C-Map or Navionics for tablet?

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sirgallivant
sirgallivant
NSW
1531 posts
NSW, 1531 posts
3 Sep 2015 9:37am
The barky has a C-MAP chart in the plotter which l am happy with.
I thought l am going to back it up with a tablet. Just because l can. Downloaded Plan2Nav - C-MAP's own Android app. - and from then on everything went pear shaped. It was very hard to register then the trial map-download was sluggish and slow. After three hours struggle l started plotting a route which was impossible to modify or re do.
In the mean time downloaded Navionics for a trial period and plotted and modified a route. No worries. They have a HELP file. C-MAP does not.
I like C-MAP because it is not a yearly renewable map download like Nav. but it is almost impossible to work. Sluggish, slow, non-responsive.

Did any of the esteemed members have any experience with C-MAP and Plan2Nav?
Am l doing something wrong?

sirgallivant
sirgallivant
NSW
1531 posts
NSW, 1531 posts
4 Sep 2015 11:29pm
Does any of you heard of C-MAP? At all?

Toph
Toph
WA
1889 posts
WA, 1889 posts
5 Sep 2015 12:12am
I have C-Map and am happy with it. I can't comment on what you're trying to achieve because I wouldn't know.

I do like Navionics on my tablet too, but I have never tried to use C-Maps on it. All I do is work out where I want to go on the tablet at home. Then over a beer on the boat, I transfer the course (manually) onto the chart plotter. Not the most efficient way, but I enjoy it.
Ambler
Ambler
TAS
123 posts
TAS, 123 posts
5 Sep 2015 6:38am
Cmap and Navionics are an interpretation of the real thing, ie charts produced by the RAN Hydrographic section.
Hop on line and check out www.memory-map.com.au They sell a charting package that use the real thing, ie scanned RAN Charts. You can download the charts for the Eastern half of Australia on their site as well as the pc software, memory map app for ipads or android phones and tabs. You can choose to licence up to 5 gadgets for a really reasonable price about $200.
Nothing beats the real charts or images of them. You can also subscribe to the Aus hydro website for notice to mariners chart updates via email for free.
Well I have used all three nav packages above and the first two are really poor in comparison to memory map
Wayne
Yara
Yara
NSW
1322 posts
NSW, 1322 posts
5 Sep 2015 7:09am
C-Map was the one used by the VOR yacht to run aground on a shoal off Africa, which was only visible if you zoomed in. Memory map sounds good, if a little expensive compared to Navionics.
Ambler
Ambler
TAS
123 posts
TAS, 123 posts
5 Sep 2015 4:58pm
Yara said...
C-Map was the one used by the VOR yacht to run aground on a shoal off Africa, which was only visible if you zoomed in. Memory map sounds good, if a little expensive compared to Navionics.


There are plenty of other features missed around the world when the charts get digitised by non mariners and usually underpaid third world CAD operators doing a mindlessly boring task of tracing every detail of a paper chart.

If you could do your voyage planning with Navionics on the tablet or computer then upload the routes and waypoints to the boats GPS then you could compare the two programs. I used to plan my voyages on paper charts and transfer the waypoints so Memory Map was a natural progression for me. I still wonder if the state authorities will approve a digital chart over a paper chart if they were to conduct a safety equipment inspection?
Wayne
sirgallivant
sirgallivant
NSW
1531 posts
NSW, 1531 posts
5 Sep 2015 6:11pm
Yes Ambler, thanks for your input, that was the reason l bought C-MAP, the chart datum based on WGS84.
I am a chart-person, l still use paper charts and when l bought my barky with a chart plotter but no card in it, l chose C-MAP on it's WGS84 merit after buying the paper charts of the east coast of Oz.
The progression from there was natural, first to learn how to use it?
The web site of the AHO is a permanent feature on my tablet.

Yarra, if one is not using the tools in his hands correctly, well, unfortunate it might be, but he can not blame the programs creator. Where were his paper charts when he run aground near Africa. Why he was not aware of the features of his plotter?

