Getting in shape for Kiting

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tmiddled
tmiddled
NSW
253 posts
NSW, 253 posts
5 Apr 2009 4:10pm
Hey all,

Well, kite season is pretty much over here in Sydney, apart from the odd Southerly. I was looking at my options for when there is no surf and narrowed it down to paragliding or going to the gym :) Due to financial constraints I unfortunately have chosen the later (unless someone wants to donate to the "Get Tom High" fund)??

Anyway, looking to optimizing next season by getting in shape to have longer and harder sessions. Has anyone done this before? The main constraint I have is I get a sore back, especially when going upwind. What are the best exercisers for this, and for kiting in general.

Cheers,
Tom
tmiddled
tmiddled
NSW
253 posts
NSW, 253 posts
5 Apr 2009 4:16pm
By High, I meant High in the air. Paragliding
sebbu
sebbu
WA
154 posts
WA, 154 posts
5 Apr 2009 5:26pm
Just don't stop over winter mate :)
Aorta
Aorta
VIC
244 posts
VIC, 244 posts
5 Apr 2009 7:33pm
to strengthen your back do pull ups and reverse sit ups.
I will also do leg presses, squats and standing jumps
lancekenny
lancekenny
SA
402 posts
SA, 402 posts
5 Apr 2009 7:45pm
Try Pump at your local gym - awesome all over body workout... and typically full of chicks too

Dont load up the weights too much though - cause your body is going to be in a world of pain after the first week - that said hard to get a more all over body workout that will lift your power and stamina all over


funkyllama
funkyllama
TAS
308 posts
TAS, 308 posts
5 Apr 2009 10:56pm
tmiddled said...

Hey all,

The main constraint I have is I get a sore back, especially when going upwind. What are the best exercisers for this, and for kiting in general.



Maybe check ur posture adn think about some flexibility work on the hip flexor - this may be tightening up and giving you a crook back.
I am about to launch into a similar thing, bike riding is good for the legs so a bit of that, lots of core work at the gym - classes are great for this cos 1. they're full of chicks and 2. you need good core strength to go hard at most of the activities (think kickboxercise or similar).

And before you rack up the biggest weights you can find on the bench press, think about what your trying to do - get the barbells out on a fitball and work fly's/lateral raises etc you want to get as many supporting musclegroups working as you can to keep those shoulders in one piece when going unhooked/handlepasses etc
gruezi
gruezi
WA
3464 posts
WA, 3464 posts
5 Apr 2009 9:04pm
Pump up your biggest kite 3 times a day.
Cezar
Cezar
VIC
270 posts
VIC, 270 posts
5 Apr 2009 11:26pm
Just focus on your core muscles, the only ones worth working on, all the others are pretty irrelevent and I know what Im talking about since I broke my spine in 2 places 20 years ago ( L3,L4) ,it didnt stop me from heavy lifting at work, hard tennis ,skydiving
and in the last 6 month kitesurfing all thanks to steel core muscles.To exerscise them is real fun, do it and in 6 months 6 hours upwind session will be a piece of cake for you.
Good luck
moon waxing
moon waxing
WA
313 posts
WA, 313 posts
5 Apr 2009 10:38pm
Aorta said...

reverse sit ups


Hyper extensions, good for strong back and torso. I prefer using the static hyper extension bench than the machines. Also rotate 90 degrees to do side hyper extensions.

www.shapefit.com/exercise-guides/lower-back-exercises-hyperextensions.html

If doing situps don't go past 30 degrees as only the psoas muscle is used and not the abdominals. The psoas muscle attaches from the lower spine to thigh, over working the psoas muscle can produce back problems.
Lazarus
Lazarus
160 posts
160 posts
6 Apr 2009 2:49am
gruezi said...

Pump up your biggest kite 3 times a day.


lancekenny said...

Try Pump at your local gym


... strange. wont they look at you funny.

my plan this "off" season ... kite.
doc jans
doc jans
VIC
70 posts
VIC, 70 posts
6 Apr 2009 11:53am
moon waxing said...

Aorta said...

reverse sit ups


Hyper extensions, good for strong back and torso. I prefer using the static hyper extension bench than the machines. Also rotate 90 degrees to do side hyper extensions.

www.shapefit.com/exercise-guides/lower-back-exercises-hyperextensions.html

If doing situps don't go past 30 degrees as only the psoas muscle is used and not the abdominals. The psoas muscle attaches from the lower spine to thigh, over working the psoas muscle can produce back problems.


