Hi all,
I recently posted that I was looking at a J24 for some close offshore racing and cruising (max 2nm out) on the south coast around Wollongong. Thanks to all that replied and I'm glad that I have steered clear of the J.
I have included my usage brief below and have narrowed it down to these models as I'm on a.budget of around $20k, models include, Northshore 27, Cavalier 28, Swarbrick S80, Adams 10 racer/cruiser.
BRIEF
- Budget around $20k
- Begginer Yacht, I have years experience however my new partner and kids dont.
- want to race out of Wollongong Yacht Club, racers are offshore (about 2mn max) some long raver up/down coast.
- would also like the option of cruising up to Sydney/Pittwater from Wollongong and down south of the gong
- with the above in mind would like some creature comforts below ie berths, head, basic cooking (for the mrs)
- and of course for me a relatively competitive yacht for racing
i know that many may think that I'm dreaming to get all the above for $20k however I understand that there is always going to be some give and take.
Any comments, suggestions, are more than welcome and appreciated
Cheers
HONKN
G'day Honkn,
Firstly, leave some money in the bank, don't go and buy a 20K boat on a 20K budget. You need spare cash to fix/replace things, and there's nothing worse than having a new toy that you can't sail because it needs (insert latest issue here) and you're strapped for cash.
Try and find a decent 8mtr. the rig and sails are not that expensive and you can get decent accommodation for when venturing offshore. A good 10mtr will I fear break your budget. Flat deck Adams 10's are great race boats, but your wife will hate the accommodation,and I wouldn't want to venture too far offshore in one.
A Cavalier 28 is a Davidson design, so it will sail well even though they look too tubby.
I like the Swarbrick S80's, a tough little boat. That would be my pick from your list.
Never sailed on or against a NS27, so I defer to others on this one.
If you want to race use weight as one of your deciding factors. A 3 ton 26 footer is painful when racing against 26' JOG boats weighing half that.
Good luck with your search!
SB
Thanks SB I will take your suggestions onboard, I totally agree with you comment with regards to my $20k budget, I know that I will be forking out extra money along the way, I have seen some of the models I listed on various sites that I should be able to pick up for $17-18k leaving me with a bit of spare cash for a bits and pieces, I'm pretty handy so I hope to most things myself, of course within reason, I will keep you updated on my search
Honkn
Honkn,
If you want to race half competitively, you need a near new main and working jib as a minimum, so try and factor that in to your budget. Unless you're lucky enough to find a boat with near new sails that is!
For kites, check out Etchells spinnaker sizes , they're a never ending supply of cheap good quality 2nd hand kites for most 26' cruiser racers.
Lemme know if you want any headsails or kites when you settle on a boat, I've got a near new laminate no 1 heavy sitting here and some good kites.
Cheers,
SB
Select to expand quoteshaggybaxter said..
G'day Honkn,
Firstly, leave some money in the bank, don't go and buy a 20K boat on a 20K budget. You need spare cash to fix/replace things, and there's nothing worse than having a new toy that you can't sail because it needs (insert latest issue here) and you're strapped for cash.
Try and find a decent 8mtr. the rig and sails are not that expensive and you can get decent accommodation for when venturing offshore. A good 10mtr will I fear break your budget. Flat deck Adams 10's are great race boats, but your wife will hate the accommodation,and I wouldn't want to venture too far offshore in one.
A Cavalier 28 is a Davidson design, so it will sail well even though they look too tubby.
I like the Swarbrick S80's, a tough little boat. That would be my pick from your list.
Never sailed on or against a NS27, so I defer to others on this one.
If you want to race use weight as one of your deciding factors. A 3 ton 26 footer is painful when racing against 26' JOG boats weighing half that.
Good luck with your search!
SB
I would go the S80 as well and if memory serves me correctly, the rig is the same as an Etchell which means you will get plenty of good second hand Sails.
Select to expand quotehonkn said..
Hi all,
I recently posted that I was looking at a J24 for some close offshore racing and cruising (max 2nm out) on the south coast around Wollongong. Thanks to all that replied and I'm glad that I have steered clear of the J.