All ENC's are notorious of hiding datum on different layers of zooming. This was the first thing l ever learned about ENC's.

The reasons why l bother with C-MAP is, firstly, because l got one on the plotter which l like. Secondly, because l thought, if l could have the same charts on my tablet l could plot away from the yacht and - thirdly - use it as a back up while navigating. I have two GPS's on the boat, so l don't really need it on board.

I was - as l pointed out - after members experiences with C-MAP's android application called Plan2Nav?
I am not able to come to terms with it for either, my inability to operate it, or it's inherent problems. ln the mean time, l mastered basic Navionics - to prove to myself that l am not a total incompetent - while struggling with Plan2Nav and getting nowhere.
This is the peccant part, l would like to have some light shed on by someone with experience with the Plan2Nav application, if possible.

Thanks for the idea about MemoryMap. Point taken.
Also, l read the AHO web site extensively and the present standing on ENC's is very interesting. Please read it yourself, it is way too long and complicated to quote.
In the present in NSW, paper charts rule offshore!
(for small craft, that is! )

cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
6 Sep 2015 12:37am

This discussion has gotten away from comparing C-Map And Navionics, both using vector charts (fully digital charts which are layered, ie when you zoom in you go to a different chart) to becoming a comparison between vector charts and raster charts (scanned paper charts with which the detail does not change when zoomed in).

Some Nav programs using raster charts may go to a larger scale map when zoomed in but I am not aware of any that do.

Each has their pros and cons.

As most raster charts are scanned copies of eg RAN Hydro-graphic Service charts, one might assume they would be a legal alternative to carrying hard copy paper charts. Seems logical but I do not know for sure.

As far as I am aware C-Map is widely used in commercial shipping and accepted as an international standard. However I believe commercial ships pay many thousands of dollars for their nav software and charts which would include real time updates of charts as they happen.

For us guys here who do not have huge budgets, we have to nut out what within our budget will serve our individual purposes best. For one to fully rely on Navionics downloaded onto a smart phone, iPad or Android tablet, I believe is a foolish thing to do and contravenes the terms of agreement which one agrees to each time he opens the program ie the program is not to be used for navigation purposes. So we say, yeah, yeah, yeah and use it for precisely that.

A case in point. I have Navionics on my Lenovo 9" quad core tablet with plenty of memory, GPS and WiFi. It is giving me grief in that most times when I zoom in it will not go to the next layer map, and most times when I zoom in maximum and then zoom out, it will not even go to the base map. I have not worked out yet whether it is a problem with Navionics or the processing power of the tablet.

Has anybody else had similar problems with Navionics on a different or same mobile device as mine??
Ambler
Ambler
TAS
123 posts
TAS, 123 posts
6 Sep 2015 5:14am
I was hoping to get plan2nav app on my samsung tab working too as I have Cmaps of the world. I couldn't get it to work so gave up. There is a Beta test of OpenCPN available for android that will run Cmap ecs. I guess the full app will be released soon.
My Aus NZ Navionics subscription just expired, I thought I had signed up for life until I ran the latest update. Ah well wont be renewing that! And I received no thanks for my contributions to them either.

All the best with what you decide fits your situation and budget.
cheers
Ambler
Ambler
TAS
123 posts
TAS, 123 posts
6 Sep 2015 5:39am
cisco said...

This discussion has gotten away from comparing C-Map And Navionics, both using vector charts (fully digital charts which are layered, ie when you zoom in you go to a different chart) to becoming a comparison between vector charts and raster charts (scanned paper charts with which the detail does not change when zoomed in).

Some Nav programs using raster charts may go to a larger scale map when zoomed in but I am not aware of any that do.


Memory Map do zoom into the next scale chart. In fact if you are navigating on one chart and see a purple line or purple bordered box, it indicates there is another chart available within that purple border. You know to zoom in.
I haven't seen that feature on vector charts yet.

Sorry for the thread drift but I feel somehow responsible as a hydrographic surveyor (retired) if I don't point out pros and cons of different ecs. I hate hearing about situations that could have been avoided due to user error.

cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
6 Sep 2015 6:14pm
Ambler said..