Yeah good advice, just watch the amount of extension that you do when doing the hyperextensions. Say if you are using a swiss ball, stomach on it, feet against the bottom of a wall - flex right over the ball and then come back into extension but you don't need to go past neutral. If you go too hard beyond neutral you can cause more problems.

I was doing some great x-training with my personal trainer for kiting. One thing that we made up was using a smith machine (you know those controlled bench press machines that you can lock off at regular intervals) and lock it off at about nipple height, raise one leg straight out in front of you and do one legged squats but using the bar like it is a kite bar.

ANother brilliant core stabilising, strengthening, and balance trainer is doing squats standing on a swiss ball - just make sure you do it where you can grab on to something easily just in case you fall. I normally do it under a chin up bar or the dips bar - use the aparatus to get on top of the ball and then get your balance. ONce you feel confident with just balancing there, then you can do either sustained isometric squats or do reps. It actually isn't as hard as you might think! (and you look hardcore :))

Generally you just want to do as much endurance and balancing training you can -chin ups are good, and using a swiss ball or half swiss ball whenever you do weights will increased the proprioceptive (balance) demand and make it that much harder!

If your back is giving you problems then it is highly likely that you have misalignment going on which may need to get it checked out and be adjusted. If you train and strengthen a spine that is crooked, then this won't help you in the long run!
milko
milko
NSW
604 posts
NSW, 604 posts
6 Apr 2009 11:57am
The old wheelbarrow possy on the missus works for me..
theDoctor
theDoctor
NSW
5786 posts
NSW, 5786 posts
6 Apr 2009 11:59am
mcdonalds, beer and tv
Kadkhah
Kadkhah
WA
381 posts
WA, 381 posts
6 Apr 2009 10:17am
www.highadventure.com.au

I know it's expensive but it's life changing, reconsider.

Fly safe and far
wave knave
wave knave
306 posts
306 posts
6 Apr 2009 10:48am

but round is a shape.
strydz
strydz
QLD
136 posts
QLD, 136 posts
6 Apr 2009 5:38pm
crossfit!!! there is a centre in sydney or check out there website the best thing for fittness and strength. its also used by the commando off the biggest looser
SaveTheWhales
SaveTheWhales
WA
1913 posts
WA, 1913 posts
6 Apr 2009 7:07pm
Seriously

A. Fat people are nice toooo (your subliminal writing is easily identified)

B. Watch that 'dodgeball' movie - then spend at least 30 min's per day playing on road (quieter ones are better to begin with )

C. Bein Easter n all - chase that rascal bunny round & round & round till you catch it and rip her tail off and .... XXadultsonlyXX 15min's equals 5km run

D. Hire a white John Travolta suit, go club it doing upright Hyperextensions with one arm pointing in air - its Sydney after all youll get fit N be a STAR

E. Have kids !!!!! Twins - will symetricall Balance your spine (one on each arm) and u will automatically induce HyperExtension. Why do you think women loose so much weight after babies

F. Go on High Protein / medium Carb / low Cement diet - guaranteed youll harden up

Gorgo
Gorgo
VIC
5126 posts
VIC, 5126 posts
6 Apr 2009 10:30pm
If you want to get fit and have loads of fun at the same time get a standup paddle board SUP and get out paddling and surfing on it. You'll get super fit and develop your water skills as well.
kitelements
kitelements
WA
101 posts
WA, 101 posts
6 Apr 2009 9:33pm
lancekenny said...

