Hunter

> 10 years ago
Reply
Register to post, see what you've read, and subscribe to topics.
southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
7 Jan 2014 5:09pm
http://yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/hunter-42/137447

G'day

I'm looking at upgrading from 37 ft live-aboard to 40 to 50 ft.

Has anyone had experience with hunter I believe they are large volume and sail reasonably well?

The link above seems quite appealing I like the washing machine and dive platform.

Regards

southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
8 Jan 2014 7:16pm
Under contract! That was quick sale!
LooseChange
LooseChange
NSW
2140 posts
NSW, 2140 posts
8 Jan 2014 9:29pm
Nice looking boat, nice price ......

Ya lose some .... and then ya lose some more
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
9 Jan 2014 12:09am
Nice yacht but you gotta ask yourself "Can I afford the upkeep??"
southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
9 Jan 2014 1:05am
cisco said..

Nice yacht but you gotta ask yourself "Can I afford the upkeep??"


I'm tossing up to buy an apartment or go to a larger yacht.....at least with a larger yacht it comes furnished, I can move if I don't like the neighbours, I don't have to pay council rates, body corporate , power and water bills........Upkeep I can do all myself , costs would be insurance, berthing, breakdowns and anual servicing products. All my eggs in one basket!
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
9 Jan 2014 1:28am
Right.............

History shows us that in the medium to long term, real estate goes up in value and yachts go down in value.

That yacht is not very old and when new it would have sold for close to half a mill and it has just sold for $170,000. Hmmmmm. That is a bit of a statement.

You can rent an apartment out and the tenant pays all the costs of ownership and there will be some money left over that should cover the costs of upkeep of your present yacht.

In ten years time the value of the apartment will most likely double. This give you great equity to buy another apartment or you could sell it, pay a small amount of capital gains tax and probably have $320,000 in your mitt.

I was talking with Greg Gilliam, the rigger on the Sunshine Coast some years ago when he was doing the new rigging for my Peterson 42. I was asking him about his experiences as professional crew on various yachts around the world.

He let me in on a great little secret. He told me that every owner of yachts he had crewed on held to a simple rule which was "Never let the value of your yacht or yachts exceed 10% of your nett worth."

One of the owners had two yachts worth $3mil each and he held to that rule.

So, what is going to rule??? Your head, your heart or that thing hanging down between your legs??
Dezman
Dezman
NSW
818 posts
NSW, 818 posts
9 Jan 2014 3:35am
cisco said..

Right.............

History shows us that in the medium to long term, real estate goes up in value and yachts go down in value.

That yacht is not very old and when new it would have sold for close to half a mill and it has just sold for $170,000. Hmmmmm. That is a bit of a statement.

You can rent an apartment out and the tenant pays all the costs of ownership and there will be some money left over that should cover the costs of upkeep of your present yacht.

In ten years time the value of the apartment will most likely double. This give you great equity to buy another apartment or you could sell it, pay a small amount of capital gains tax and probably have $320,000 in your mitt.

I was talking with Greg Gilliam, the rigger on the Sunshine Coast some years ago when he was doing the new rigging for my Peterson 42. I was asking him about his experiences as professional crew on various yachts around the world.

He let me in on a great little secret. He told me that every owner of yachts he had crewed on held to a simple rule which was "Never let the value of your yacht or yachts exceed 10% of your nett worth."

One of the owners had two yachts worth $3mil each and he held to that rule.

So, what is going to rule??? Your head, your heart or that thing hanging down between your legs??


I disagree with everything Cisco wrote but he is not wrong in his opinion.
Iv met lots of sensible people who make good investment choices, and I look into their eyes and listen to their voice and I don't see or hear any passion! I poke them to see if they are alive, I think of all the possibility's they could do with the money saved and what do they do? Save more.
A sailor should never hold back spending his last dollar on the 'boat', dreaming of sailing free on the ocean.
But wait do you want to sail over the horizon or would a house boat do the trick?
Ramona
Ramona
NSW
7757 posts
NSW, 7757 posts
9 Jan 2014 9:42am
Cisco is correct of course. Selling up and sailing away is not a smart move now and probably never was.

