Have you tried self launching?

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Culero
Culero
WA
2 posts
WA, 2 posts
2 Dec 2015 10:15am
So if you approach someone and tell them politely that when they are done pumping their kite could they give you a launch please?


And they come back with "Have you ever tried self launch"?

How to reply to that?

I know the guy was a jack ass.. but really just tell me no and I will look for someone else more friendly next time.

anyway.. rant off... anyone had similar answers?
loftywinds2
loftywinds2
185 posts
185 posts
2 Dec 2015 10:27am
LOL

I get this sometimes. (for a small town like Townsville, it's stupid mentality really).

What I would say - ".... Yes of course I can. I just didn't want to risk sliding my kite over your crap on the beach and getting it dirty.."

That leaves them stumped.
Bazinga
Bazinga
QLD
63 posts
QLD, 63 posts
2 Dec 2015 1:02pm
Culero said..
So if you approach someone and tell them politely that when they are done pumping their kite could they give you a launch please?


And they come back with "Have you ever tried self launch"?

How to reply to that?

I know the guy was a jack ass.. but really just tell me no and I will look for someone else more friendly next time.

anyway.. rant off... anyone had similar answers?


You have 3 options to reply........
1. Yes, I know how to self-launch but would prefer not to risk damage to my kite.
2. I don't know how, I am only a beginner and not ready to try it yet.
3. I don't know how, can you give me some pointers/tips.........if you think the person was actually being a jackass then maybe skip this one.

Karma usually comes around for the jack asses.


KIT33R
KIT33R
NSW
1716 posts
NSW, 1716 posts
2 Dec 2015 2:15pm
No one should refuse to launch your kite. No matter how busy they think they are.

When they are out the back with a downed kite and the tide taking their board, an appropriate response would be "do you know how to body drag?".
kemp90
kemp90
QLD
1694 posts
QLD, 1694 posts
2 Dec 2015 1:54pm
i blue my kite up yesterday self launching. hit a sharp shell on the way up
Matt988
Matt988
WA
154 posts
WA, 154 posts
2 Dec 2015 2:38pm
Had blokes in the past refuse to let me land kites for them cause they'd rather self land and have it all go horribly wrong in 25+ gusty stuff. I usually have a 4x4 on the beach and tether launch so always up for helping guys out who don't have that option. As for the response to someone saying no to you, karma comes around just hope you're there to see it all go pear shaped for them
Loftywinds
Loftywinds
QLD
2060 posts
QLD, 2060 posts
2 Dec 2015 9:08pm
kemp90 said..
i blue my kite up yesterday self launching. hit a sharp shell on the way up


I'll fix it. Same thing happened to mine, but persistence, patience, and some know-how goes a long way. All good now
Kamikuza
Kamikuza
QLD
6493 posts
QLD, 6493 posts
2 Dec 2015 9:26pm
Culero said..
So if you approach someone and tell them politely that when they are done pumping their kite could they give you a launch please?


And they come back with "Have you ever tried self launch"?

How to reply to that?

I know the guy was a jack ass.. but really just tell me no and I will look for someone else more friendly next time.

anyway.. rant off... anyone had similar answers?


Might try asking, rather than telling...

If you want a favor from someone, good manners oblige you to wait til it's convenient for them, not you--don't expect people (especially me) to drop what they're doing (especially if I'm halfway through setup or pack-down) to rush over and help you.

Given the quality of kiters in Oz (as indicated by the amount of lost/found gear, accidents, kites in trees/boat rigging, colliding with boats, getting lost at sea, broken kites, loftywinds) I'd rather self-launch/land anyway as unless you know the other guy, you've no idea how good they are at doing that one simple job.
waveslave
waveslave
WA
4263 posts
WA, 4263 posts
2 Dec 2015 7:26pm
kemp90 said..
i blue my kite up yesterday self launching. hit a sharp shell on the way up


# blew
Culero
Culero
WA
2 posts
WA, 2 posts
2 Dec 2015 7:38pm
Kamikuza said..

Culero said..
So if you approach someone and tell them politely that when they are done pumping their kite could they give you a launch please?


And they come back with "Have you ever tried self launch"?

How to reply to that?