I have included my usage brief below and have narrowed it down to these models as I'm on a.budget of around $20k, models include, Northshore 27, Cavalier 28, Swarbrick S80, Adams 10 racer/cruiser.
Racing offshore out of Wollongong will require a yacht that is somewhat heavier and more seaworthy than the harbour racers you have on your list. Summer seabreezes of 25 knots or so and lumpy seas and strong currents is pretty much the norm along this coast. Your partner and kids are going to be the deciding factor here, you don't want to scare them. Look around at the other boats in your club and see what is successful [overall]. I would suggest a production 1/2 tonner from the 70's 80's.
Call me biased but I have raced an S80 extensively and now own a Cav 28. S80 great boat to race but for creature comforts the Cav28 is the boat and still competitive. Laurie Davidson is no mug.
Cav has great headroom below S80 doesn't.
Over here in WA I use to see plenty of S80's racing on the Swan river however I have never seen any racing regularly in the ocean. If you are going to have your family onboard you really want a stable boat.
If you are planning on racing from Wollongong Yacht Club I would check out whar yachts are currently racing from the club. Have a discussion with some of the skippers and see what they would recommend.
From your list I would go for the Cavalier 28, almost bought a Cavalier 32 when I was search for my current yacht (UFO 34).
Ilenart
Not "High performance", but definitely no slouch (one was raced with much success at my club for many years)...
yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/van-de-stadt-spirit-28/228710
Solid cruiser racer, one won the Sydney to Hobart many years ago. I expect the price will become very negotiable....
yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/holland-30-price-reduced-for-sale/227088
I've always liked the looks of these for a short handed racer - cruisers, and this'd be as good as they get...
yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/southern-ocean-32/221399
And this's been on the market a long time, and is close to what I'd be looking at if I were to be looking to upgrade at present, a little over budget, but price must be negotiable.
yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/elliott-e-9/207760
That was a very quick look, and boats are coming on the market all the time, and prices are remarkably low. Don't rush, and I'm sure you'll find something you like, even love;)
Cav 28 are a great boat and have strong racing events.
Don't be tempted by a Cav 30. They are a Cav 28 with extended stern which makes the rudder underhung rather than transom hung and I don't think the extra 2 feet makes them perform any better.
Thanks Cisco, I will keep that in mind when looking, no point paying more for a couple of extra feet for less function
Honkn
There is a good Holland 30 for sale at our club been regularly raced. Think it's about 15000 it's a deceased estate.
Hello all
thanks heaps for everyone's suggestions and information its very much appreciated please keep them coming. I will updated you on my search as things progress and again look forward to your informative imput and suggestions.
thanks again
honkn
Select to expand quotetwodogs1969 said..
There is a good Holland 30 for sale at our club been regularly raced. Think it's about 15000 it's a deceased estate.
Thanks for the heads up twodogs, where is this Holland located that you mentioned
Honkn
Select to expand quoteMadmouse said..
The E9 looks awesome!
Thanks Madmouse, any links you can share would be great, cheers in advance
honkn
Select to expand quoteshaggybaxter said..
G'day Honkn,
Firstly, leave some money in the bank, don't go and buy a 20K boat on a 20K budget. You need spare cash to fix/replace things, and there's nothing worse than having a new toy that you can't sail because it needs (insert latest issue here) and you're strapped for cash.
Try and find a decent 8mtr. the rig and sails are not that expensive and you can get decent accommodation for when venturing offshore. A good 10mtr will I fear break your budget. Flat deck Adams 10's are great race boats, but your wife will hate the accommodation,and I wouldn't want to venture too far offshore in one.
A Cavalier 28 is a Davidson design, so it will sail well even though they look too tubby.
I like the Swarbrick S80's, a tough little boat. That would be my pick from your list.
Never sailed on or against a NS27, so I defer to others on this one.
If you want to race use weight as one of your deciding factors. A 3 ton 26 footer is painful when racing against 26' JOG boats weighing half that.
Good luck with your search!
SB
Hey shaggybaxter, great info and I learned a lot from what you wrote, please keep in coming thanks
honkn
Select to expand quotecisco said..
Cav 28 are a great boat and have strong racing events.
Don't be tempted by a Cav 30. They are a Cav 28 with extended stern which makes the rudder underhung rather than transom hung and I don't think the extra 2 feet makes them perform any better.
