Removing Handle to cut down shaft

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FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 7:30am
Hi guys, what's the best way to remove the handle (glued with 5min epoxy), last time I did this i killed the handle and had to buy a new one as it was well overheated and delaminated inside the shaft.

From what I've read you need a hairdryer and heat the shaft until the glue gives way and you're able to slide the grip out? mmm that never happened last time, seemed to take forever too.

advise and ideas.. I want to cut down the shaft again.

Cheers
kiakaha
kiakaha
QLD
472 posts
QLD, 472 posts
9 Jan 2013 7:36am
Check out this little clip of Woogie removing the blade head from the shaft, cutting the shaft and then re glueing the blade - same will apply for the handle.

theoceanathlete.blogspot.com/2012/10/woogies-work-shop-talk.html

DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:57am
What brand/type of paddle?

DJ
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:29am
DavidJohn said...
What brand/type of paddle?

DJ


Hey DJ, its a QB
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
9 Jan 2013 10:01am
Does the handle go down into the shaft (like the Naish paddles) or does the shaft go into the handle like the Kialoa's.. ? .. If its like the Kialoa's this is what I would do.

I would cut it clean through about 1/2" down from the handle.. Then make two cuts in a cross down the 1/2" of shaft to the handle.. Then squeeze (with plyers) and break out the four small pieces of shaft in the handle.. If you want to try heat I would not use anything more than boiling water.

DJ
Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
9 Jan 2013 10:12am
^^^As DJ said.

I recently followed his instructions removing a snapped a shaft from both handle & blade. The handle was the easy bit - took about 5 mins, although it took me about an hour to get the shaft removed from the blade!
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 9:37am
DavidJohn said...
Does the handle go down into the shaft (like the Naish paddles) or does the shaft go into the handle like the Kialoa's.. ? .. If its like the Kialoa's this is what I would do.

I would cut it clean through about 1/2" down from the handle.. Then make two cuts in a cross down the 1/2" of shaft to the handle.. Then squeeze (with plyers) and break out the four small pieces of shaft in the handle.. If you want to try heat I would not use anything more than boiling water.

DJ


ah, the grip has a shaft, roughly 3 inches long that is inserted into the paddle shaft and glued. So the handle grip has a volume of it inside the paddle shaft..
loosescrews
loosescrews
NSW
4 posts
NSW, 4 posts
9 Jan 2013 10:53am
How much do you want to cut off ? I have a QB and I cut it down 2.5 " after it was glued. I just cut it off where i wanted it, went through the handle and left about 1/2" in the shaft, which was easily removed with long nose pliers. Then with a dremel and a small cut off wheel I cut length ways along the shaft that was left on the handle. it pealed off easy. Sanded the glue off the handle and re-glued it. It fine now. As long as you are wanting to cut at least 2 " off this method will be fine.
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
9 Jan 2013 11:32am
FlyingKiwi said...
DavidJohn said...
Does the handle go down into the shaft (like the Naish paddles) or does the shaft go into the handle like the Kialoa's.. ? .. If its like the Kialoa's this is what I would do.

I would cut it clean through about 1/2" down from the handle.. Then make two cuts in a cross down the 1/2" of shaft to the handle.. Then squeeze (with plyers) and break out the four small pieces of shaft in the handle.. If you want to try heat I would not use anything more than boiling water.

DJ


ah, the grip has a shaft, roughly 3 inches long that is inserted into the paddle shaft and glued. So the handle grip has a volume of it inside the paddle shaft..


Bummer.. I would try soaking it in boiling water for a few minutes and then twist and pull and see if it moves any.. You might need a camping stove or something you can put on the floor because a kitchen stove will be too high if you want to have your paddle in it while it boils.. Or maybe just boil some water first and then put the pot on the ground and soak your paddle handle in it.

DJ
HumanCartoon
HumanCartoon
VIC
2098 posts
VIC, 2098 posts
9 Jan 2013 12:50pm
I have used a heat gun successfully to loosen several different types of epoxy, including 5min araldite...just takes some care...go slowly and rotate the section of shaft evenly to spread the heat progressively and prevent the sort of delam problem you described. When it is just too hot to touch comfortably it should release when you twist it. Helps to have another pair of strong hands or pad up a vise to hold the handle against the twist. Go sloooowly.