I know the guy was a jack ass.. but really just tell me no and I will look for someone else more friendly next time.

anyway.. rant off... anyone had similar answers?



Might try asking, rather than telling...

If you want a favor from someone, good manners oblige you to wait til it's convenient for them, not you--don't expect people (especially me) to drop what they're doing (especially if I'm halfway through setup or pack-down) to rush over and help you.

Given the quality of kiters in Oz (as indicated by the amount of lost/found gear, accidents, kites in trees/boat rigging, colliding with boats, getting lost at sea, broken kites, loftywinds) I'd rather self-launch/land anyway as unless you know the other guy, you've no idea how good they are at doing that one simple job.


sorry for my bad.. I asked hehehe its not like I shouted at him... you must do this!! :)
Kamikuza
Kamikuza
QLD
6493 posts
QLD, 6493 posts
3 Dec 2015 12:03am
S'ok, I was stirring.

If those are your mates, I'd get new mates.


kemp90
kemp90
QLD
1694 posts
QLD, 1694 posts
3 Dec 2015 7:02am
waveslave said...
kemp90 said..
i blue my kite up yesterday self launching. hit a sharp shell on the way up


# blew


Ahh yes, my mistake! I'm sorry I can't spell.
kemp90
kemp90
QLD
1694 posts
QLD, 1694 posts
3 Dec 2015 7:03am
Loftywinds said...
kemp90 said..
i blue my kite up yesterday self launching. hit a sharp shell on the way up


I'll fix it. Same thing happened to mine, but persistence, patience, and some know-how goes a long way. All good now


Haha I sent it straight to moti to get some tlc
Kalm
Kalm
QLD
2 posts
QLD, 2 posts
18 Dec 2015 3:13pm
Hey loftywinds2, where do you kite in Townsville?
flyingcab
flyingcab
VIC
942 posts
VIC, 942 posts
18 Dec 2015 5:25pm
He kites with his buggy in grass fields
UnderMyUmbrella
UnderMyUmbrella
QLD
51 posts
QLD, 51 posts
18 Dec 2015 5:14pm
Was he a jackass or was he just asking if you've tried a self-launch?

If you haven't just tell him you're not comfortable doing one. I guess it all comes down to his tone of voice and body language but he may not necessarily have been a dick.
Loftywinds
Loftywinds
QLD
2060 posts
QLD, 2060 posts
19 Dec 2015 1:01pm
Kalm said..
Hey loftywinds2, where do you kite in Townsville?


Bushland Beach and Saunders. Pallarenda - sometimes
Plummet
Plummet
4862 posts
4862 posts
19 Dec 2015 1:03pm
cauncy
cauncy
WA
8407 posts
WA, 8407 posts
19 Dec 2015 9:54pm
Plummet said...



You ok plummet
cauncy
cauncy
WA
8407 posts
WA, 8407 posts
19 Dec 2015 9:57pm
I'd pay good money watching someone self launch tonight
Double or quits for a self land

[;

Dune rejuvenation in a single day
stuntnaz
stuntnaz
NSW
540 posts
NSW, 540 posts
20 Dec 2015 6:59am
I believe that everyone should learn how to self land and launch there own kites . Yes its safer to get someone to help but there are times when you have no choice , like last person in or first person to arrive at a kite spot .
It's part of kitesurfing. I have see people set up on the beach ready to go and are sitting waiting for someone else to turn up to launch there kite.
It would be like asking someone to reverse park your car for you because you are unable to , your reaction would be how did you get your license.
I don't no why kite schools don't cover this it should be mandatory for all schools to teach self launching and landing . That way students can be made aware of all the ins and outs and what can go wrong and what to do when it goes pear shaped .
KiteBud
KiteBud
WA
1615 posts
WA, 1615 posts
20 Dec 2015 9:42am
stuntnaz said..
I don't no why kite schools don't cover this it should be mandatory for all schools to teach self launching and landing . That way students can be made aware of all the ins and outs and what can go wrong and what to do when it goes pear shaped .







As far as self-launching is concerned, it's an advanced skill that has lots of potential for dangers, accidents and can damage the kite. The majority of students booking lessons simply don't develop sufficient skills or book enough lessons to justify teaching this skill. It's simply not a priority. However for the few who are ready, skilled, competent and confident enough, we do teach it. This is usually only after 3-4 lessons are done at least and it corresponds to roughly 5-10% of students. With kite beaches getting busier these days, self-launching should be discouraged as too many accidents can occur involving other kiters or even worse, members of the public.

