be pointed out that he is alledged to have committed a crime other than leaking documents, and thats why hes being chased. if he did that to my kid then id want him hung as well.
for the record, i back him up for releasing the documents as its about time leaders in the community were held responsible for their little secrets.
Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
13 Dec 2010 10:08am
The alleged crime sounds a bit strange and it does not really exist in Australian law. He isn't being charged for rape or assault or anything violent like that. One of the main legal arguments his lawyers will make against extradition is that the crime he is alleged to have committed does not exist in British law.

Carantoc
Carantoc
WA
7283 posts
WA, 7283 posts
13 Dec 2010 8:08am
So a person whose acts are called subversion by the Chinese government is given a nobel prize, but a person who does the same against the western government is given an arrest warrant.

Be careful to pick your target Doc. Its a fine line between hero and villain


theDoctor
theDoctor
NSW
5786 posts
NSW, 5786 posts
13 Dec 2010 11:27am

probably more like a point of view between hero and villain...


Trant
Trant
NSW
601 posts
NSW, 601 posts
13 Dec 2010 12:04pm
Personally I don't think any of the information coming out of Wikileaks appears to be particularly ground breaking. Just a confirmation of what more already thought.

In my opinion the big thing to come out of this will be how net neutrality stands up and the ability of governments to influence the net. The US government is bending over backwards to try and shut wikileaks down despite the fact that they've done nothing illegal.
Add the current "cyber war" being fought by Anonymous and things are getting very interesting indeed.

SandS
SandS
VIC
5904 posts
VIC, 5904 posts
13 Dec 2010 10:42pm

Gillard is a US puppet, if it was any other Australian on charges , she would be making all sorts of diplomatic noises. she was installed on false pretences , and now she is showing her true colours , she should should resign!
saltiest1
saltiest1
NSW
2574 posts
NSW, 2574 posts
13 Dec 2010 11:59pm
Mobydisc said...

The alleged crime sounds a bit strange and it does not really exist in Australian law. He isn't being charged for rape or assault or anything violent like that. One of the main legal arguments his lawyers will make against extradition is that the crime he is alleged to have committed does not exist in British law.






i wasnt aware of that, any more info please?
saltiest1
saltiest1
NSW
2574 posts
NSW, 2574 posts
14 Dec 2010 12:05am
Assange lawyer rips rape 'lies'
By DON KAPLAN

Last Updated: 6:25 AM, December 13, 2010

Posted: 2:04 AM, December 13, 2010

Comments: 0 Tweet
More Print Julian Assange is innocent of rape and molestation charges, according to a Swedish sex-crimes lawyer who says secret police documents prove Assange's accusers lied about being coerced into sex with the WikiLeaks mastermind.

Bjorn Hurtig, who's representing Assange in Sweden, where the charges were filed, claims to have seen the papers and says they show the women had "hidden agendas."

As for WikiLeaks, its latest expos? could imperil a key US military supply route to Afghanistan.

State Department cables describe Uzbekistan as a nightmarish world of "rampant corruption," organized crime, torture and forced labor -- and say US diplomats coddle President Islam Karimov in return for his not interfering with the supply line.




Read more: nypost.com/2010/12/13/assange-lawyer-rips-rape-lies/



i think this thing might get confusing as in oj simpson confusing......
Hiko
Hiko
1229 posts
1229 posts
18 Dec 2010 4:49pm
Lets cut to the chase here is it OK to hack into someones private correspondence
and broadcast it to the world or not? It seems that most on this forum think its Ok
Carantoc
Carantoc
WA
7283 posts
WA, 7283 posts
18 Dec 2010 7:03pm
Hiko said...

Lets cut to the chase here is it OK to hack into someones private correspondence
and broadcast it to the world or not? It seems that most on this forum think its Ok


Who is saying it is OK to hack into private conversation and broadcast it ?

I think the point with Wikileaks is they broadcast correspondence between governments.

Governments are established by the people to govern on behalf of the people.
I am one of the people, I even pay my taxes to society so I get to chose how I am governed.

I want to be governed in an open, honest and moral manner. If my governemnt is acting immorally, lying or failing to act then I want to know about it and I want it to stop.

There is no personnel correspondence when you are paid by the people to govern on behalf of the people. That principal was set in stone at Runneymead with the signing of the Magna Carter.



Now, having said all that, publishing correspondence between diplomnatic missions is not really very interesting. It shows the opinions of individuals who are generally very small fish in the wheels of governement and whose opinion is neither policy nor necessarily accepted as true, valid or even worthwhile by anyone else.

Wikileaks has the opportunity to whistleblow like nobody ever has before. But they have achieved nothing in 5 years.

Look at all the whistleblowers of recent times who have influenced world affairs - it has not been Julian Assange. It has been the free press and mass media (whom several people here condem at the expense of Wikileaks). Start adding up what has been broken in the mass media that has had signifcant effect :
Intern sucks off president
British MPs rort expenses
Pakistani cricketers take bribes
even Julian Assagne arrested on rape charges. Never got that story from Wikileaks before it was in the mass media !!

The world needs Wikileaks, but the world needs Wikileaks to whistleblow not sensationalise for maximum self publicity, there are plenty of other people that do that.

Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
18 Dec 2010 11:14pm
Carantoc said...


Governments are established by the people to govern on behalf of the people.




Not really.



maxm
maxm
NSW
864 posts
NSW, 864 posts
19 Dec 2010 1:18am
Hiko said...

Lets cut to the chase here is it OK to hack into someones private correspondence
and broadcast it to the world or not? It seems that most on this forum think its Ok


They don't hack into anything. If you haven't understood that then you've missed the point. They publish material that other people (whistleblowers) give them. They guarantee not to tell anyone who gave them that material and to make it extremely difficult to enable the source to be traced.

That's pretty much the same deal that the rest of the media do by the way (with varying guarantee/success in the divulging department). You may have noticed for instance that the Sydney Morning Herald has published a large tranche of the Wikileaks diplomatic cables as "a public service" and are promising to publish more.
Hiko
Hiko
1229 posts
1229 posts
19 Dec 2010 5:10am
Well I must be mistaken I thought Julian Assange was a computer hacker
obviously I was wrong
Hiko
Hiko
1229 posts
1229 posts
19 Dec 2010 7:33am
Its a moral minefield that I dont think there is a hard and fast solution to
Certainly I think Manning is wrong if he is guilty of betraying trust
Assange? Well he is assuming that he is totally right in spreading the betrayed trust
which if he hadnt done so would not be betrayed trust hmmmm
Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
19 Dec 2010 11:46am
Hiko said...

Its a moral minefield that I dont think there is a hard and fast solution to
Certainly I think Manning is wrong if he is guilty of betraying trust
Assange? Well he is assuming that he is totally right in spreading the betrayed trust
which if he hadnt done so would not be betrayed trust hmmmm



If Manning and Assange are in the wrong for betraying trust then many members of parliament and almost all cabinet ministers are in the wrong too coz they betray the trust placed in them as representatives of their constituents.


Exposing the deliberations and dealings of "our" representatives can only be healthy for democracy. If they are doing nothing wrong then they should not fear exposure. If they are doing wrong then they don't deserve to represent us unless we are happy for them to do wrong. If they are our representatives then they should be prepared to be open about everything they do on behalf of us.

That's what being a representative should be all about.







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