Thanks Cisco, great info, please keep it coming
honkn
Select to expand quotehonkn said..twodogs1969 said..
There is a good Holland 30 for sale at our club been regularly raced. Think it's about 15000 it's a deceased estate.
Thanks for the heads up twodogs, where is this Holland located that you mentioned
Honkn
Botany bay it's called scandal..
Select to expand quotehonkn said..twodogs1969 said..
There is a good Holland 30 for sale at our club been regularly raced. Think it's about 15000 it's a deceased estate.
Thanks for the heads up twodogs, where is this Holland located that you mentioned
Honkn
Botany bay it's called scandal..
Select to expand quoteshaggybaxter said..
G'day Honkn,
Firstly, leave some money in the bank, don't go and buy a 20K boat on a 20K budget. You need spare cash to fix/replace things, and there's nothing worse than having a new toy that you can't sail because it needs (insert latest issue here) and you're strapped for cash.
Don't forget to allow some funds for all the safety gear and compliance modifications. What Cat safety rating will you be racing ?
As people say, if you want to go cruising and have a family aboard, also look at the old half tonners and Cav 28.
S80s used to race overnight and I never heard any complaints about their stability but some people claim they broach, and they are pretty minimalist down below. The Cruising Tens have done Sydney to Hobart so there is no doubt about their seaworthiness, but are also pretty small down below. The Northshore 27 is nice down below but not in the same speed class as most of the other boats considered here. The Cav 30 usually came with a fractional rig and in their prime they were definitely quicker than the 28s.
As noted, Cav 28s go faster than they look and are about as fast as the half tonners. You can roughly group half tonners into three groups, speed-wise; the S&S 30/East Coast/Endeavour 30/M&W 32/Cavalier 32s/Adams/Knoops/Spencer 30/Pion 30/Currawong bracket all go about the same speed overall although each has their favourite conditions. The Holland 30 and most Peterson 30s are a couple of minutes quicker around the average course but tend to have less interior. The Nantucket 32 is about as quick as the Holland and Peterson but generally are very nice inside. Then there are the fractional rig boats (Peterson Santana 30 fractional version, Farrs, Dubois) that are quicker again but are normally stripped out.
The speed of most of these boats is close enough that your choice can get down to personal preferences on things like accommodation and deck layout, and the "bang for the buck" of the individual boat.
This is over your budget, but looks sweet;
yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/carter-30/220561
One issue with just about all of these is the big overlapping genoa. You may want a boat without roller furling, which is pretty inefficient in typical Wollongong conditions; just using a smaller but more efficient No 3 most of the time may be the way to go, with the option of putting on a No 1 if you know it's going to stay light.
Select to expand quoteAndrew68 said..shaggybaxter said..
G'day Honkn,
Firstly, leave some money in the bank, don't go and buy a 20K boat on a 20K budget. You need spare cash to fix/replace things, and there's nothing worse than having a new toy that you can't sail because it needs (insert latest issue here) and you're strapped for cash.
Don't forget to allow some funds for all the safety gear and compliance modifications. What Cat safety rating will you be racing ?
I need to get whatever I buy to a min of cat 5, any ideas that would help appreciated
honkn
Hi Honkn,
Cat5 is pretty easy, but you really should familiarise yourself with the RRS Cat5 equipment audit so you can apply when you're looking at different boats. Cat5 is not onerous.
I've attached a screenshot for the AS Category 5 compliance.
Here is the link to the current RRS Blue Book Racing Rules of Sailling, this will give you more details for each compliance requirement.
www.sailingresources.org.au/class-assoc/racing-rules/
Cheers,
SB
Select to expand quoteshaggybaxter said..
Hi Honkn,
Cat5 is pretty easy, but you really should familiarise yourself with the RRS Cat5 equipment audit so you can apply when you're looking at different boats. Cat5 is not onerous.
I've attached a screenshot for the AS Category 5 compliance.
Here is the link to the current RRS Blue Book Racing Rules of Sailling, this will give you more details for each compliance requirement.
www.sailingresources.org.au/class-assoc/racing-rules/
Cheers,
SB
Bwedy thanks SB