As far as self-landing is concerned, it's a basic skill that must be learned in the first lesson by using the safety system and flagging the kite. Because it's not part of any official instructor training scheme, no schools that I know of teaches this except ours. We call this the ''emergency self-landing'', safety is deployed during the first few minutes of flying and student self-retrieves the kite once flagged out by following the safety line hand-over-hand straight to the kite and secures it. It's simple, fast, effective and safe no matter the wind conditions. This skill is an essential part of student independence, as they often drift downwind and/or end up in trouble where there is no one around to help.

As a result of not being taught how to self-retrieve their kites using the safety system in their lessons, newbies often end up trying to self-land using all those different dangerous self-landing methods i.e. pulling back lines or front lines, smashing kites to the ground, etc. all while being hooked in the chicken loop and not ever thinking of using their safety systems...

Christian
polykarb
polykarb
VIC
284 posts
VIC, 284 posts
20 Dec 2015 5:29pm
That's not plummet in the above video, it's a more experienced Kiter from Taranaki... Old as video, geez he was lucky could have been sooo much worse.

The launch was horrible, kind of half let it go, resulting in a stall
And then once it did get wind it was further back in the power and Kev got yanked. Conditions do not look ideal at all, great example of area and conditions where you need a launch.

There is nothing wrong with self launching and landing your kites in the right conditions and areas. (Maybe not all kites)

On large sandy beach for example you can launch and land without kite sliding or doing anything else silly. 90% of time.
And you just ask the other 10% when your not confident.

Prob the best thing about self launching and landing is that you're independent and can't get into trouble by somebody else's mistake. Eg, can only blame yourself for a fail.

There is always situations where it's tricky and a launch or land makes it easier and safer. For me that's the 10% and could be conditions, location, people or gear on the beach downwind etc.

If you don't have correct technique your kite will slide (drift launch) and could get damaged. So you need to master it.

I'm happy to launch and land kites for people who don't know how to do it themselves, or when it's going to be safer. Or even just to be a nice when I know the person can totally self launch/land.

Ive never denied a launch or land, but if your coming into an experience kiting area where most people launch and land themselves, and it's safe to do so..... watch, learn and give it a go when it's safe. . Feel free to ask or for demo, it's not hard.

I see a lot of people doing it wrong, and I also wasn't shown exactly how myself, which resulted it kite doing a little drift downwind before it launchs, but now I have it dialed for my kites. By walking more upwind while rotating kite during launch.

All kites are bit different, so what works for one model might be bit different for the next. And only work in some conditions.

Rant over, but self launching / landing is a skill that many kiters fail to learn until way to late.

But it's never to late to learn.

Green thumb if you agree, or would like to learn.

djt91184
djt91184
QLD
1211 posts
QLD, 1211 posts
20 Dec 2015 4:45pm
I self launch and land when I have to but much prefer assistance. Im no hellman but advanced kiters self launch and land in some ridiculous spots (on the grass when there's a whole beach AND people willing to help).
Polykarb are you saying the bloke above in the kitemare is experienced? Hes standing stiff like a scarecrow not ready for any abrupt force and whats he doing yanking on the bar like crazy?! Looks like hes squid jigging.
Hes got about 150m of boulders to clear before he gets to the water?! Is there sand over there someplace
polykarb
polykarb
VIC
284 posts
VIC, 284 posts
20 Dec 2015 5:50pm
Yep, Kev is a master of sailing, windsurfing and kiting...

This video is prob almost a decade old, actually it prob is?

Plummet how old is this video? Is It Kev? And how experienced would you say he is?

djt91184
djt91184
QLD
1211 posts
QLD, 1211 posts
20 Dec 2015 4:54pm
Ok I just wanted to clarify. Its horrible I didnt watch it twice. He had the reaction to eject quickly? His oldmates weren't to concerned about him.
cauncy
cauncy
WA
8407 posts
WA, 8407 posts
20 Dec 2015 3:29pm
polykarb said...
That's not plummet in the above video, it's a more experienced Kiter from Taranaki... Old as video, geez he was lucky could have been sooo much worse.