Try Pump at your local gym - awesome all over body workout... and typically full of chicks too

Dont load up the weights too much though - cause your body is going to be in a world of pain after the first week - that said hard to get a more all over body workout that will lift your power and stamina all over





agree, it s a great work out for your entire body . i couldnt believe how much it is physicall.
Again do not load up too much on weigths ....5 kilos max for your first session. i did 10 and couldnt bearly move for 5 days
kitelements
kitelements
WA
101 posts
WA, 101 posts
6 Apr 2009 9:36pm
i forgot

main thing to correct your back pain it s to work on your core muscles....
so . pumpclass , yoga, and pilates.....
trust me the chick dpnt look at you funny
theyy love it ahahaah
mikeayb
mikeayb
QLD
4 posts
QLD, 4 posts
6 Apr 2009 11:55pm
best thing hands down you can do to strengthen your core is good old fashioned squats, so forget about swiss balls and get to the squat rack!
davem207
davem207
VIC
138 posts
VIC, 138 posts
7 Apr 2009 12:26am
look up slingfit (TRX suspension trainer) on the web, a great core muscle full body work out platform, combine this with 5 cardio sessions a week of an hour or more and thats all the fitness you will need. its this simple eat less move more. or you can just be another statistic. Go Australia the fattest nation in the world! its a great record we hold!, and its true take a look around next time your down the shops, every second person is fat.
boost75
boost75
WA
26 posts
WA, 26 posts
7 Apr 2009 12:02am
Wow- everyone throwing in their 2 cents worth. Mate i'll say it once
"Core Strength"
Its that simple.
Go see a reputable physiotherapist and explain any probs you have existing and any probs you have after a certain session or workout or whatever and that you kiteboard.
They will give you a set of core strength exercises to do, prob with a fitball.
Do exactly as they show you and you will never have any back probs again-unless you lift heavy **** incorrectly.
It works-but it tricks your mind cause you feel like you should be lifting something heavy to make a difference.
I know because 8 years ago a single vertibrae shifted towards my stomach, no disc probs but after seeing spinal specialist i was told they would have to fuse my spine or risk poss not walking later in life, def not surf again and a HUGE list of other complications.
Went and saw a forward thinking physio and told them full story. . . . 365 days later and approx 200 separated back exercises a day- i can surf, kite, boost, run etc and its all through core strength.
Have not had a single problem since and its been 8 years and my spine did not have to be fused.
These muscle hold you up in posture, control fat guts, align spine etc
Everyone should do some form of core work on a regular basis.

Sorry but its such an important issue.

Happy Kiting

SaveTheWhales
SaveTheWhales
WA
1913 posts
WA, 1913 posts
7 Apr 2009 3:58am
And now for some real input from a trainer qualified with enough stupid certificates, degrees in sports physio, weightlifting, powerlifting and triathlons and results from State - National & World Championships, than you can fill a wheelie bin with.

CORE STABILITY has recently been added to the fitness industries " Marketing Department " as another ploy to make money !!!!

For those non open minded people or textbook bandits who dont understand what Real World training requires to get real results - you may find it interesting that it coincided with the Marketing release from the STARS .... wait for it... of Pilates ! yes youve all been sucked into the money making vacuum cleaner

Pilates was by its original design only intended to teach at most - 5 people at one time !!! because its very hard to activate these stabilisers & you cannot effectively control a larger group of people (how long does it take a physio to teach '1' person to isolate & switch it on & off...)


Mikeayb was Partially correct on his exercise of squats (executed properly) but done with a Manta Ray pad that load spreads weight on shoulders not spine. The later induces another set of problems. This exercise utilises the Core stabilisers very efficiently

Kiteing uses compound movements with both fast N slow twitch muscle fibres that cannot be simulated by carpet munching exercises

A Reputable open minded Trainer or Sports Physio of great personal Integrity should be able to use their imagination to efficiently simulate the various movements required by kiteing - including WTF - yes, jumping off a small bench to teach synchronisity of knees & balance for landing (naturally feet will have to be angled)

So in short if your going to spend dosh on a fitness regime, make it specific so it works for you !

You wouldnt buy a trainer kite if it was massive boosts you were after would you

Ps I still recomend that cup of cement with breaky is by far the quickest way to Harden up them core stabilisers
Gorgo
Gorgo
VIC
5126 posts
VIC, 5126 posts
7 Apr 2009 11:29am
The thing I hate about Pilates is I paid this babe $80 for a personal session and she spends the entire time telling me I'm doing it wrong. The C4 vertebrae is not on the correct angle or the third stomach muscle on the left is too tense or some other esoteric bull****.

My prescription for total body fitness is to find a gentle excercise that you like doing and do it. An exercise that you can ramp up to high intensity then back off is best.

For me, I kite all year round, SUP when there's no wind and ride a mountain bike at other times. The mountain bike is a particularly good backup because you don't have to ride far or fast to get some decent exercise.

