Start here: Math for Landyacht design

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bajawind
bajawind
8 posts
8 posts
18 Jan 2009 12:44pm
I wanted to share this most exellent source of landyacht design information with you all. Very curious to hear about your L/W ratios...Topics include

www.rclandsailing.com/design.html#com

PLATFORM DESIGN TOPICS

Wheel Selection
Bearing Selection
Optimum Center of Mass (ballast location)
Expected Loads
Beam Bending Analysis Tool
Speedometer Setup
Generating down force with rear beam
Center of Lateral Resistance
Optimizing Length/Width Ratio for Maximum Righting Moment
Gizmo
Gizmo
SA
2865 posts
SA, 2865 posts
18 Jan 2009 3:34pm
Welcome to seabreeze... the link you have provided is worth a read and i will spend several hours around it....(my kinda stuff love it)
Please get involved in the forum as you will find it quite active and friendly and we would love to see pics of your yachts large and small and where you sail....
Welcome again Gordon.
GO Okie
GO Okie
17 posts
17 posts
20 Jan 2009 9:52am
Good site in fact I wen't and spent the $10 for a copy of the plans for the LS4 Mr Seluga mentioned that it can be sailed with just wing with out the fabric in higher winds. Pretty interesting stuff. I down loaded all the info even though some of it is to high tech for me. Yes, and welcome. I personaly have learned a book load of stuff from these fine good people.
landyacht
landyacht
WA
5921 posts
WA, 5921 posts
30 Jan 2009 8:45pm
from experience the longer length to width will give you that better top speed an compensate for the wheel in the air, But the pay off is in the lower acceleration,something Blokarts do really well. I once made an effort to walk around a claypan(playa) on which the only tracks were mine. the surface was pristine and glazed so the tracks were really good. the result was that when on 2 wheels there was always a degree of leewayAND increase in the width of the contact patch of the tyre. I would personally expect an increased load on the bearings to go with it.
looking back to the GPS readout for that track( oh what a wonderful machine it is) there was a drop each time in the speed to correspond,and a subsequent acceleration when the wheel touched down.
Result 2 wheels bad 3 wheels good
nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
30 Jan 2009 10:19pm
What a fantastic read!

Thanks for taking the time to document your findings. Excellent stuff.

I think the problem with your speed readings might be the 'debounce' circuit inside the bicycle speedometer. The smaller the wheel, the faster the pulses come in, and in your case the wheel is really small...

The easy solution is to just stick a GPS on your model. These have really come down in price, and give you a convenient way of analysing your tracks. I have found one invaluable in maximising my speed on the water, and I would be surprised if you didn't find one very useful once you figure out how to get it working properly. The garmin models are quite small and light. The NAVI models are a bit bigger and heavier, but are more accurate and less error-prone.

The harder solution would be to add a flip-flop circuit to the sensor, this would halve the speed at which pulses come in to your bike speedo so should double your recorded top speed once you calibrate the speedo properly (just double the wheel size).
Gizmo
Gizmo
SA
2865 posts
SA, 2865 posts
7 Feb 2009 10:11am
Hi there Gordon,
I have understood the principle of your steering but how is the steering system mechanically different from what is currently being used on yachts like blokarts and the lefroy mini?
Or is it that you have identified the definition of how a landyacht steering tracks when on 2 wheels?
lachlan3556
lachlan3556
VIC
1066 posts
VIC, 1066 posts
10 Feb 2009 4:41pm
If "counter-steering" is a term to describe what I think its describing (and I only picked this up as you mentioned your XR), around here everyone knows it as power sliding. Lean over, give some throttle and the handlebars will have to be pointing (relative to the rest of the bike) in the opposite direction to the turn as you drift around a corner. Lots of fun to do.

As we're now sailing a landyacht; Im guessing your pushing the rear end of the yacht around with the sail in stead of simply steering in the direction you wish to go. The term "counter-steering" has a couple wondering (myself included) what your actually describing/achieving. Am I anywhere close to describing reality here?
landyacht
landyacht
WA
5921 posts
WA, 5921 posts
10 Feb 2009 8:02pm
The photo is starting to make sense. When you lay the fork over that much without the pivot angle lining up with the contact point of the tyrethe yacht will display a tendency to bear away when hit by a gust. If you lift a wheel as well you get a strange effect where the yacht crabwalks downwind without the rear scuffing.
I built a yacht for the kids that did this , back in the mid 90's. It was odd to sail and when I finally sailed it myself,after the kids said they couldnt sail it,I realized what it was doing.. HOWEVER it did amazing 360's.
the effect of sheeting causing wheel lift would be due to the CE being well forward, possibly with quite a stiff mast.
this would be a similar thing that our class 6 yachts were like in the early 80's.
when racing the lads would bolt lumps of railway line to the rearaxle to keep it all down when racing .
Maybe you could show a sketch or photo of this kwikkat thing so we know what your describing
landyacht
landyacht
WA
5921 posts
WA, 5921 posts
12 Feb 2009 8:17pm
I get it now, you've made it wider and longer, with a tortional mast step. I should hope it does go a bit faster
I would worry about the foot position for the steeing.
I try to set up my feet / seat floor so that you heels can get a good base to sit on. Otherwise the yachts are just too twitchy. that woulnt be as much of a problem with the longer wider format.
I DO like the idea of a moveablle mast step on a mini though



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