Congrats Australia!

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PeterP
PeterP
873 posts
873 posts
14 May 2014 1:40am
Congratulations on your 3rd Team Overall win in a row (+multiple gold silvers etc).....You completely dominated the ISA Worlds in SUP and Prone paddling.

It was a great show with outstanding performances from all your paddlers - we look on in awe from this side of the pond and look forward to improving our performance next year - our team learned a lot and will be back next year to wrestle a few of the medals off you guys!!!
PTWoody
PTWoody
VIC
3982 posts
VIC, 3982 posts
14 May 2014 11:06am
It's a little sad the first post-ISA thread on Seabreeze has come from South Africa rather than locally. That really does seem to say something about the dwindling level of interest in this event, which will surely continue at least until they manage to attract the best Hawaiians and Americans to compete and affirm the genuine world title status of these championships.

Nevertheless, congratulations to Shak, Lincoln, Toby, Jackson and Beau (along with the prone paddlers). You can only beat the people who turn up to compete, and this team certainly managed that feat. Job well done.
Piros
Piros
QLD
7303 posts
QLD, 7303 posts
14 May 2014 12:00pm
Yeah great effort again
Goochi
Goochi
WA
846 posts
WA, 846 posts
14 May 2014 10:10am
PTWoody said...
It's a little sad the first post-ISA thread on Seabreeze has come from South Africa rather than locally. That really does seem to say something about the dwindling level of interest in this event, which will surely continue at least until they manage to attract the best Hawaiians and Americans to compete and affirm the genuine world title status of these championships.

Nevertheless, congratulations to Shak, Lincoln, Toby, Jackson and Beau (along with the prone paddlers). You can only beat the people who turn up to compete, and this team certainly managed that feat. Job well done.


Can anyone shed light on why the (top) Americans and hawaiins don't compete? There's always rumours and the often quoted excuse is they can't afford to send a team?
It's a shame not to have the full SUP community represented.
surf4fun
surf4fun
WA
1313 posts
WA, 1313 posts
14 May 2014 10:14am
There is no doubt that Australia dominated the event, but I think this year they were definitely given a run for their money. You have to remember that 4 of their 6 gold medals came from the prone guys, 1 from the team relay and 1 from the overall. So not one gold medal in Sup to Australia but they were extremely close in pretty much every event.

PT I think if you attended one of these events you might change your mind about it, much like I know a number of people changed their minds about the flatwater sprints after SUPfest. I do however agree that it would be good to see the first string of all countries represented, never the less the level of competition was very intense. It will be hard to ever get all of the top guys/girls together at the one event.

All the medal winners deserve to be crowned World Champion and wear that badge with pride.
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
14 May 2014 12:25pm
Congrats to all the Aussies.. I for one are very proud of them and appreciate all their hard training.

Can't help but wonder if the drug testing issue had an effect on many big names not being there.
surf4fun
surf4fun
WA
1313 posts
WA, 1313 posts
14 May 2014 10:33am
DavidJohn said..

Congrats to all the Aussies.. I for one are very proud of them and appreciate all their hard training.

Can't help but wonder if the drug testing issue had an effect on many big names not being there.


I don't think the drug testing had anything to do with it, that kind of implies that some guys are on drugs.I think it was a combination of things such as so many events being run all over the place and you just can't get to everyone of them, money and logistics.
petedorries
petedorries
QLD
700 posts
QLD, 700 posts
14 May 2014 1:17pm
Come on Guys
This was not the first post on the ISA games.

AND we won a gold in SUP as well as two silvers
surf4fun
surf4fun
WA
1313 posts
WA, 1313 posts
14 May 2014 11:52am
Sorry as soon as I saw Shaq at the airport I realised I had forgotten her gold in the course race.
petedorries
petedorries
QLD
700 posts
QLD, 700 posts
14 May 2014 1:58pm


Thats ok mate

I only heard the Canadians were on drugs anyway
Vit C, B injections and not one party drug amongst them
PTWoody
PTWoody
VIC
3982 posts
VIC, 3982 posts
14 May 2014 2:17pm
surf4fun said..