Memory Map do zoom into the next scale chart. In fact if you are navigating on one chart and see a purple line or purple bordered box, it indicates there is another chart available within that purple border. You know to zoom in.
I haven't seen that feature on vector charts yet.

Sorry for the thread drift but I feel somehow responsible as a hydrographic surveyor (retired) if I don't point out pros and cons of different ecs. I hate hearing about situations that could have been avoided due to user error.



Vector charts won't show that there is a deeper layer until you zoom in to it, at least on the ones I have seen.

As a retired hydrographic surveyor please feel free to tip your brains out on the table here so we can pick through them.
Charriot
Charriot
QLD
880 posts
QLD, 880 posts
6 Sep 2015 6:57pm
sometimes ago we discussed this topic
last info I recieved through coast guard, was that,
In QLD is no longer compulsory to carry paper charts
sirgallivant
sirgallivant
NSW
1531 posts
NSW, 1531 posts
6 Sep 2015 9:43pm
It is unfortunate, that my original intention of asking about Jeppesens Plan2Nav android app.was misunderstood.
I got no intention to discuss charts at all.

To correct this l am starting a fresh thread.

Ambler
Ambler
TAS
123 posts
TAS, 123 posts
7 Sep 2015 6:16am
cisco said...
Ambler said..

Memory Map do zoom into the next scale chart. In fact if you are navigating on one chart and see a purple line or purple bordered box, it indicates there is another chart available within that purple border. You know to zoom in.
I haven't seen that feature on vector charts yet.

Sorry for the thread drift but I feel somehow responsible as a hydrographic surveyor (retired) if I don't point out pros and cons of different ecs. I hate hearing about situations that could have been avoided due to user error.



Vector charts won't show that there is a deeper layer until you zoom in to it, at least on the ones I have seen.

As a retired hydrographic surveyor please feel free to tip your brains out on the table here so we can pick through them.


Feel free to ask me anything. PM me if you wish.

ChrisJ1978
ChrisJ1978
NSW
57 posts
NSW, 57 posts
8 Sep 2015 3:20am
I recently purchased Navionics HD for my iPad. The Au & NZ charts were $69.95 with a years worth of updates. I find the auto routing engine is pretty good although it doesn't like long passages (i.e. Sydney to Lord Howe island). The chart itself has lots of information, heaps more than my ancient paper charts.
knight
knight
NSW
60 posts
NSW, 60 posts
8 Sep 2015 8:39am
It is probably worth mentioning at this point that the RAN hydrographic section no longer produce RNCs (Raster Navigation Charts otherwise known as scanned paper charts)

The only electronic charts the Hydro section sell are ENCs (Electronic Navigation Charts) these use the s63 encoding and can be read by any compatible program,such as OpenCPN. These are available in various "packs" depending on your usage requirements. For most of us on these forums that would likely be the "Coastal Pack" these cover all ports within their coverage area plus some distance seaward and are sold on a 12month licence for $70.

Is that more expensive than Navionics? If yes up are doing a round Australia trip, yes, but these are designed to be used for Navigation (unlike the warning on Navionics - which I imagine we all pay good attention to.....) and for most of us a single coastal pack will cover our needs with no issues. Considering that is what Navionics charge I would recommend everyone seriously consider if you could shift to Hydro's charts.

OpenCPN runs on the Raspberry Pi, so for $50 +a screen ($40) plus the appropriate coastal pack from Hydro you can have a navigation system that is updated every 2 weeks with the regular Notice to Mariners.
sirgallivant
sirgallivant
NSW
1531 posts
NSW, 1531 posts
9 Sep 2015 7:47pm
Ambler, l am eternally grateful to you putting me on Memory Map!
It is the ducks guts, for me.
That was what l longed for. Thanks a lot.

I have cmap on my plotter (WGS84) and now l can have fun plotting to my lifes content on MM which is transferred to my paper charts. This way l am covered for most occasions reasonably cheaply and legally covered to boot.
Fair winds !

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