The problem that seems to be starting is the establishments view on live aboards. Locally they are tolerated for short periods but I can see a time in the near future where regulations will prohibit this all together in some places. We have a father and son living on a double ender in the Shoalhaven. They move about a bit and last I heard were up at Nowra. The MSB move them along every now and then. There biggest problem is they don't have a postal address! They did spend a few weeks in Sydney harbour anchored amongst other live aboards and were never hassled! Locally however I think the problem comes from local residents objecting to the cruisers blocking their views.
Getting a mooring locally is cheap and easy. The only limitation is the boat has to be tidy and preferably good looking!
I also hold to the 10% value point and would add that I would never buy a yacht that I could not afford to lose. Lost at sea I would be dead anyway!
3rd party insurance cover only to cover the other bloke.
crustysailor
crustysailor
VIC
871 posts
VIC, 871 posts
9 Jan 2014 10:37am

southace,my 2c....

if you can afford to do it and it makes you happy, do it.

You've got a yacht now worth $xxx, this is an upgrade.

Yes you may actually lose money in the long run (ok probably will), but it's given you pleasure, and sorry but at the end of the day, we're here once, it's not a trial run.

If you buy it and sell in 12months having to downsize again, so what.

And for the record, my last boat was purchased for $25,000, and sold for $42,000 about 18 months ago.
Yes of course I spent money on I over the years, but I did all maintenance and upgrades myself, learning as we went, we had great fun and use of it for about 6 years of ownership so in the end, how do you gauge what it 'cost'?

southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
9 Jan 2014 11:49am
I think the point missing is that if I buy a apartment I'm still planing on keeping the yacht which I pay marina fees and would not look at putting on a swing morning. So therefore I have done the sums and it seems to work out more logical to buy a larger yacht and keep all my bills and running costs together like I have been for the past 5 years.

Option 2 is to move into apartment sell current yacht.... Wait 5 years sell apartment then go to bigger yacht..... If I added up the power bills, water rates ,council and body corporate over 5 years I'm sure it would come close the added vale to the original purchace........problem here is I wouldn't have a yacht for 5 years so really why bother?

I can see it being a long and messy process moving into apartment buying all furniture selling current yacht etc.....with economic times the way they are going I'm not really sure real estate is going to be the same in 5 to 10 years I think something is going to break in our system soon!
Offthegrid
Offthegrid
WA
127 posts
WA, 127 posts
9 Jan 2014 9:35am
Go for it Southace!
Here are some good reasons to get off the grid. Bit of a read but interesting...

End of Fed Cred

It must be scary to be a Federal Reserve governor. You have to pretend that you know what you???re doing when, in fact, Fed policy appears completely divorced from any sense of consequence, or cause-and-effect, or reality ??? and if it turns out you???re not so smart, and your policies and interventions undermine true economic resilience, then the scuttling of the most powerful civilization in the history of the world might be your fault ??? even if you went to Andover and wear tortoise-shell glasses that make you appear to be smart.

The Fed painted itself into a corner the last few years by making Quantitative Easing a permanent feature of the financial landscape. QE backstops everything now. Tragically, additional backdoor backstopping extends beyond the QE official figures (as of December 2013) of $85 billion a month. American money (or credit) is being shoveled into anything and everything, including foreign banks and probably foreign treasuries. It???s just another facet of the prevailing pervasive dishonesty infecting the system that we have no idea, really, how much money is being shoveled and sprinkled around. Anything goes and nothing matters. However, since there is an official consensus that you can???t keep QE money-pumping up forever, the Fed officially made a big show of seeking to begin ending it. So in the Spring of 2013 they announced their intention to ???taper??? their purchases of US Treasury paper and mortgage paper, possibly in the fall.