PT I think if you attended one of these events you might change your mind about it, much like I know a number of people changed their minds about the flatwater sprints after SUPfest.





You don't need to change my mind about the ISA event, I was staying up late to watch, or getting up early to check results. I am just observing that with the event ending a few days ago, PeterP's was the first thread* since Australia was crowned champs, which seems to indicate that there is less interest than there has been in past years. Maybe that has something to do with the fact that Shak and Lincoln are not regular posters on Seabreeze or they don't have many vocal cheerleaders here. Or perhaps it's a board brand thing - we don't cheer the Aussies anymore, we cheer for Fanatic or Naish or Starboard or whatever. But let me reiterate, I think the team did a great job and it's great to "three-peat". I hope that everyone on Seabreeze appreciates this team's achievement alongside the results provided by Jamie, Travis, Angie and co in past years because after all, the opposition is not getting any easier. If anything, it is getting harder each year.








* and yes petedorries, I certainly do appreciate that there were threads posted during the event acknowledging our athletes; heck I think I started a couple of them. All I'm saying is this is the first thread congratulating the team, and the first in days since the event wound up and the last medals presented.
PTWoody
PTWoody
VIC
3982 posts
VIC, 3982 posts
14 May 2014 2:21pm
Goochi said..

Can anyone shed light on why the (top) Americans and hawaiins don't compete? There's always rumours and the often quoted excuse is they can't afford to send a team?
It's a shame not to have the full SUP community represented.



Apparently Kai Lenny was Instagramming from elsewhere in Nicaragua during the event so there has to be something deeper and quite political as to why the Americans and Hawaiians do not support ISA or their national/state surfing peak body.
petedorries
petedorries
QLD
700 posts
QLD, 700 posts
14 May 2014 2:29pm
[


* and yes petedorries, I certainly do appreciate that there were threads posted during the event acknowledging our athletes; heck I think I started a couple of them. All I'm saying is this is the first thread congratulating the team, and the first in days since the event wound up and the last medals presented.


Typical Up all bloody nite and paddling all day
Al Hunter
Al Hunter
NSW
367 posts
NSW, 367 posts
14 May 2014 3:47pm
PTWoody said..

Goochi said..

Can anyone shed light on why the (top) Americans and hawaiins don't compete? There's always rumours and the often quoted excuse is they can't afford to send a team?
It's a shame not to have the full SUP community represented.



Apparently Kai Lenny was Instagramming from elsewhere in Nicaragua during the event so there has to be something deeper and quite political as to why the Americans and Hawaiians do not support ISA or their national/state surfing peak body.


Stop saying the Americans did not send a team to compete, they got medals, they got a gold, they got second overall, they had Jim Terrel coaching them, is that really not a team?. What are we talking about. Don't assimilate Americans and Hawaians on that regard. It has not been the same pattern at all and that was already true last year...
My personnal opinion for what's it is worth, is that hawaii is an american state and I always wondered why they should have their own team. Did you ever see an Hawaian competing at the olympics under the hawaian banner? Same for Tahiti...why would they have a Tahitian team and a French team. If a tahitian kid is good at soccer who would he play with? Tahiti? not really, he would play for France...
And then why did Titouan competed for France then? Why didn't he compete for New Caledonia? What's the difference between New Caledonians and Tahitians?
If somebody could explain me these exceptions that would be good.
PeterP
PeterP
873 posts
873 posts
14 May 2014 3:07pm
I think Tahiti and Hawaii have gained special "country" status in relation to ISA because of their place in surfing history, whilst New Cal is a just another part of France.

There is no doubt that the competition was very, very tough, apart from Jordan Mercer making it look easy there were no give-away gold medals, so kudo's to you guys for placing so highly in all disciplines. Lot's of countries upped their game and France were robbed of 3rd in the Team event because of some bizarre outside assistance rule when one of their relay guys broke a paddle and had a new one given to him - how that could possibly translate into an advantage is beyond me.

