Forums > Kitesurfing Foiling

Ideal 12m kite for foiling

Reply
Created by wallyman Two weeks ago, 4 Jan 2020
wallyman
VIC, 10 posts
4 Jan 2020 2:27PM
Thumbs Up

Already have 8 and 10 m Reos which work well, would there be any improvement for a 12m perhaps a Bandit, Drifter or some mono strut kite ? Need something fast turning for the light stuff.

MikeyG
WA, 130 posts
4 Jan 2020 1:16PM
Thumbs Up

My biggest kite is a 9m Airush Ultra (it's a single strut). Flys really well in 10 knots of wind and is still quick. The way I see it, if you want a fast kite - go small and light. I wouldn't go bigger foiling and I've gad the ultra in 5-15 knot days.

Only problem with the Ultras is if you drop them in the drink in really low wind and soak the canopy (e.g. land the trailing edge first), they don't drain water easily.

warwickl
NSW, 1326 posts
4 Jan 2020 4:44PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
wallyman said..
Already have 8 and 10 m Reos which work well, would there be any improvement for a 12m perhaps a Bandit, Drifter or some mono strut kite ? Need something fast turning for the light stuff.


What do you weigh ?
Upto about 80kg depending on skill 10m kite strutless or single strut is the biggest needed.
In 7kn plus I use a 10.4m strutless Cloud kite on 32m race lines and it still turns fast and is very responsive one hand on a 1000sq cm foil wing.
The main reason for the 32m lines is just to get me up on the board and flying, after that double wind speed is a easy.

snalberski
WA, 679 posts
4 Jan 2020 4:49PM
Thumbs Up

12m Hyperlink with 15m lines and 55cm bar ticks my boxes... goes between 10-20 knts on the foilboard for me. Mono strut wise Ozone Alpha is my pick because of its stability and non flappyness.

eppo
WA, 7403 posts
4 Jan 2020 6:04PM
Thumbs Up

If you feel you need a 12m kite to foil ?.... then it's got to be as light as possible. You are going to be in super light winds so it needs to stay in the air. So yeh ... the foil kite option or one strut needs to be considered.

warwickl
NSW, 1326 posts
4 Jan 2020 9:06PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
snalberski said..
12m Hyperlink with 15m lines and 55cm bar ticks my boxes... goes between 10-20 knts on the foilboard for me. Mono strut wise Ozone Alpha is my pick because of its stability and non flappyness.


Agree Ozone Alpha would be up there for me.
I flew one back to back with a Gong strutless and very similar.
But no comparison to Clouds in my opinion and I know some other guys would agree.

emmafoils
86 posts
4 Jan 2020 6:38PM
Thumbs Up

Agree that weight matters here. Consider foil kites like Soul, Hyperlink or Concept Air Pulsion. They will all turn slow...that's just the physics of it.

wallyman
VIC, 10 posts
5 Jan 2020 12:27PM
Thumbs Up

Thanks for all replies, has anyone had any experience with the Liquid Force Solo V3, it has the single strut.

snalberski
WA, 679 posts
5 Jan 2020 1:16PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
eppo said..
If you feel you need a 12m kite to foil ?.... then it's got to be as light as possible.


That logic only applies if your mowing the lawn/carving. Boosting on my 12m foil kite with my foilboard in 17-19 knts
is one of my favourite things to do.

drsurf
NSW, 70 posts
6 Jan 2020 2:04AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
wallyman said..
Already have 8 and 10 m Reos which work well, would there be any improvement for a 12m perhaps a Bandit, Drifter or some mono strut kite ? Need something fast turning for the light stuff.


Agree with the others, 12m kites and fast turning don't tend to go together unless like snalberski you're into jumping.
I don't know what foil you are using, but I'd be looking at it first. If your foil is inefficient or not suited to what you like doing and therefore is causing you to need a bigger kite I'd be looking at changing your foil. I can only assume you want a fast turning kite for manoeuvrability because you're doing a bit of wave riding of some sort.
If you don't have the right wave foil for your weight and conditions you are foiling in, then getting a bigger slower kite may only make things worse.
Let us know a bit more information about your gear, yourself and conditions you're foiling in or wish to foil in. That will help the forum give you the advice you need.

KBGhost
QLD, 59 posts
7 Jan 2020 9:22AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
wallyman said..
Thanks for all replies, has anyone had any experience with the Liquid Force Solo V3, it has the single strut.



I have a V2 4.5m solo for strong wind foiling and it's pretty good in the air but challenging due to size.. so fast.

I don't like the LF pump valve arrangement, it's a dicky soft flap that relies on internal air pressure to keep closed. I smacked my kite down and it deflated leading to a 1.5hr swim/walk. Thought I'd blown the bladder but it was only the valve giving way. Pumped up fine. I wouldn't buy another unless they changed this personally.

I would recommend a Mono as my 9m is my main foil kite and is sweet to fly.