Well, it turned out they didn???t or couldn???t taper. As the fall equinox approached, with everyone keenly anticipating the first dose of taper, the equity markets wobbled and the interest rate on the 10-year treasury ??? the index for mortgage loans and car loans ??? climbed to 3.00 percent from its May low of 1.63 ??? well over 100 basis points ??? and the Fed chickened out. No September taper. Fake out. So, the markets relaxed, the interest rate on the 10-year went back down, and the equity markets resumed their grand ramp into the Christmas climax. However, the Fed???s credibility took a hit, especially after all their confabulating bull**** ???forward guidance??? in the spring and summer when they couldn???t get their taper story straight. And in the meantime, the Larry-Summers-for-Fed-Chair float unfloated, and Janet Yellen was officially picked to succeed Ben Bernanke, with her reputation as an extreme easy money softie (more QE, more ZIRP), and a bunch of hearings were staged to make the Bernanke-Yellen transition look more reassuring.

And then on December 18, outgoing chair Bernanke announced, with much fanfare, that the taper would happen after all, early in the first quarter of 2014 ????? after he is safely out of his office in the Eccles building and back in his bomb shelter on the Princeton campus. The Fed meant it this time, the public was given to understand.

The only catch here, as I write, after the latest taper announcement, is that interest on the 10-year treasury note has crept stealthily back up over 3 percent. Wuh-oh. Not a good sign, since it means more expensive mortgages and car loans, which happen to represent the two things that the current economy relies on to appear ???normal.??? (House sales and car sales = normal in a suburban sprawl economy.)

I think the truth is the Fed just did too darn much QE and ZIRP and they waited way too long to cut it out, and now they can???t end it without scuttling both the stock and bond markets. But they can???t really go forward with the taper, either. A rock and a hard place. So, my guess is that they???ll pretend to taper in March, and then they???ll just as quickly un-taper. Note the curious report out of the American Enterprise Institute ten days ago by John H. Makin saying that the Fed???s actual purchase of debt paper amounted to an average $94 billion a month through the year 2013, not $85 billion. Which would pretty much negate the proposed taper of $5 billion + $5 billion (Treasury paper + Mortgage paper).

And in so faking and so doing they may succeed in completely destroying the credibility of the Federal Reserve. When that happens, capital will be disappearing so efficiently that the USA will find itself in a compressive deflationary spiral ??? because that???s what happens when faith in the authority behind credit is destroyed, and new loans to cover the interest on old loans are no longer offered in the non-government banking system, and old loans can???t be serviced. At which point the Federal Reserve freaks out and announces new extra-special QE way above the former 2013 level of $85 billion a month, and the government chips in with currency controls. And that sets in motion the awful prospect of the dreaded ???crack-up boom??? into extraordinary inflation, when dollars turn into hot potatoes and people can???t get rid of them fast enough. Well, is that going to happen this year? It depends on how spooked the Fed gets. In any case, there is a difference between high inflation and hyper-inflation. High inflation is bad enough to provoke socio-political convulsion. I don???t really see how the Fed gets around this March taper bid without falling into the trap I???ve just outlined. It wouldn???t be a pretty situation for poor Ms. Janet Yellen, but nobody forced her to take the job, and she???s had the look all along of a chump, the perfect sucker to be left holding a big honking bag of flop.

We???re long overdue for a return to realistic pricing in all markets. The Government and its handmaiden, the Fed, have tweaked the machinery so strenuously for so long that these efforts have entered the wilderness of diminishing returns. Instead of propping up the markets, all they can accomplish now is further erosion of the credibility of the equity markets and the Fed itself ??? and that bodes darkly for a money system that is essentially run on faith. I think the indexes have topped. The ???margin??? (money borrowed to buy stock) in the system is at dangerous, historically unprecedented highs. There may be one final reach upward in the first quarter. Then the equities crater, if not sooner. I still think the Dow and S &P could oversell by 90 percent of their value if the falsehoods of the post-2008 interventions stopped working their hoodoo on the collective wishful consciousness.

The worldwide rise in interest rates holds every possibility for igniting a ****storm in interest rate swaps and upsetting the whole apple-cart of shadow banking and derivatives. That would be a bullet in the head to the TBTF banks, and would therefore lead to a worldwide crisis. In that event, the eventual winners would be the largest holders of gold, who could claim to offer the world a trustworthy gold-backed currency, especially for transactions in vital resources like oil. That would, of course, be China. The process would be awfully disorderly and fraught with political animus. Given the fact that China???s own balance sheet is hopelessly non-transparent and part-and-parcel of a dishonest crony banking system, China would have to use some powerful smoke-and-mirrors to assume that kind of dominant authority. But in the end, it comes down to who has the real goods, and who screwed up (the USA, Europe, Japan) and China, for all its faults and perversities, has the gold.