The secret to doing well in the overall Team standings is also having a good proning Team and Australia is by far the best, and it was impressive to see how well the Spanish and New Zealanders did this year. I do however question the inclusion of the proning as part of the Team event as the sport is so underdeveloped in the majority of SUP nations meaning the top 5 countries will remain unchanged in the foreseeable future.

South Africa's two best prone paddlers unfortunately couldn't make the trip and our waveriding lady Tarryn had to do double duty having virtually never proned in her life. She, perhaps wisely, declined to take part in the 18km race but did us proud in the short distance. Had she entered the 18km and come last we would have jumped one place in the Team standings.......

The US put in a committed effort and with such a talent pool will always have a strong team, which 2nd overall proved. Yes there will be the one or two paddlers that might be stronger on paper, but the participation is largely self-sponsored and some of the full-time pro's put their career before country and I guess thats their choice.

I really do hope that Hawaii will make the call to send a team next year - if they are to hold special country status within the ISA one would like to think that this comes with some form of responsibility - everyone want to see them and see them compete with the best.

But once again, I have to commend the commitment and spirit of the Ozzie Team - you have a great thing going...well done!
husq2100
husq2100
QLD
2031 posts
QLD, 2031 posts
14 May 2014 5:32pm
surf4fun said..

There is no doubt that Australia dominated the event, but I think this year they were definitely given a run for their money. You have to remember that 4 of their 6 gold medals came from the prone guys, 1 from the team relay and 1 from the overall. So not one gold medal in Sup to Australia but they were extremely close in pretty much every event.

PT I think if you attended one of these events you might change your mind about it, much like I know a number of people changed their minds about the flatwater sprints after SUPfest. I do however agree that it would be good to see the first string of all countries represented, never the less the level of competition was very intense. It will be hard to ever get all of the top guys/girls together at the one event.

All the medal winners deserve to be crowned World Champion and wear that badge with pride.


yes, but the top Aussies did not go to ISA (both Mens and Womens SUP racing) why is their business.

who knows, maybe if the ISA gain more "prestige" they will get the best of the best. I hope they do, I also hope they can have the events somewhere out of Sth American to really make it the world event it is.
PTSUP
PTSUP
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
14 May 2014 5:40pm

Of the subject slightly,The Kingdom of Hawaii was annexed by the USA , There is a lot of info out there on this subject.Look it up and form your own opinion.
PTWoody
PTWoody
VIC
3982 posts
VIC, 3982 posts
14 May 2014 6:33pm
husq2100 said...


yes, but the top Aussies did not go to ISA (both Mens and Womens SUP racing) why is their business.






It's a matter of opinion I suppose, but I think Lincoln's status as the top ranked Aussie this year is fair enough. He won the Australian title in the Technical race. Not so long ago everyone complained when Jamie Mitchell and Travis Grant were getting a free pass to the ISA without having to compete at nationals. I think it's a good thing that Surfing Australia maintains the integrity of team selection with credit given to the national champion. Besides, Jamie did not compete in any major events for most of the year, and Travis was injured for at least half the year. You could argue that Jake should have been there, but he has a big year of international events and he has to prioritise according to his own needs.
PTWoody
PTWoody
VIC
3982 posts
VIC, 3982 posts
14 May 2014 6:43pm
Al Hunter said...

Stop saying the Americans did not send a team to compete, they got medals, they got a gold, they got second overall, they had Jim Terrel coaching them, is that really not a team?. What are we talking about. Don't assimilate Americans and Hawaians on that regard. It has not been the same pattern at all and that was already true last year...
My personnal opinion for what's it is worth, is that hawaii is an american state and I always wondered why they should have their own team. Did you ever see an Hawaian competing at the olympics under the hawaian banner? Same for Tahiti...why would they have a Tahitian team and a French team. If a tahitian kid is good at soccer who would he play with? Tahiti? not really, he would play for France...
And then why did Titouan competed for France then? Why didn't he compete for New Caledonia? What's the difference between New Caledonians and Tahitians?
If somebody could explain me these exceptions that would be good.


