Learners Etiquette?

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schmik
schmik
NSW
235 posts
NSW, 235 posts
15 Mar 2006 10:43pm
Howdy,

What are all the unspoken (or spoken rules) for learning and not getting in everyones way. Sydney is a crowded place and I'm sure tempers sometimes flare so what are your thoughts on the correct behaviour of the newbie?

Launch and stay downwind of all the other riders?
Get in amongst it all?
Talk to locals? or leave them alone?

I don't know the rules on all of this as I have been landboarding and buggying for a few years and either ride alone or in small numbers in HUGE areas! (like lake george in canberra).

As I can landboard (and more importantly I know how to handle large kites very well) I really need to learn/practice holding an edge on the water. Any tips for crowded sydney spots ?

PS... I already enjoy the soft(er) properties of water.

schmik
Hurrah
Hurrah
NSW
382 posts
NSW, 382 posts
16 Mar 2006 11:49am
Schmik

Talk to locals as well as stay downwind of the main launch area.
Most people are willing to talk and help out. At least if you make yourself known, people know who you are and may even come to help if you're in trouble.

Season's almost over now though so get ready for a long and fruitless winter of little wind

Cheers
Ben De Jonge
Ben De Jonge
WA
819 posts
WA, 819 posts
16 Mar 2006 2:58pm
If you always stay down wind of everyone until you can confidently hold an edge you will be doing everyone a big favour and shouldn't get into too much trouble.

I made the mistake of giving way down wind to a newb a few weeks ago, and when he tried to edge up wind to increase the distance, he flew his kite too high, lost his edge, got blown down toward me, panicked, lost control of his lite, wrapped it around my lines and when I pulled my safety, every one of my lines got cut.

Not happy Jan.
schmik
schmik
NSW
235 posts
NSW, 235 posts
16 Mar 2006 9:34pm
Thanks guys. I shall keep out of the way.

Winter does not bother me at all... I like being cold and gusty winds are fine. I landboard inland and 15knots gusting to 25knots happens all the time... or 8knots gusting to 16. You just learn to ride it out and hope to god you don't get a huge gust mid flight! So I just keep on landboarding and hit the water when ever the wind is east(ish).

I have seen a few kite tangles on dry land and it ain't pretty. One guy (over 40 and also over 100kg) got in a tangle with two 3m foils (about a 5 or 6 m LEI each) in 25-30knot winds. He got lofted , slammed into his own car and then dragged 60m down wind until 2 of us jumped on him to hold him down. The irony is that this happened on lake george, this place is 15km x 5 km in size and baren! So hitting a car is just stupid! Anyway the point is that most dangerous situations can be avoided.

later
schmik
Mr Plow
Mr Plow
VIC
428 posts
VIC, 428 posts
16 Mar 2006 9:57pm
My pet hate is when newbies periscope their kites (i.e. hold directly overhead) - regardless of the situation....

...be aware of those kiting around you and position your kite accordingly. Standing with your kite directly overhead is never a good idea anyway due to lofting risk.

The only time you should keep your kite "high" is when you are passing upwind of a downwind kiter (who should be keeping their kite "low").

Its amazing how small a kiting area becomes when kiters dont follow these basic rules !

Another hate is when I come in from a run and kiters standing on the beach have their kites either overhead or over the water....for f**ks sake - either put the thing down, or have a kite
ellery
ellery
VIC
187 posts
VIC, 187 posts
16 Mar 2006 10:10pm
One major rule is that anyone riding a 13m venom has right of way in all circumstances. So you should be ok schmik!

If it does look like you're not sure what's going on, I just pull up to a stop, and put the kite above me with my feet on the board and let the other kiter work it out. Sure this might be a pain in some situations, but i'd prefer to annoy someone on their tack rather than being pulled into them such as in the case of Ben.

cheers
James
malfi66
malfi66
QLD
181 posts
QLD, 181 posts
16 Mar 2006 10:46pm
Also, when launching give yourself plenty of room. Ask whoever is helping you to launch to first carry your kite away from any congestion in the launch area. There are a lot of things that can go wrong during launch.
Mr Plow
Mr Plow
VIC
428 posts
VIC, 428 posts
17 Mar 2006 9:32am
Ellery said "If it does look like you're not sure what's going on, I just pull up to a stop, and put the kite above me with my feet on the board and let the other kiter work it out."

ARRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHHH - I hate you Ellery Die Die Die

Actually mate - havent seen you on the water much lately - I take it summer hols are over and you are back to Uni?
nads
nads
NSW
25 posts
NSW, 25 posts
17 Mar 2006 12:51pm
hey schmik..wouldnt mind some info on landboarding at lake george. i drove past there on my way to canberra the other day, stopped at the lookout and it was BLOWING!!! wondered if anyone landboarded or buggied there! obviously they do! what time of year is best, wind direction, where do you go to set up etc etc... I kite in sydney, mostly at brighton and dolls but i'd love to give landboarding a go. not many spots around sydney...too many bloody people to get in the way! cheers dude!
ellery
ellery
VIC
187 posts
VIC, 187 posts
17 Mar 2006 2:25pm
Yes, uni has begun!

nads, landboarding rocks! Never done it at lake george but i'm sure there would be a park near you where you could do it. (preferably ocean facing) To learn with just start with a small kite. It starts to get fun when you would be able to stay upwind on the water (start doing jumps on the land). When you're really powered up it can get uncomfortable though! Can use any type of kite, but Lei's aren't the best. Best kite i reckon is a venom. A bit off topic but i actually think that landboarding is safer than kitesurfing. Sure you can break an ankle easier on land or get scratches (minor injuries), but if you wear good protection you're usually ok. With kitesurfing you need a bigger kite, thus if the wind picks up and you still need to come in it can get dangerous. If you get too powered up on land, pull safety, drop the kite there and then and walk away, whereas if you have to pull the safety out at sea it can mean a long swim in.
It's also great when you start doing grinds and jumps on benches and things! (Note that the word "great" can also be replaced with "dangerous")

cheers
James
schmik
schmik
NSW
235 posts
NSW, 235 posts
18 Mar 2006 12:52pm
Nads, at lake G you can drive out to the middle where it doesn't really matter what direction the wind is blowing. You can go for KMs in any direction. If there has not been rain in months the surface can get a bit too dry and soft. It is ok if you are light, if not then you need bigger tyres. Buggying on Lake George is sweet too, super high speeds are possible, some of the canberra buggiers hit 70 - 80kph regularly.


As with everywhere else in the summer you get more E winds and in winter you get more W winds. The summer E usually don't kick in until late arvo. The W can blow all day. As i said before, out in the middle the wind is pretty smooth from any direction.

Drop me a PM or email if you ever want to head out there or need more specific info.

schmik
GregW
GregW
VIC
106 posts
VIC, 106 posts
18 Mar 2006 1:49pm
Hi Schmik

You can do yourself and everyone else a favour by leaving your board in the bag until you can safely and confidently fly your kite. If you are struggling to keep your kite in the air and you are trying to mess around with your board then you will just lose control and be crashing your kite endangering yourself and everyone else.

Spend plenty of time body dragging until you can reliably relaunch it every time and can hover the kite on either side of the window in any wind strength, and move it carefully from side to side of the window. You should be able to do all this almost without thinking. It's all about having reasonable control of your kite. Being able to body drag upwind would be a bonus but it's probably a bit much to ask you to develop this skill when some people never do it.

Once you can control your kite find a place with a safe launching place and a safe landing place a couple of km apart. It depends on how far you are prepared to walk carrying your gear. 2-3 km is no big deal. Get yourself out in some deep water well away from the beach and start working with your board. You should have clean wind out away from the beach and will avoid dropping your kite on other people. Cross onshore wind is ideal because if you have any problems you will eventually be blown to shore. If you are worried about deep water then wear a life jacket ... or take up golf instead.

Just spend your time trying to ride ... in both directions. Ride away from the beach and ride towards the beach. Do not come into the beach until you can ride or you have reached your landing place. Do this and you will have had 30 mins to an hour of riding practice instead of the usual 2-3 minutes most guys get.

Don't make the mistake of landing really close to your starting place and walking back up the beach. You will get good at walking with your kite (which is not such a bad thing I guess). You will not get good at riding because you will only get 2-3 minutes of riding practice in between each walk up the beach.

Don't make the mistake of riding out then dragging back to the beach. You will learn to ride in only one direction. The only thing stopping you riding in the opposite direction is lack of practice so do heaps of riding in both directions.
schmik
schmik
NSW
235 posts
NSW, 235 posts
18 Mar 2006 3:36pm
Thanks Gregw, there are a few good points in there. I have already done the few Km walk a few times and it makes sense to spend more time in the water rather than walking. Also makes most sense to stay out of the waves as hitting a wave is how i come unstuck most of the time.

I understand your points about kite skills and these do make sense for learners. I am lucky enough to be a few steps up from the general newb though as I have been landboarding for a couple of years. I regulary fly a 9.5m or 12m frenzy (that is much more powerful than 10-12m C kite) in upto 20knots on land and can fly it without looking at it just fine. Handling the kite on land is th easy part for me. Holding an edge in the water is the hard part.

As much as i couldn't be bothered I can see that I must practice relaunching in the water. Haven't had to do it yet coz i havent dropped the kite but I'm sure it will happen.

And... coming from landboarding I know exactly what you mean about riding in both directions. No pain, no gain.

schmik
elizabethb
elizabethb
QLD
2081 posts
QLD, 2081 posts
19 Mar 2006 10:37am
Kiteboarding's Right of Way Rules

www.waksa.org.au/right-of-way-rules/

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