I use a 12m Trip for light days and it pulls really well, full depower in 12kts. It's a bit slow and tractor like. On the upside being strutless it hangs in the sky really well in lulls and drifts quite well when chasing swells downwind.

cbulota
WA, 1225 posts
7 Jan 2020 9:10AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
MikeyG said..
My biggest kite is a 9m Airush Ultra (it's a single strut). Flys really well in 10 knots of wind and is still quick. The way I see it, if you want a fast kite - go small and light. I wouldn't go bigger foiling and I've gad the ultra in 5-15 knot days.

Only problem with the Ultras is if you drop them in the drink in really low wind and soak the canopy (e.g. land the trailing edge first), they don't drain water easily.


Ultras are a great low wind foiling option in deed. The Ultras were designed for performance and the compromise is with relaunching. You need more skills to relaunch a kite like the Ultra in low wind, mainly due to the kite's shape but also the reduced diameter of the strut and leading edge. In the 2020 kite lineup Airush released the One Progression (beginner friendly single strut kite) which is much easier to relaunch than the Ultra, with a lower aspect ratio and larger central strut and Leading edge. This would be an ideal choice if you still crash the kite a lot when foiling.

We chose to replace our Ultras in the school with One's mostly because of the ease of relaunching. The One still works really well for low wind foiling as long as you're not looking for a high performance kite.

Been using the 12m Ultra for foiling for the last 3 years, wind range about 8 to 15 knots max. Using longer lines for anything 10 knots or less. It performs really well in light gusty winds as well when foil kites tend to collapse and tangle.

Here is a clip of the 15m Ultra in less than 8 knots.

&feature=youtu.be

We have Ultra's and One's available for Demo at Pinnaroo Point, Hillarys, WA.

Christian

Alysum
NSW, 387 posts
8 Jan 2020 2:17PM
Thumbs Up

When I foil in light winds, what worries me the most is a 12m 3 strut kite dropping out of the sky. It's happened a lot to a so called "light air kite".
I have since then used an Ozone Alpha 12m and it has NEVER dropped out of the sky. Really impressed with it so far. So definitely look at mono strut & easy to relaunch. Forget any 3 strutter.

ActionSportsWA
WA, 737 posts
8 Jan 2020 3:29PM
Thumbs Up

Hi Wallyman,

An insight into what kind of foiling you are looking to do would help greatly as three strut, 1 strut, no strut, foil kites and the newer single skin foils all are great, depending upon what you want the kite to do and how you like to ride.

Inflatables (all kinds) are great for all round performance down to 8 or 10 knots. Below this, relaunching is an issue and downwind riding is not really possible.

Foil kites like Hyperlink, Soul or Capa are awesome for fast freeride in light winds but are a bit pointless if surfing or riding big slow foils. Also excellent for big air in powered conditions and upwind/downwind at speed.

Single skin foils are excellent for slow speed riding in light winds on big surf foils and general purpose freeride foils, but are often time not relaunchable if they get dunked.

More info for better answers.

DM

lucy5
QLD, 65 posts
8 Jan 2020 6:20PM
Thumbs Up

In cairns we use 12m for light wind foiling alpha and boxer they do get some use in our gutless summer wind I have owned new alpha 10 m used 8m and 6 also. Also own a new mono 7 m and a boxer 12m the 22 has the advantage in light wind for take of and body dragging out to deep water in light wind but they get overpowered fairly easy

weebitbreezy
429 posts
8 Jan 2020 6:13PM
Thumbs Up

8m Flysurfer peak. Loads of power for low end. The lightest kite you will find. Relaunches if you are careful how you crash it.

My 9m Ultra is my biggest LEI for foiling at the moment. It will keep me riding up to the point where I won't be able to relaunch it (or at least it isn't a given). Thats the problem with 12m single strut kites. You can ride them below the relaunch threshold (12m Ozone alpha should take you down to maybe 7 knots but you'll stuggle to relaunch in less than 9). 10m Alpha would be my suggestion. Foiling in 8-9 knots with 30m lines and you'll know when to come in because the wind is dropping off as it will feel light at 9-10 knots - or about the relaunch threshold.

My 12m strutless was good whilst learning as I wanted the extra canvas to hang off and fly the kite high. Now I'm a little better I want to drive the kite low to load up the foil so I'd be lit far too quickly on a 12 at my present skill level. Give it a year or so and I dare say I'll be craving that lit feeling all the time and looking for more power. Thats the cycle of learning.

manlykiter
NSW, 62 posts
9 Jan 2020 4:31PM
Thumbs Up

I have a 10m Ozone Alpha, its brilliant for light wind foiling. I always end up coming in (get nervous about a swim when the water starts looking glassy!) before ive found the low end of that kite

Alysum
NSW, 387 posts
9 Jan 2020 11:23PM
Thumbs Up

I love my alpha 12m so much that I'm considering an 8m. Has anyone tried the alpha 8m?
I already have a reo 10+9m but 8m would be dedicated for foiling and not waves.