In surf competition, both ISA and ASP recognise Hawaiians as distinct from Americans. Kind of like in soccer and some other sports, there are separate teams from England, Scotland, and Wales, whereas the Olympic team is Great Britain.

Whether or not Hawaii should be part of Team USA, there's little doubt the best American paddler is Danny Ching and it's a shame he has not been coaxed into supporting the ISA titles.
RJK
RJK
NSW
622 posts
RJK RJK
NSW, 622 posts
14 May 2014 8:23pm
PTWoody said...
It's a little sad the first post-ISA thread on Seabreeze has come from South Africa rather than locally.


What does that say about the value of seabreeze then?
chrisparker
chrisparker
234 posts
234 posts
14 May 2014 8:34pm
After having followed this event more closely than anyone, here's my take.

I was in Nicaragua for a week before the event and only just left the country last night. I commentated and reported on every race. I chatted to almost every competitor who was competing, as well as coaches and supporters. I had very long (and at times quite animated) discussions with the various ISA officials, including their President Fernando Aguerre and all the guys running the show.

In short: The ISA still has some very big holes to fix, but this was a genuinely great event and I feel the momentum might have finally shifted to where the big names will support it next year. Just so long as the ISA gets the location and scheduling right...

I was a little surprised not to see more chatter on here, though I think Seabreeze is a bit of a bubble sometimes.

I know on my own site the ISA is the second most viewed event, behind only the Battle of the Paddle. Granted I do a lot of posts about the Worlds, but even using the "Average views per post" metric, the ISA ranks third behind the BOP and Molokai.

This year's event was first class in many ways and terrible in a few others. The organisation is above and beyond anything else in this sport and makes the BOP look like a school fete. The grand stand that was setup for competitors on the Lake was insane. Made it feel like a pro surfing contest not a SUP race.

The level of competition was also better this year than ever before, however the location continues to be a major problem. Not only was Nicaragua a nightmare logistically, the split location compounded the problem and provided paddlers with serious headaches. I really hope they drop this split location idea in the future...

Though despite the location the ISA got lucky this year with the racing, with all events being genuinely exciting (particularly the men's distance race - the most entertaining race I've ever witnessed). The long course through the islands, which I was the first to criticise when it was announced several months ago, was actually the most exotic and unique course in the world. It was amazing to watch paddlers weaving their way through the beautiful jungle islands for almost two hours.

Don't underestimate Team Australia's performance this year either. If you look at the final team standings it looks like they did it easy, but this was a massive effort against some very classy opposition. Australia's worst result across the board was silver, except for one event where they got a bronze (Shak in the surfing - and she was kinda robbed of the silver I think). This is despite Team Aus going into the event not being the favourites in any discipline outside of prone.

Lincoln really stepped it up to claim 2x silvers, which is quite remarkable given how stacked the men's field was. Not only that, he won his second silver in the course race just 24 hours after finishing an absolutely grueling 18km distance race (it was 37 degrees and the pace was solid).

Shakira was far and away the athlete of the event. Bronze in the surfing, silver in the distance, gold in the short course and gold in the relay. Outstanding achievement for someone who's only been back in race training the past three weeks. Everyone was trying to convince her to make a comeback at the Battle this year.

Jamie Mitchell was getting very fired up in the commentary booth and mentioned at least a dozen times how much he wanted to be out there racing. If there isn't a big wave contest the same weekend as the Aussie Titles, he could make an appearance.

Travis would have loved to have been there and was probably a little disappointed he wasn't offered an injury wild card when three of the SUP racing men pulled out. Maybe next year.