SUP is really nice on glassy smooth water with no wind and in the surf it rocks. By far the best way to surf small or imperfect waves. Downwinders are good fun but take a bit of organisation. You can paddle as fast or as slow as you want and the constant balancing gives you an all-over workout (dare I say core strength).
sunseeker
sunseeker
QLD
1203 posts
QLD, 1203 posts
7 Apr 2009 12:42pm
Get yourself a decent surf ski (not a goat boat - a proper paddling ski). It keeps you way fitter than SUP and it's way cooler.
Kadkhah
Kadkhah
WA
381 posts
WA, 381 posts
7 Apr 2009 11:03am
Gorgo said...

... I paid this babe $80 for a personal session and she spends the entire time telling me I'm doing it wrong...


I would pay a little more and all she will say is: "Ahhhh Yeahhhh"

mikeayb
mikeayb
QLD
4 posts
QLD, 4 posts
7 Apr 2009 2:02pm
SaveTheWhales said...

And now for some real input from a trainer qualified with enough stupid certificates, degrees in sports physio, weightlifting, powerlifting and triathlons and results from State - National & World Championships, than you can fill a wheelie bin with.

CORE STABILITY has recently been added to the fitness industries " Marketing Department " as another ploy to make money !!!!

For those non open minded people or textbook bandits who dont understand what Real World training requires to get real results - you may find it interesting that it coincided with the Marketing release from the STARS .... wait for it... of Pilates ! yes youve all been sucked into the money making vacuum cleaner

Pilates was by its original design only intended to teach at most - 5 people at one time !!! because its very hard to activate these stabilisers & you cannot effectively control a larger group of people (how long does it take a physio to teach '1' person to isolate & switch it on & off...)


Mikeayb was Partially correct on his exercise of squats (executed properly) but done with a Manta Ray pad that load spreads weight on shoulders not spine. The later induces another set of problems. This exercise utilises the Core stabilisers very efficiently

Kiteing uses compound movements with both fast N slow twitch muscle fibres that cannot be simulated by carpet munching exercises

A Reputable open minded Trainer or Sports Physio of great personal Integrity should be able to use their imagination to efficiently simulate the various movements required by kiteing - including WTF - yes, jumping off a small bench to teach synchronisity of knees & balance for landing (naturally feet will have to be angled)

So in short if your going to spend dosh on a fitness regime, make it specific so it works for you !

You wouldnt buy a trainer kite if it was massive boosts you were after would you

Ps I still recomend that cup of cement with breaky is by far the quickest way to Harden up them core stabilisers


yep thats what i meant just gave the short version.

on the squats though is a manta ray realy neccessary? if you were to rest the bar on your traps were its supposed to sit not your neck isnt weight across width of back anyway? not being a smart ass just the way i saw it
dachopper
dachopper
WA
1802 posts
WA, 1802 posts
7 Apr 2009 5:04pm
if you have been getting a sore back I would say
- either your stance is wrong - or you like to go "too" fast for the conditions,
or the conditions are not good.

if you try and go longer and harder in the same conditions - riding the same way - your back will hurt no matter how much gym work you do if you already have reasonable fitness.
SaveTheWhales
SaveTheWhales
WA
1913 posts
WA, 1913 posts
7 Apr 2009 7:29pm
mikeayb

Yes, traditionaly thats what should happen... the problem arises when you increase your weights, going from 5kg to say 45kg (over time of course) where direct compression is that great - you end up with a Calcification bump on your spine... clearly visible in X-rays & on your back.

Modern man has since progressed but will take some years to figure it out n filter through the system - as theres to much money to be made from repeditive strain & ego injuries (short version). Long version involves your Central Nervous system...

Also you may find interesting all the recomendations on Abdominal training (for kiteing) Answer is simply why Break down the Pooh Stance that everyone uses on a good day or even a basic jump - the abs get a major hammering along with the psoas as 'MoonWaxing' mentioned earlier.

Most people feel their abs the following day & becomes very obvious when learning how to jump... Overworked stabilisers - De-stabilise you
StormySeas
StormySeas
9 posts
9 posts
7 Apr 2009 7:49pm
Masterbation, keeps the arms strong and you'll never forget to work out
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