The wholesale transfer of gold tonnage from the West to the East was one of the salient events of 2013. There were lots of conspiracy theories as to what drove the price of gold down by 28 percent. I do think the painful move was partly a cyclical correction following the decade-long run up to $1900 an ounce. Within that cyclical correction, there was a lot of room for the so-called ???bullion banks??? to pound the gold and silver prices down with their shorting orgy. Numerous times the past year, somebody had laid a fat finger on the ???sell??? key, like, at four o???clock in the morning New York time when no traders were in their offices, and the record of those weird transactions is plain to see in the daily charts. My own theory is that an effort was made ??? in effect, a policy ??? to suppress the gold price via collusion between the Fed, the US Treasury, the bullion banks, and China, as a way to allow China to accumulate gold to offset the anticipated loss of value in the US Treasury paper held by them, throwing China a big golden bone, so to speak ??? in other words, to keep China from getting hugely pissed off. The gold crash had the happy effect for the US Treasury of making the dollar appear strong at a time when many other nations were getting sick of US dollar domination, especially in the oil markets, and were threatening to instigate a new currency regime by hook or by crook. Throwing China the golden bone is also consistent with the USA???s official position that gold is a meaningless barbaric relic where national currencies are concerned, and therefore nobody but the barbaric yellow hordes of Asia would care about it.

Other nations don???t feel that way. Russia and Switzerland have been accumulating gold like crazy at bargain prices this year. Lat year, Germany requested its sovereign gold cache (300 tons) to be returned from the vaults in America, where it was stored through all the decades of the cold war, safe from the reach of the Soviets. But American officials told the Germans it would take seven years to accomplish the return. Seven years ! ! ! WTF? Is there a shortage of banana boats? The sentiment in goldville is that the USA long ago ???leased??? or sold off or rehypothecated or lost that gold. Anyway, Germany???s 300 tons was a small fraction of the 6,700 tons supposedly held in the Fed???s vaults. Who knows? No auditors have been allowed into the Fed vaults to actually see what???s up with the collateral. This in and of itself ought to make the prudent nervous.

I think we???re near the end of these reindeer games with gold, largely because so many vaults in the West have been emptied. That places constraints on further shenanigans in the paper gold (and silver) markets. In an environment where both the destructive forces of deflation and inflation can be unleashed in sequence, uncertainty is the greatest motivator, trumping the usual greed and fear seen in markets that can be fairly measured against stable currencies. In 2014, the public has become aware of the bank ???bail-in??? phenomenon which, along with rehypothication schemes, just amounts to the seizure of customer and client accounts ??? a really new wrinkle in contemporary banking relations. Nobody knows if it???s safe to park cash money anywhere except inside the mattress. The precedent set in Cyprus, and the MF Global affair, and other confiscation events, would tend to support an interest in precious metals held outside the institutional framework. Uncertainty rules.

Miscellany

I get a lot of email on the subject of Bitcoin. Here???s how I feel about it.
It???s an even more abstract form of ???money??? than fiat currencies or securities based on fiat currencies. Do we need more abstraction in our economic lives? I don???t think so. I believe the trend will be toward what is real. For the moment, Bitcoin seems to be enjoying some success as it beats back successive crashes. I???m not very comfortable with the idea of investing in an algorithm. I don???t see how it is impervious to government hacking. In fact, I???d bet that somewhere in the DOD or the NSA or the CIA right now some nerd is working on that. Bitcoin is provoking imitators, other new computer ???currencies.??? Why would Bitcoin necessarily enjoy dominance? And how many competing algorithmic currencies can the world stand? Wouldn???t that defeat the whole purpose of an alternative ???go to??? currency? All I can say is that I???m not buying Bitcoins.