There could be a whole new thread on the politics of this event, but I sincerely hope more big names from Hawaii/USA support this event next year. It doesn't compete with anything: It's not trying to out-do the Battle, it's not trying to out-do the World Series. The only event you could argue it conflicts with is the Henessey's/WPA World Champs, which has become irrelevant now anyway.

The ISA isn't trying to make money or impose its rules on the sport, the only goal the ISA have is getting more countries involved in paddling and getting into the Olympics. Not sure why anybody would oppose that.

The cost to individual athletes is a genuine problem though...

I know a few of the Currumbin Crew were invited but chose not to go, mainly based on the cost. And I don't blame them.

It's very expensive to get to Nicaragua, especially with a board. Without the lure of prize money you have to weigh up the pros and cons. The pro of "representing your country" should be enough to outweigh any cost, but I agree with the doubters that the ISA still needs to do a lot more work on building the prestige of this event and having that "do it for your country" selling point become strong enough.

It's the chicken and egg scenario: You need the top names to make it prestigious, but you need it to be prestigious to attract the top names...

The ISA definitely needs to improve the location and scheduling asap (plus a few other minor things such as the rankings and how the prone divisions skew the results - the women's prone races are technically the most important events of the entire championship...), but apart from that I think it's the community's turn to step it up and contribute.

Though I actually think it's less up to the individual paddlers and more up to the national federations.

Shame on Surfing Australia for not giving more financial assistance to a team that was two-time defending champs and had to scrap their way through to make it a three-peat. Several lesser ranking nations had their trips fully funded AND received financial bonuses for bringing home a medal. Team Aus got 6x gold, 4x silver and 3x bronze and probably won't see a cent for the two weeks they just sacrificed in honour of their country.

If the federations could fund their teams, it would solve 90% of the comments about "where are the big names?"

As for all the questions about the top Hawaiians and Americans:

- USA was there and acted like a great team unit. Their two racers (Chuck and Slater) are probably both ranked top 5 in the U.S. right now. They were sorely missing guys like Danny, but it would be an insult to suggest this was anything other than a classy squad.

- Hawaii's ISA affiliate (Hawaii Surf Team) openly stated they don't have the time/motivation to focus on building a separate SUP squad, so it was up to the individual paddlers to organise themselves. That nearly happened, but scheduling (i.e. holding it the same weekend as Olukai) got in the way. The Hawaii Surf Team won the ISA World Juniors last month, so they do support the ISA to an extent. Hopefully that'll cross over into SUP next year... And if it doesn't, I'm sure the individual paddlers will organise themselves. The young guns in Hawaii are some of the best paid in the sport, so I'm sure they could tough it out for at least a year just like the Aussies do.

As for some of the individual paddlers...

- Danny Ching simply doesn't support the ISA Worlds. He might eventually come around but for now doesn't see it as a legitimate event. That's his choice but I hope he changes his mind.
- Chase Kosterlitz (probably #2 in the USA behind Danny, at least in the long distance format) was at the event. Not competing, but working behind the scenes with the ISA to improve their race knowledge, rules, etc.
- Connor Baxter was interested but it conflicted with his favourite event (Olukai). If the ISA gets their scheduling right, I'm pretty sure he'll be there next year.
- Candice Appleby had her kids' event scheduled the same weekend and hasn't been racing much lately anyway.
- Jenny Kalmbach was at the event, except she's from Costa Rica not Hawaii as many people assume.
- Kai Lenny was the strangest one... He snubbed the event but then turned up in the same country at the exact same time. He was surfing an hour down the road all week... It was a bizarre choice and he didn't help it with some of his comments on Instagram. Almost all the paddlers I asked thought it was poor form and made him look like a bit of a diva.

But on a positive note, with the big names gone it opened the door for up and comers. The young girl for the USA, Shae Foudy, definitely made a name for herself. The 15 year old literally pushed herself to the brink in both the distance and course races to walk away with two copper medals. It was one of the most inspiring performances of the week. She ended up on an IV drip after the distance race and passed out again after the course race. Great to see young athletes so dedicated. Her team mates were literally in tears with how hard she pushed herself for the team. I was impressed with the camaraderie of Team USA, something definitely helped by having the likes of 4-time Olympian Jim Terrell as your race coach.