EDit:
Tip - assuming you get a result and get the handle out cleanly, don't use epoxy to glue it back in. Use hot glue (Bostik or similar). Holds plenty strong enough and is much much easier to remove with heat if you need to go through the process again.
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
9 Jan 2013 1:28pm
Where AA when you need him..

DJ
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 1:19pm
Ha, thanks for all the tips guys, I am going to cut a decent amount off which should allow about an inch of shaft with the grip, then can do the described method (loosescrews). HC I did use a heatgun and was rotating etc etc, then i when it was too hot to touch, still didn't want to release, hence the delam in the handle, will certainly consider another glue rather than 5min epoxy - however this should be the last time :)

Hopefully.
MickMc
MickMc
VIC
456 posts
VIC, 456 posts
9 Jan 2013 2:27pm
I got mine off by sticking it in boiling water for about 5 minutes.
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 1:36pm
MickMc said...
I got mine off by sticking it in boiling water for about 5 minutes.


no harm in trying that too! Cheers
sharpie
sharpie
NSW
347 posts
NSW, 347 posts
9 Jan 2013 3:30pm
i guess im lucky having a lathe at work, my method, was to put the paddle in the chuck and turn off cuts about as far down the shaft as the handle went in the shaft just taking small cuts till eventually the handle just falls off, clean it up and reglue. possibly will still work with oval shafts.
laceys lane
laceys lane
QLD
19804 posts
QLD, 19804 posts
9 Jan 2013 2:43pm
HumanCartoon said...
I have used a heat gun successfully to loosen several different types of epoxy, including 5min araldite...just takes some care...go slowly and rotate the section of shaft evenly to spread the heat progressively and prevent the sort of delam problem you described. When it is just too hot to touch comfortably it should release when you twist it. Helps to have another pair of strong hands or pad up a vise to hold the handle against the twist. Go sloooowly.

EDit:
Tip - assuming you get a result and get the handle out cleanly, don't use epoxy to glue it back in. Use hot glue (Bostik or similar). Holds plenty strong enough and is much much easier to remove with heat if you need to go through the process again.



this is the way. done it over a dozen times. slowly is the key. don't get the handle and shaft too hot. the glue will break down.

even if you let the shaft and handle cool a touch before twisting.

make sure you heat all the glue areas and not just blast away at the top of shaft and work the handle too much.

you shouldn't need great force to twist- heat again slooooooowly
surf4fun
surf4fun
WA
1313 posts
WA, 1313 posts
9 Jan 2013 12:46pm
Same thing happened to me first time. Put too much araldite in, added too much heat and the handle delamed and had to spend an hour cutting it out very slowly. Litterally took my handle out this morning to shorten my paddle and with no more than 90 secs from the hair dryer it popped out no problem what so ever.
gumballs
gumballs
NSW
408 posts
NSW, 408 posts
9 Jan 2013 4:48pm
MickMc said...
I got mine off by sticking it in boiling water for about 5 minutes.


I have 2 QB paddles and have used hot water to remove the handles on both.Works great,I just stick the part of the shaft in question under the hot water tap in the bathtub then after a few min's get it in a headlock and try to rip it's head off...Heaps of fun..
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 7:19pm
mmmm, the hot water thing ain't cutting it...
I have cut the shaft to size, and now have a segment of shaft attached to the handle, I have about 20mm of shaft past the bottom of the handle, so will try hot
water again, then try a hairdryer, then possibly use profanities at it :)

See how that goes :)
HumanCartoon
HumanCartoon
VIC
2098 posts
VIC, 2098 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:34pm
FlyingKiwi said...
mmmm, the hot water thing ain't cutting it...
I have cut the shaft to size, and now have a segment of shaft attached to the handle


In which case Woogie's way is the way.
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
9 Jan 2013 9:21pm
Tried elbow grease?

DJ
gumballs
gumballs
NSW
408 posts
NSW, 408 posts
9 Jan 2013 9:35pm
Thats strange I thought the hot water would'a worked a treat.But I didn't cut the shaft till after I'd got the handle off that way I had the full length of the shaft and the blade to use as leverage.
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:40pm
gumballs said...
Thats strange I thought the hot water would'a worked a treat.But I didn't cut the shaft till after I'd got the handle off that way I had the full length of the shaft and the blade to use as leverage.


mmmmmmm my bad!!!!!!!
ScarbsSUP
ScarbsSUP
WA
354 posts
WA, 354 posts
9 Jan 2013 6:42pm
Hi Guys,

We remove handles and cut shafts all the time in the shop. We use 5min Araldite Epoxy.