Elsewhere in the World

Globalism, in the Tom Friedman euphoric sense, is unwinding. Currency wars are wearing down the players, conflicts and tensions are breaking out where before there were only Wal-Mart share price triumphs and Foxconn profits. Both American and European middle-classes are too exhausted financially to continue the consumer orgy of the early millennium. The trade imbalances are horrific. Unpayable debt saturates everything. Sick economies will weigh down commodity prices except for food-related things. The planet Earth has probably reached peak food production, including peak fertilizer. Supplies of grain will be inadequate in 2014 to feed the still-expanding masses of the poor places in the world.

The nervous calm in finance and economies since 2008 has its mirror in the relative calm of the political scene. Uprisings and skirmishes have broken out, but nothing that so far threatens the peace between great powers. There have been the now-historic revolts in Egypt, Libya, Syria, and other Middle East and North African (MENA) states. Iraq is once again disintegrating after a decade of American ???nation-building.??? Greece is falling apart. Spain and Italy should be falling apart but haven???t yet. France is sinking into bankruptcy. The UK is in on the grift with the USA and insulated from the Euro, but the British Isles are way over-populated with a volatile multi-ethnic mix and not much of an economy outside the financial district of London. There were riots in ??? of all places ??? Sweden this year. Turkey entered crisis just a few weeks ago along with Ukraine.

I predict more colorful political strife in Europe this year, boots in the street, barricades, gunfire, and bombs. The populations of these countries will want relief measures from their national governments, but the sad news is that these governments are broke, so austerity seems to be the order of the day no matter what. I think this will prod incipient revolts in a rightward nationalist direction. If it was up to Marine LePen???s rising National Front party, they would solve the employment problem by expelling all the recent immigrants ??? though the mere attempt would probably provoke widespread race war in France.

The quarrel between China and Japan over the Senkaku Islands is a diversion from the real action in the South China Sea, said to hold large underwater petroleum reserves. China is the world???s second greatest oil importer. Their economy and the credibility of its non-elected government depends on keeping the oil supply up. They are a long way from other places in the world where oil comes from, hence their eagerness to secure and dominate the South China Sea. The idea is that China would make a fuss over the Senkaku group, get Japan and the US to the negotiating table, and cede the dispute over them to Japan in exchange for Japan and the US supporting China???s claims in the South China Sea against the other neighbors there: Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia, and the Philippines.

The catch is that Japan may be going politically insane just now between the rigors of (Shinzo) Abenomics and the mystical horrors of ****ushima. Japan???s distress appears to be provoking a new mood of nationalist militarism of a kind not seen there since the 1940s. They???re talking about arming up, rewriting the pacifist articles in their constitution. Scary, if you have a memory of the mid-20th century. China should know something about national psychotic breaks, having not so long ago endured the insanity of Mao Zedong???s Cultural Revolution (1966-71). So they might want to handle Japan with care. On the other hand, China
felixdcat
felixdcat
WA
3519 posts
WA, 3519 posts
9 Jan 2014 10:20am
At the end if it makes you happy do it!
Remember that when you go to the big archipelago in the clouds you won't be able to take your $ with you! So what the hell ! Spend it on you!
PS no disrespect intended as I do not know your age Just my opinion.
spongeblob
spongeblob
NSW
218 posts
NSW, 218 posts
9 Jan 2014 1:36pm
Thanks Aquanmarine, interesting reading, im not going to pretend I totally understand it but interesting all the same. Southace, if you've got kids buy property, if you don't, buy a big boat and live aboard.
jev7337
jev7337
QLD
460 posts
QLD, 460 posts
9 Jan 2014 1:46pm
AquanMarine said..

........

The catch is that Japan may be going politically insane just now between the rigors of (Shinzo) Abenomics and the mystical horrors of ****ushima. Japan???s distress appears to be provoking a new mood of nationalist militarism of a kind not seen there since the 1940s. They???re talking about arming up, rewriting the pacifist articles in their constitution. Scary, if you have a memory of the mid-20th century. China should know something about national psychotic breaks, having not so long ago endured the insanity of Mao Zedong???s Cultural Revolution (1966-71). So they might want to handle Japan with care. On the other hand, China


Take it all with a few gains of salt. The whole article a mean not just the above.