The launch was horrible, kind of half let it go, resulting in a stall
And then once it did get wind it was further back in the power and Kev got yanked. Conditions do not look ideal at all, great example of area and conditions where you need a launch.

There is nothing wrong with self launching and landing your kites in the right conditions and areas. (Maybe not all kites)

On large sandy beach for example you can launch and land without kite sliding or doing anything else silly. 90% of time.
And you just ask the other 10% when your not confident.

Prob the best thing about self launching and landing is that you're independent and can't get into trouble by somebody else's mistake. Eg, can only blame yourself for a fail.

There is always situations where it's tricky and a launch or land makes it easier and safer. For me that's the 10% and could be conditions, location, people or gear on the beach downwind etc.

If you don't have correct technique your kite will slide (drift launch) and could get damaged. So you need to master it.

I'm happy to launch and land kites for people who don't know how to do it themselves, or when it's going to be safer. Or even just to be a nice when I know the person can totally self launch/land.

Ive never denied a launch or land, but if your coming into an experience kiting area where most people launch and land themselves, and it's safe to do so..... watch, learn and give it a go when it's safe. . Feel free to ask or for demo, it's not hard.

I see a lot of people doing it wrong, and I also wasn't shown exactly how myself, which resulted it kite doing a little drift downwind before it launchs, but now I have it dialed for my kites. By walking more upwind while rotating kite during launch.

All kites are bit different, so what works for one model might be bit different for the next. And only work in some conditions.

Rant over, but self launching / landing is a skill that many kiters fail to learn until way to late.

But it's never to late to learn.

Green thumb if you agree, or would like to learn.




I know , I was taking the piss
He may be very experienced but clever?
If you could find a worse place to launch you'd be lucky,
He was definatly in a bowl effect with the spot he chose
Self launch and land has it's place, in fact any type
We've some great spots to kite here but you wouldn't see us launch or land , it's a decent tack to get back
Wind strengths arnt the best here for solo, no kidding your kite won't keep still on the beach without large amount of sand
stuntnaz
stuntnaz
NSW
540 posts
NSW, 540 posts
20 Dec 2015 7:22pm
cbulota said...
stuntnaz said..
I don't no why kite schools don't cover this it should be mandatory for all schools to teach self launching and landing . That way students can be made aware of all the ins and outs and what can go wrong and what to do when it goes pear shaped .







As far as self-launching is concerned, it's an advanced skill that has lots of potential for dangers, accidents and can damage the kite. The majority of students booking lessons simply don't develop sufficient skills or book enough lessons to justify teaching this skill. It's simply not a priority. However for the few who are ready, skilled, competent and confident enough, we do teach it. This is usually only after 3-4 lessons are done at least and it corresponds to roughly 5-10% of students. With kite beaches getting busier these days, self-launching should be discouraged as too many accidents can occur involving other kiters or even worse, members of the public.

Christian


There you go you can start a self landing and launching course . Which will give kite schools more revenue!!! Let's ask the the kite community what they think about this topic . I'll start a survey in the general section .
Plummet
Plummet
4862 posts
4862 posts
20 Dec 2015 6:07pm
cauncy said..
I'd pay good money watching someone self launch tonight
Double or quits for a self land

[;

Dune rejuvenation in a single day


Doesn't look too bad to me.... hell you even have teather launching poles!
Plummet
Plummet
4862 posts
4862 posts
20 Dec 2015 6:10pm
polykarb said..
That's not plummet in the above video, it's a more experienced Kiter from Taranaki...



Well dirty old kev is no longer more experienced. He pretty much gave up for 3 or 4 years. I think I've seen him once this year.
cauncy
cauncy
WA
8407 posts
WA, 8407 posts
20 Dec 2015 6:51pm
Plummet said...
cauncy said..
I'd pay good money watching someone self launch tonight
Double or quits for a self land

[;

Dune rejuvenation in a single day


Doesn't look too bad to me.... hell you even have teather launching poles!


40 knts onshore live reading and 50 offshore
I put in the posts for the locals and visitors
I've been kiting for a long while a self launch or land would of been dicing with paraplegia ,
However I'd put $100 on the table to watch you
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