Sectorsteve said..
ive asked this question before in regards to getting 3rd part insurance, but i cannot find the post.
THis Top Hat Mark 1 im looking to buy needs a survey to be registered.
She also needs an Antifoul and a winch.
I dont wanna get stuck with a boat that i cant get legal.
OK, this topic will get me going!!
When we, as newbies in Qld, bought a 15m sloop in 2004 we did the right thing and decided to get a marine surveyor. We researched on-line ( mistake No.1 !) and thought that going to a group of surveyors ( we chose The Small Ships Surveyors Association) would be a better bet that a solo surveyor. Strength in numbers etc etc. ( mistake 2).
To cut a long story short ( but if you want the full breakdown feel free to pm me) the surveyor told me that an out-of-water inspection would be essential. ( CORRECT!) He turned out, however, to be a complete and total incompetent ; huge amounts of damage present were not found, specifically osmosis over the whole hull requiring $25,000 repairs, despite that being the very thing that we asked him to look for. The yacht was in survey at the time but unbeknownst to us, was not compliant in critical areas....we were planning to keep the vessel in survey and eventually return her to work. Lots of other stuff too but not of the same consequence.
Through my brother, a lawyer, we investigated our legal options and obtained reports from 2 other senior surveyors and a Naval Architect, all reports suggesting that it was inexcusable to have missed such obvious damage. After contacting the surveyors solicitor we received a reply saying that we were "welcome to pursue" the surveyor as all his assets were in his wife's name. The solicitor went on to say that he, the solicitor, was himself a undischarged bankrupt and had no assets either !! OK. I contacted the Small Ships Surveyors Association and spoke to the President who informed me, very calmy and politely that " oh yes, none of our members have professional insurance as the premiums are so high they can't afford them". The Pres told me that he didn't even have any himself ! OK. Next stop was to Maritime Services Qld who said that only accredited surveyors could work with the Qld Govt as only they had proper professional insurance. By now I was starting to get the picture.....and I'm starting to rant!!
Oh yes....I wrote to Club Marine about surveyors in Queensland not having to be insured and that we had been caught....no interest whatsoever. Not even a reply. Hmm.
My advice?
1 : If you're buying, don't necessarily accept the recommendation of your ship broker to use a particular surveyor. Ask around at the slipway.
2 : Make absolutely certain that your surveyor is accredited and has professional insurance. The people who know who's good are the local shipwrights and slipway managers. When you keep hearing the same name as being good ( or bad!!) you're on the right track.
3 : Although a surveyor might not be an expert of every single fine detail of your boat he/she WILL be able to give you an opinion....not just " get an engineer", get a rigger" or get an electrician". The good surveyors know all this stuff because of their experience.
4 : Don't necessarily go cheap. My bloke cost me $750 (15 metres) and a proper guy would've cost $850. Damn! Most of the good guys know that they are good and expect to be rewarded appropriately.. they've spent a lot of time and money to get to where they are. And they're insured.
5 : If you know a good shipwright, considering paying $100 to get them to have a good poke around in the boat for an hour...you'll learn heaps. Cheap.
6 : you are NEVER going to find every issue and fault with the boat but if you can find out about the serious ones it'd be good.
7 : Club Marine wanted my vessel inspected every 5 years as she was more than 25 years old. Check your insurance with "sails up". Some policies do NOT cover you when hoisting sails, when sails up or coming down unless you have evidence of adequate rigging. Check it carefully.
7 : Caveat Emptor!!!!!
If you are near the Gold Coast consider using Peter Kidd. This guy is awesome....he takes his time and does it properly. Huge written report given to you, on the day at the end of the survey, photos, good advice, fully insured and known as being very good. Brokers with dodgy boats do NOT want to see him acting for the purchaser as he seems to find any problems! Very highly regarded in the industry and a very nice man as well. He's not a particular friend of mine...just someone I found who did the right thing for me in the course of his everyday business.
Hope this might be a help to someone!