Anyways, what's happening in China? Can you post the rest of the article? It appears the rest got cut out. Database field character restriction I guess.
theace
theace
NSW
70 posts
NSW, 70 posts
9 Jan 2014 6:53pm
Great article AquanMarine where exactly did you get this information from ? would be keen to learn more.thanks.
Disralei
Disralei
NSW
127 posts
NSW, 127 posts
9 Jan 2014 10:08pm
Copy and paste part of the article into Google, you will find the authour.
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
10 Jan 2014 1:06am
On the topic of whether to buy real estate or buy a bigger yacht, it really comes down to the mindset of the individual and his/her personal choices.

It has been said by a very wise person that "There is only one success in life and it lies in living your life in your own way."

Some say "Just Do It" which is all well and good depending on what the "It" is.

Many "Its" require more than desire, passion and will. Most "Its" require "resources" as well, and yachting, whether it be racing OR cruising, springs to mind as being one "It" that requires considerable resources if you want to be the "Captain of your own Ship".

Being "Captain of my own Ship" is the only thing I am prepared to accept and I am only prepared to accept doing it with a certain amount of style. I enjoy crewing and Captaining other people's ships but only as a fill in between voyages on my own ship.

Some would view my earlier comments and 10% of nett worth strategy as being conservative and lacking "passion". If you really think about it you will see that it is quite the opposite.

Let's say you are on the Grand Adventure, racing or cruising, sailing around and having a ball and you somehow lose it. You survive but the yacht is gone, finito, kaput. If you have followed the 10% strategy, you have the resources to go again, get another yacht and continue the adventure and keep the "passion" alive.

If the experience scared the hell out of you, at least you are not on the bones of your backside and you can afford to get a land yacht and a motor home and a sports car and a plane ticket.

Another consideration is the fairer sex. The one thing they ALL want is security and the 10% strategy gives them that.
Dezman
Dezman
NSW
818 posts
NSW, 818 posts
10 Jan 2014 3:21am
cisco said..

On the topic of whether to buy real estate or buy a bigger yacht, it really comes down to the mindset of the individual and his/her personal choices.

It has been said by a very wise person that "There is only one success in life and it lies in living your life in your own way."

Some say "Just Do It" which is all well and good depending on what the "It" is.


Let's say you are on the Grand Adventure, racing or cruising, sailing around and having a ball and you somehow lose it. You survive but the yacht is gone, finito, kaput. If you have followed the 10% strategy, you have the resources to go again, get another yacht and continue the adventure and keep the "passion" alive.
.


'Living your life your own way' how true and take my advice I'm not using it!
I'm glad we are all different and some like myself a lot, as in implosive even to a point of reckless.
I'm impressed with people who live, that are doing what they want regardless of costs or what others think. It pains me to hear 'I wish' 'if only' 'one day'
I would agree with the 10% rule if you got $500,000 then a $50,000 yacht would do the trick and take off. However most cruisers have their life in the boat and live for the day, for me having my boat stocked and well equipped gives me security.
As for losing everything, what a sh-t way to live! Always in fear and never trusting fate.
I guess what's great about 'the forum' is we all get to share our perspective and see how others live too.
Ramona
Ramona
NSW
7757 posts
NSW, 7757 posts
10 Jan 2014 8:31am
Being prepared to lose your yacht is the opposite of fear!
MorningBird
MorningBird
NSW
2711 posts
NSW, 2711 posts
10 Jan 2014 11:12am
Be very wary of economic or financial advice on a sailors forum. Sailors are not usually the smartest of financial minds.
Aquanmarine post above is typical of the conspiracy theory style of thinking that 'they' (the authorities) have stuffed things up because they are stupid or maliciously and the world will end because of it. Most of it is unsupportable rubbish with a few supportable bits thrown in for credibility sake.
Beware.
LooseChange
LooseChange
NSW
2140 posts
NSW, 2140 posts
10 Jan 2014 11:35am
Not knowing what Southace's financials are I am not in a position to comment on what he should or shouldn't do. But if he's been happy bumming around the ocean for all this time in a 37 footer then I think it fair to say that he would be more happy in the bigger boat he desires. The boat he was looking at was listed at +- $170,000 assuming his boat is worth about +- $70,000, to me that's do-able because the only thing that has changed in the equation is the size of the boat and I'm sure Southace has taken into consideration of the extra costs associated with owning a larger boat. If he's happy to want to do that who are we to try to dissuade him.