KIT33R
NSW, 1671 posts
10 Jan 2020 10:02AM
Thumbs Up

Thumbs up for the 10m Alpha. If I can get it in the air, I can foil with it. As long as you use the gusts for down loop transitions your apparent wind will do the rest. Oh, and don't stray too far from shore - just in case.

Alysum
NSW, 387 posts
Monday , 13 Jan 2020 11:32PM
Thumbs Up

Have now added a second alpha (8m) to my quiver still a very underrated kite for LW foil, hope to see more out there!

drsurf
NSW, 70 posts
Tuesday , 15 Jan 2020 1:17AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
weebitbreezy said..
8m Flysurfer peak. Loads of power for low end. The lightest kite you will find. Relaunches if you are careful how you crash it.

My 9m Ultra is my biggest LEI for foiling at the moment. It will keep me riding up to the point where I won't be able to relaunch it (or at least it isn't a given). Thats the problem with 12m single strut kites. You can ride them below the relaunch threshold (12m Ozone alpha should take you down to maybe 7 knots but you'll stuggle to relaunch in less than 9). 10m Alpha would be my suggestion. Foiling in 8-9 knots with 30m lines and you'll know when to come in because the wind is dropping off as it will feel light at 9-10 knots - or about the relaunch threshold.

My 12m strutless was good whilst learning as I wanted the extra canvas to hang off and fly the kite high. Now I'm a little better I want to drive the kite low to load up the foil so I'd be lit far too quickly on a 12 at my present skill level. Give it a year or so and I dare say I'll be craving that lit feeling all the time and looking for more power. Thats the cycle of learning.


I second weebitbreezy re 8m Peak4. Posted a review of the 8m in the Peak4 thread www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/Foiling/Flysurfer-Peak4?page=4#21
And pasted an abbreviated paragraph below

"First time I took the 8m out the wind was direct onshore and averaging 7 knots with gusts of 10 knots as measured on shore. This was pretty close to accurate with the local Seabreeze wind stations. However I was beaten out by another local, Aaron, approx 20kg heavier than me, on a 5m Peak4 who proceeded to get up and going albeit sining the kite now and then! (We're both on 1250sq cm surf foils, mine a Moses 633 and his a Naish Large).
When I got up on the foil I felt comfortably powered all the time I was out. The kite felt like a bigger 5m, with slower turning and a bit slower through the air. However it was still easy to loop and even in the lulls had enough power to pull me through downwind manoeuvres when I almost stalled the foil."

Also had another session with the 8m Peak4 today in even lighter wind where I also had rigged a 10m Soul so I could compare it with the 8m Peak4. The Soul had a bit more power, better upwind and more speed in a straight line. But it was slow turning, heavier in the air, and harder to keep in the air when gibing. With the Peak4 I could make turns repeatedly downwind, had enough power to easily get upwind and could just relax and have fun in any swell that appeared. Feedback from those who flew the 8m approximated its power similar to a 12m LEI. Definitely worth having the 8m Peak4 for those lightwind days which previously meant a lot of complaining about lack of wind

dafish
NSW, 1411 posts
Thursday , 16 Jan 2020 7:57AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
weebitbreezy said..
8m Flysurfer peak. Loads of power for low end. The lightest kite you will find. Relaunches if you are careful how you crash it.

My 9m Ultra is my biggest LEI for foiling at the moment. It will keep me riding up to the point where I won't be able to relaunch it (or at least it isn't a given). Thats the problem with 12m single strut kites. You can ride them below the relaunch threshold (12m Ozone alpha should take you down to maybe 7 knots but you'll stuggle to relaunch in less than 9). 10m Alpha would be my suggestion. Foiling in 8-9 knots with 30m lines and you'll know when to come in because the wind is dropping off as it will feel light at 9-10 knots - or about the relaunch threshold.

My 12m strutless was good whilst learning as I wanted the extra canvas to hang off and fly the kite high. Now I'm a little better I want to drive the kite low to load up the foil so I'd be lit far too quickly on a 12 at my present skill level. Give it a year or so and I dare say I'll be craving that lit feeling all the time and looking for more power. Thats the cycle of learning.


Ahahahah, if you are careful how you crash it? I have never had a careful crash. It's just that. A crash. I suppose what you really mean is that if you are quick, and lucky, and have retained some sense of line tension, then perhaps you can relaunch. :) But don't count on it.

ralphlong
WA, 19 posts
Friday , 17 Jan 2020 2:03PM
Thumbs Up

I recently swapped my 12m mono for a Soul 8m and haven't looked back. I foil on an infinity 76, which takes very little to get it going. I was always anxious of dropping the mono in 10 knots of wind or less, it was slower than the 8m soul and offered less light wind performance due to being so much heavier. So far the relaunches with the soul have gone well.....



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Kitesurfing Foiling


"Ideal 12m kite for foiling" started by wallyman