I use an industrial heat gun and slowly heat the entire area where the handle is in contact with the shaft. Rotate the shaft as you heat it and don't allow it to get hot spots by focusing too much heat in one spot. When it is too hot to touch, clamp the blade or get some one to hold it and grab the handle and twist for all you're worth, they usually come out really easy.

We had one fail where the handle was almost destroyed, I have my suspicions that the handle was glued in using 24hr Araldite Epoxy. Don't use it, too permanent!

Good luck!

DM
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:43pm
DavidJohn said...
Tried elbow grease?

DJ


yeah Lots DJ, will persist with it, will try heating slowly as HC suggested, think the fist time I heated it too hot, ensuring that the epoxy and handle itself destabilized.
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:51pm
ScarbsSUP said...
Hi Guys,

We remove handles and cut shafts all the time in the shop. We use 5min Araldite Epoxy.

I use an industrial heat gun and slowly heat the entire area where the handle is in contact with the shaft. Rotate the shaft as you heat it and don't allow it to get hot spots by focusing too much heat in one spot. When it is too hot to touch, clamp the blade or get some one to hold it and grab the handle and twist for all you're worth, they usually come out really easy.

We had one fail where the handle was almost destroyed, I have my suspicions that the handle was glued in using 24hr Araldite Epoxy. Don't use it, too permanent!

Good luck!

DM


Thanks guys, that is exactly what happened to me last time, but can assure you it was 5min epoxy! I now have about a 4inch shaft with my handle, will persist!! heat n see!

thanks for help
caRRera
caRRera
11 posts
11 posts
9 Jan 2013 8:15pm
I've to cut also my paddle, and think I'm going to try the boiling water method. Will keep you updated
AA
AA
NSW
2167 posts
AA AA
NSW, 2167 posts
10 Jan 2013 4:17pm
The Hot Air Gun works best if it is 5min Araldite. With 24hr full strength it is very hard not to melt the epoxy and destroy your paddle.
As Scarbs said you need to heat up the SHAFT evenly. Try not to heat up the handle. The top of the shaft needs to be quite hot to break the seal of the glue and you need 2 people to separate the handle from the shaft. One standing on the blade flat on the carpet and the other trying to rotate the handle out of the shaft.
It is best that you get a professional to do it as there is always the risk that you will over heat and damage the integrity of the shaft or handle.
AA
AA
NSW
2167 posts
AA AA
NSW, 2167 posts
10 Jan 2013 4:19pm
In essence you are trying to melt the Araldite but not the Epoxy in the paddle!
Good luck!
FlyingKiwi
FlyingKiwi
QLD
218 posts
QLD, 218 posts
10 Jan 2013 5:16pm
thanks all for your advice and finally you AA, I tried the hot hot hot water thing this am, wasn't keen to heat gun it again given the limited length.

I grabbed an angle grinder and slowly worked the carbon shaft away, leaving me the handle once I had finished, very slow patient job, but worth it as my complete paddle is now shorter and curing ready for what ever my usually crap local conditions throw at me.

I did take out my spare adjustable paddle this am and tried it at the same length, little strange at first but can see the benefit, looking forward to the short board and QB tomorrow am, first real indication....

Cheers again SBzers for your advice :)
caRRera
caRRera
11 posts
11 posts
10 Jan 2013 10:54pm
AA said...
The Hot Air Gun works best if it is 5min Araldite. With 24hr full strength it is very hard not to melt the epoxy and destroy your paddle.
As Scarbs said you need to heat up the SHAFT evenly. Try not to heat up the handle. The top of the shaft needs to be quite hot to break the seal of the glue and you need 2 people to separate the handle from the shaft. One standing on the blade flat on the carpet and the other trying to rotate the handle out of the shaft.
It is best that you get a professional to do it as there is always the risk that you will over heat and damage the integrity of the shaft or handle.


Tried without success only to remember later that I fixed it with the aid of my mechanic using his strong epoxy ... I'll keep it as it is
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