Personally, I would have just done it and then present the new boat to the forum as then the focus is on the boat and not on whether it is the "right" thing to do.
jev7337
jev7337
QLD
460 posts
QLD, 460 posts
10 Jan 2014 10:42am
It depends on your circumstances, your dependents and what you want to do i.e. liveaboard, cruising, weekend sailing, racing.
Not to do any of it, because you don't have plenty of cash would be shame but doing it without any cash or realistic plan how to support/maintain the boat would be stupid.

Southace appears to be a livaboard and moving from a 37 to a 42 footer won't be much of a difference in maintenance cost - given that you got the cash to pay for the boat in the first place. Being a liveaborad and having some income to support your lifestyle can be more appealing to many than your 9-5 grind and paying rent. Financially you're losing either way.

Selling off and throwing off the bowlines to sail into the sunset may be a different story. But again some careful planing and having the cash to support yourself for a few years can make it possible without the 10% rule.

Does it make sense financially? No.
So it just depends what you want in life.

As Mark Twain once said: "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do"
However, keeping a level head helps.
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
10 Jan 2014 11:15am
Entirely valid comments from everybody I feel. Consideration of dependants is very important.
Dezman
Dezman
NSW
818 posts
NSW, 818 posts
10 Jan 2014 12:18pm
Ramona said..

Being prepared to lose your yacht is the opposite of fear!


I guess being prepared is to be Insured then there is no financial risk and you don't need to follow the %10 rule!

MorningBird said..

Be very wary of economic or financial advice on a sailors forum. Sailors are not usually the smartest of financial minds.

Beware.


Oh god, that's why I'm poor!
"What shall we do with the drunken sailor"
jev7337 said..


Does it make sense financially? No.
So it just depends what you want in life.

As Mark Twain once said: "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do"
.


Come to think about it a 'Sailor' would never ask 'is it a good idea', hesitate or wonder what if.
He be hoisting sail and saying goodbye.
southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
10 Jan 2014 12:22pm
LooseChange said..

Not knowing what Southace's financials are I am not in a position to comment on what he should or shouldn't do. But if he's been happy bumming around the ocean for all this time in a 37 footer then I think it fair to say that he would be more happy in the bigger boat he desires. The boat he was looking at was listed at +- $170,000 assuming his boat is worth about +- $70,000, to me that's do-able because the only thing that has changed in the equation is the size of the boat and I'm sure Southace has taken into consideration of the extra costs associated with owning a larger boat. If he's happy to want to do that who are we to try to dissuade him.

Personally, I would have just done it and then present the new boat to the forum as then the focus is on the boat and not on whether it is the "right" thing to do.



Bumming around the ocean? Not for me.....I utilise my floating home by traveling where the work is however I can see clearly now I'm running out of options but I will deal with that.

My costs for a 37 foot yacht annually including marina berthing,insurance and slipping is $8,450

I would expect going larger this cost would increase to around 10k or just over which is still quite cheap for waterfront property!

Looking at 2 bedroom apartments in a complex (ekkk) the body corporate range around the 5k per annual plus council,water and electricity say add another 4 to 5 k...... Totalling approx 10k then add the $8,450 for the 37 footer?

Totalling $18,450 x 5 years = $92,250 I would expect this that would be about how much the property rises over a 5 year period.

No one is gain to admit where the economics will be at in 5 to 10 years but I'm getting a pretty clear picture from what I see around Oz and the world.

Living on a yacht is quite cheap really , some choise to bum around and live as grotty yachties but that's not for me.

My plan now is to get a decent size yacht (hunters are looking good) within the next 2 years and spend a few more years working around until my super is available.