Hawaii/USA being two separate nations I think is a good idea and follows the tradition from surfing (and as mentioned above, a few other sports as well). Plus if Hawaii do ever get organised, they're going to be very competitive on their own. Australians shouldn't be calling for a combined USA/Hawaii super team or we'd be in trouble :-D

My dream match up would be a full strength: Hawaii vs Australia vs USA vs Tahiti vs France. Teams such as New Zealand, South Africa, Brazil, Spain and Mexico wouldn't be too far behind. That would be a very solid top 10. Throw in a dozen emerging paddling nations and a dozen minnows, and you've got 34 countries to produce a grand spectacle.

Still a lot of work to be done by both the ISA and the nations, but I think we'll get there in a few years. Despite comments in this thread, the 2014 ISA Worlds was a big step forward.

Next year I have a strong feeling we'll be back in Latin America but I know there are other potential options being looked at (San Diego is a good chance in the next year or two, while Japan and Australia are always thrown up). My choice would be Europe. It would automatically attract so many established paddling nations and would be much easier logistically.

But wherever they go, I just hope the ISA doesn't clash with any of the big races again...

Anyway this is turning into a rambling post, if you want more insight into the event here's my final day recap, including some comments about the pros and cons of the event in general:

www.supracer.com/2014-isa-worlds-day-8-recap/


DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
15 May 2014 12:21am
Thanks Chris for explaining all that for us.
Goochi
Goochi
WA
846 posts
WA, 846 posts
14 May 2014 11:05pm
Thanks Chris that clears up my question. Always wondered why US/Hawaiian paddlers, Danny and Connor never compete. ISA and surfing Australia invest so much into SUP it is a shame to hear some of the top guys snub the event. Hopefully with all the experienced advice ISA seems like they are getting - the event will attract these big names.
No doubt the Aussies will beat them as well

*well Travis already did.
husq2100
husq2100
QLD
2031 posts
QLD, 2031 posts
15 May 2014 7:57am
PTWoody said...
husq2100 said...


yes, but the top Aussies did not go to ISA (both Mens and Womens SUP racing) why is their business.






It's a matter of opinion I suppose, but I think Lincoln's status as the top ranked Aussie this year is fair enough. He won the Australian title in the Technical race. Not so long ago everyone complained when Jamie Mitchell and Travis Grant were getting a free pass to the ISA without having to compete at nationals. I think it's a good thing that Surfing Australia maintains the integrity of team selection with credit given to the national champion. Besides, Jamie did not compete in any major events for most of the year, and Travis was injured for at least half the year. You could argue that Jake should have been there, but he has a big year of international events and he has to prioritise according to his own needs.


I wasnt referring to Travis or Jamie
Piros
Piros
QLD
7303 posts
QLD, 7303 posts
15 May 2014 9:03am
- Kai Lenny was the strangest one... He snubbed the event but then turned up in the same country at the exact same time. He was surfing an hour down the road all week... It was a bizarre choice and he didn't help it with some of his comments on Instagram. Almost all the paddlers I asked thought it was poor form and made him look like a bit of a diva.

That really does seem bizzare and out of character for him

Great post Chris and thanks for continually sharing the stoke and laying out the facts. I know the ISA like to hold the event in developing countries but it does need somewhere more accessible and prestigious to give it legs.
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
15 May 2014 9:58am
Seems like the main stumbling block is location , location , location. As for support from surfing Aus , what support? A track suit! Anyways congrats to the Aussies great performances all round.
surfgrub
surfgrub
NSW
105 posts
NSW, 105 posts
15 May 2014 10:21am
At least the dude from S.A. acknowledged the Aussies - even before the usual forum commenting 'locals'... (as opposed to we forum readers).
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