Take 10 minutes and watch the whole thing. Lots of lessons here!


Here's a thread on YBW about it:
forums.ybw.com/index.php?threads/bavaria-capsizes-in-zumaya-country-vasque-spain.388524/

And why have them on the bow??

It looked like there were seven or eight people on board prior to the roll over. A fair few people to have on a 50 ft yacht. Maybe it was a charter yacht coming back from a day sail.

The music to the video I think induced a certain spookiness to what is observed. Four people went overboard during the knock down. Were any of them crew members that went overside to assist.

As it was coming in there were several people sitting on the cabin top that looked like lame ducks (day trip punters??).

From the looks of it the bar entry required braving the break and then a sharp turn to starboard into the harbour channel to avoid being dashed onto the beach or rocks on the left of the video.

I am sure the helmsman was doing his very best with steering and throttle but I did think he could have used more throttle to stay ahead of the swells and ride in on the back of the wave in front of him.

I am not a veteran of bar crossings but have done the Wide Bay Bar four times I think. I know I have been out three times and came in once. Conditions were good each time but it is still spooky and care needs to be taken.

With this crossing in the video, at least all seem to have been rescued which is a good ending.

Far be it from us to pass judgement. As QLDCruiser says, lots of lessons here!

It looks to me that they have an outgoing tide. Sure changes things if that is the case. Been across WBB several times and always picked the tide very carefully (near the top of the flood) except once. Crossed it outbound in full ebb.(brain on holidays. certainly wasn't being used for thinking) Scariest two hours of my life. And is it just me, or do those waves look rather impressive?

LooseChange said..

Mikemeriki said..
Is it just me, or do those waves look rather impressive?

Nope, they are very impressive as only the North Atlantic Ocean can be.
Equally amazing is that the people on the foredeck were not tossed into the water yet those in the cockpit, including the skipper were all tossed into the water. Very quick thinking by one of the crew saved the yacht from certain disaster even though it didn't look all that dangerous from the cameras point of view due to the narrow field of view.
I think anyone that uses that harbour deserves a medal.

Ah yes. The safety of the cockpit..... Or maybe not.

When you see the picture above, it makes it a lot easier to see why the yacht crew elected to keep on going in.

AquanMarine said..
I've never crossed a bar and found this video very interesting. Any skippers out there that do it often, can you please give us your top 5-10 tips for doing so safely?
Thanks.

1. Prepare your boat - close all vents and hatches, make it drown proof

2. Prepare your crew - Lifejackets on, only essential people near the helm, every one else in the cockpit out of the way. Ensure everyone knows what the plan B is in case it's needed. Have a plan B!

3. Assess the situation - Watch and observe what the waves and backwash are doing, check the wind, do all this before you get anywhere near the committal point. This is not a five minute casual glance, rather it is a careful observation of what is currently happening around you.

4. Pick a high tide as the waves will be fuller and fatter with less power and you will have more water under your keel

5. Keep the weight aft as you want the bow to be as bouyant as possible to prevent sticking it in and pitchpoling.

6. If you are at all religious or a gambler, now is the time to pray or to roll the dice as even with all the best plans and intent, things can still go very pear shaped and you will need to implement that plan B.

7. Lastly, if there is any doubt in your mind about your abilities in the current sittuation. ABORT!!! Wait for a better opportunity.

Going out is very different to coming in. Going out is much easier but remember that if you decide to go out and then have to turn around you are then turning across the waves and coming in in a situation that was too much to go out in. Bugger!!
In both situations even seemingly benign conditions can throw up a big wave that may break. Wear lifejackets, have the main hoisted so that if you lose the engine you have propulsion. Start of the flood tide is best but avoid going either way on an ebb tide. Spend a bit of time watching the situation to make sure the sets don't result in breaking waves.
I don't necessarily agree with some comments above about having people down below rather than on deck. If a boat rolls those down below will be battered/injured and if the boat doesn't right they may not be able to get out. The same with wearing harnesses, I don't think being tied to the boat is the best place to be as the boat rolls over and the mast digs into the bottom. On deck with lifejackets, in the cockpit and holding on would be my approach, accepting that others will have other views. I don't carry people who can't swim outside harbour.
Going out go at a steady pace, not so fast that you get airborne nor so slow that you lose steerage when stopped by a steep wave. As in surfing, go through the broken waves where they first broke where the energy has dissipated, go through the standing waves away from the breaking area. Having said that, if they are breaking you shouldn't be out there.
Coming in the big danger is broaching on a steep wave, usually because the boat is surfing too fast. Once on the bar areas go at a steady pace timing it to go between the wave crests, closer to the one in front so you ride the back of it. Towing a drogue of any description such as a warp, bucket or proper drogue will avoid you going too fast. Breaking waves from behind hitting the rudder will wrench it from your hands. If this happens you will struggle to avoid broaching. Again, if they are breaking you shouldn't be there.
Top of tide on the beginning of the flood, wear lifejackets, have the main up, keep everybody in the cockpit, go at a steady pace keeping up with the back of the wave in front when coming in and don't try it if there are breaking waves.

Great stuff guys, thanks very much.

Good points.
MB do you mean at the "end" of the flood tide (so there would be more water over the bar)?


Also find out before arriving at the bar what the tide over-run is, some places it can be up to 3 hrs.
cheers

Interesting to see that the two people that were able to stay on the boat were positioned towards the centre line of the boat before it rolled.
One person hanging onto the fore stay at the pulpit, the other in the centre of the cockpit.
Guess you are less likely to get thrown off in those positions because the boat movement is less exagerated when it rolls like it did.

Blue Moon, sorry about the confusion. Start of the flood maybe the wrong term to use.
You will have the deepest water over the bar at top of tide, but on many bars the water is flooding into the inlet very fast and this can be dangerous as you are doing a high speed just with the flow, plus your boats speed through the water. In my view it is best to go in soon after (say an hour) the flow starts flooding in. You have a still rising tide and not too much inflow for speed control. At the end of the flood you have a falling tide at the entrance and if you miss time it you could end up going in at the beginning of the ebb tide. Others may prefer going in at top of tide and if the entrance is shallow obviously you need to consider this.
Due to overrun, top and bottom of tide don't coincide with the flow of water so you really should think in terms of the tidal flow rather than tide position. As noted previously the overrun can vary depending on the amount of water behind the inlet, tide height and volume of water that can flow through the inlet. At Forster the overrun is maybe 3 hours, give or take some for different tide heights etc. Water will start flowing into Wallis lake about 3 hours after low tide. Probably the same at Swansea Channel.
A good way to think about this, explained very well by Lucas, is to assume that the water level doesn't change much inside the lake. As the tide outside rises from the bottom it takes about half the time to reach the same level as in the lake. The next half of the tide movement the level outside rises above the level in the lake so is flooding into the lake. On the way down the level outside is still above the level inside the lake for about half the tidal range so the tide is flooding in but getting slower as the levels approach each other. The level outside then goes below the level inside so the water starts flowing out of the lake starting the ebb tidal flow. And so on. Clear as mud. Draw it on a piece of paper and it becomes clear.
Understanding the rule of twelfths for tides is also very useful.