I don't believe that a good yacht will devalue that quickly but put it this way if you purchased for 170k and re-sold for 150k in 10 years it would be a cheap rental yacht for 10 years of your life.

Anyway does anyone have any experience with Hunters?
jev7337
jev7337
QLD
460 posts
QLD, 460 posts
10 Jan 2014 12:44pm
Sorry, don't know much about Hunter but I hear they fairly popular in the states.
Here is another one but I guess you've seen that one already http://yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/hunter-42-passage/129228

For a solid mono in the mid to higher 40's range I'd bee keeping my eye out for a VDS Samoa 47. Generally a bit pricier though.
This one is missing the hard dodger but just an example, yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/van-de-stadt-samoa/142926 Aluminium version would be more appealing though.
MorningBird
MorningBird
NSW
2711 posts
NSW, 2711 posts
10 Jan 2014 1:57pm
Just rumour but I have heard that Hunters are in the more mass produced and cheaper construction of the yank built boats.
I looked at a Hunter mid 30ft size and liked the fit out and space. If you will be coastal cruising and don't intend going seriously offshore space and comfort at anchor or at the marina and water storage is going to be the priority. Hunters look good for that role. I have friends part-time living aboard a Beneteau 47 and it is great also.
southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
10 Jan 2014 3:26pm
MorningBird said..

Just rumour but I have heard that Hunters are in the more mass produced and cheaper construction of the yank built boats.
I looked at a Hunter mid 30ft size and liked the fit out and space. If you will be coastal cruising and don't intend going seriously offshore space and comfort at anchor or at the marina and water storage is going to be the priority. Hunters look good for that role. I have friends part-time living aboard a Beneteau 47 and it is great also.


The last charter company I skippered for imported a new 2012 model 4 cabin Beneteau 50 within 12 months of charter the cabin doors would not shut and the floors where lifting makes you wonder what causes that.

One interesting fact about the Hunter that's now under contract is the I think I read the deck and hull is bolted not just glued I wonder if that is from factory or its been done after having issues?
I do believe the Hunter would be fine offshore just because they are cheaper not always means in this day and age that they are weaker. The technology is there.....parts are most properly laminated in china and then put together in the USA so the can be stamped with pride! Lol
MorningBird
MorningBird
NSW
2711 posts
NSW, 2711 posts
10 Jan 2014 7:07pm
Agree with you Southace. Just a rumour on Hunters.
I also remember some years ago when a French court condemned Beneteau for a boat that sank in the Atlantic when sold as an offshore yacht. I also know of a Beneteau that had its windows pop out on the way to Lord Howe island due to flexing in the hull/deck. My mate only uses his for favourable weather coastal cruising and long periods in harbour, for which it is good.
cisco
cisco
QLD
12365 posts
QLD, 12365 posts
10 Jan 2014 6:40pm
If I was looking for a late model fibreglass production yacht, I would be bypassing the Benetaus, Jennaues, Moodys, Hunters etc, most of which rely on trendy styling to justify their high prices.

What I would be looking at are the Bavarias. They are a quality build and Bavaria is one company that did not have to go into borrowings to stay afloat during the financial ups and downs of the last 2 decades.

http://www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=14038805&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=2&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=16083590&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=5&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=16022730&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=18&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=15180567&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=19&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=15852059&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=20&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=16014168&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=25&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=15597186&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=32&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=14314649&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=37&eapi=2

www.boatpoint.com.au/boats-for-sale/boatdetails.aspx?R=15851935&Silo=Stock&Vertical=Boat&Ridx=42&eapi=2

This last one is only 5 years old and would have to have sold for around half a million when new and here it is for a $200k ask. Try crunching him at $170k cash.

Several of these yachts are in survey and you have got a ticket southace. Gotta be the way to go for you.
southace
southace
SA
4803 posts
SA, 4803 posts
25 Jan 2014 7:08pm
The is the one! Maintaining watch and arranging friend to check it out........10k import costs any other hidden costs?

www.yachtworld.com/boats-for-sale/make-hunter/model-45-center-cockpit/
Please Register, or first...
Topics Subscribe Reply