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wider boards give lift .duh .

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Created by Tardy 23 days ago, 10 May 2020
Tardy
3501 posts
10 May 2020 12:04PM
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well i just came back from a disappointed surf ..althought the waves where quite good and punishing to the person who took the wrong board .
I arrived at the surf ..6-8 guys on the left hander and none on the big right ..it was rather blowy and seemed like a fairly smooth wall
But as i approached ,it was far from that ..very surgey and rough ..and well well over head and because a cross shore wind it was holding it up and very steep waves ,i though well lets test this 8,7 ..31.5 wide placid out ..well i had to paddle hard to hook on them and by the time you where on it ,it was like looking down a cliff face ...i managed a few good drops but once the wind and chop hit the little 8,7 and 31.5 wide board it was very uncomfortable ..and had a few good stacks ..no surfers came out as i doubt they would of been able to catch them with there 5,6 and 5,8

so i was not pissed off with the board I was pissed off with my self for not bringing a longer and narrower board ..9.1 acid or my 9,11 insane which where left at home
it could of been a really good surf for me ..but i now relies that wider ,shorter boards are not really that good in big windy days ..much like my bigger windsurfboards ,width means lift..its a lesson i should already have learnt ,but I learnt again and now a bit sore ...as the speed i came off hurt quite a bit ..ha ha ...

I grovelled over to the smallest left with the other proners ...and hassled it out on the big ones

has anyone else been out surfing ..and realised you are on the wrong board for the day ..or experienced wider boards can be scary in big windy days ..

Gboots
NSW, 917 posts
10 May 2020 5:28PM
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Good post Tardy . Whenever there's any strong offshore wind I now avoid taking a board that has a wide nose. Even though the Acid I use is over size and 30 wide , the pointy nose just deals with it . If am on a Speeed or the ECS it just becomes harder to get down face .
If the offshores are strong but waves are small I take out my "test board" the 77 Flow . It has a pointy nose and there's way less foam to try and manage in the strong wind. But I would not use it in strong offshore and waves larger larger than 3 foot.

In summary when in doubt I take the big Acid out


Kami
1479 posts
10 May 2020 5:17PM
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Good post Tardy; Up to Gboots said, pointy nose, flat entry nice bow and a short paddle to have to bend knees and therefore stand up lower than usually, taking less air over body as well as underneath the bow.

Tardy
3501 posts
10 May 2020 5:19PM
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Thanks boots ...nose sure is different ,with the acid having very little foam in the nose ..it's the length of the acid I missed too ..I just could not get down a few ..it just nose dived at the top of the wave ,,SSS ..

Tardy
3501 posts
10 May 2020 5:32PM
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HERES AVID I MADE A YEAR AGO incase you missed it ,TODAY WAS bigger and choppier ,but the acid just cruises its way around

Tardy
3501 posts
10 May 2020 5:41PM
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Kami said..
Good post Tardy; Up to Gboots said, pointy nose, flat entry nice bow and a short paddle to have to bend knees and therefore stand up lower than usually, taking less air over body as well as underneath the bow.



thanks Kami ...i tried a few things ,,up the back in the middle ,but still had the bounce thing happening ,,I think the insane had to come out today .not a day for a short trick board ,,,

Tardy
3501 posts
10 May 2020 5:44PM
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Check the difference between these two


benjl
383 posts
10 May 2020 5:51PM
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Thanks for the interesting post, funnily enough I had my own experience and thought process today too- though was happy with my choice of board.

Ive largely used a 8'3 jimmy lewis supertech in every condition for the past few years. Small, well
overhead. Just played around with fins. It seemed to be stable enough and fast enough to grovel and handle the juice.
I had a raft of other boards over the time but this one just seemed to do it all.

then I brought a 7'2 hypernut recently. Instantly I noticed the speed and how well it picked up small stuff but didn't feel like the short length was any better to my longer 8'3 supertech. after a few other sessions on it, I started to like it more and more as it made surfing fun and increasingly able to whip some tight turns.

today I went back out to my old fave beach, it was low tide and about 1.6m set face on the reports. I decided to take the supertech which I actually haven't surfed in 5 months now.
wow, they are such different boards. The waves ended up being bigger and more hollow than the report with some being around 1.5x overhead and heavy folding lips.
on the first drop I felt how much slower the suoertech was, how much longer it is to initiate a tight turn but also how much more rocker it had and how it felt stable on a hollow face. It gave me inspiration to tackle heavy big waves again and really defines the difference between the boards.
they are both 105l, but very different boards and have their volume in very different places.
now where I have a hard decision, is that I also have a 100l blue plant ninja star which is even more refined and makes the supertech look like a groveller

surfinJ
475 posts
10 May 2020 8:32PM
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I have had the same experience with width. Too much width combined with bigger waves results loss of control. Feels as if the board is out of the water and plaining too much and the tail is then releasing. The widths above 31 also seem to have a 'drop in' resistance on a bigger wave. I seemed to get hung up in the lip with the board not easily dropping into the wave.

Souwester
WA, 1045 posts
10 May 2020 10:23PM
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I reckon the location of the width is a huge factor, too far up the front and I can agree that it would hold you up, similar to the literate discussions - not the total but where it is and other parts of the boards design should be considered.

BTW Tardy, looks like you rip on the 9'1 in the clip, super fun!

Tardy
3501 posts
11 May 2020 12:11PM
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your riding smaller boards than me benji ...shows how old i am a fast paddling board always seems to be a fav.

surfinJ ,AGREE with the over 31 ,this is my second surf SUP board now over 31.both have had this issue ,the first was the 9 flash at 31,5 ,just could not get down them on windy days ,sold that .i remember your colourful acid .

sou'wester thanks ,the acids are ripper boards ,pulled in tails and nose ,would be great for WA .they are not that popular now .but they still make them on order ...
Agree with width location ,the 9,1 acid is 30 5/8 but its mid and a long board ,and a really fast paddler ,which i missed this day
i think that also count s ..for big waves ,,the placid is a slow paddler ,so i was hanging up on the lip a lot ,and some hell late drops .
i fell off two waves at the bottom ,the speed and the bump como had me and the board airborne and out of control, had the proners in fits
I Thought i was don't well as a SUPer ..but kooked it .. oh well ..the proners never came over ...it was just too nasty ..and big .I had a few rippers ..and i think my leg rope is a little longer now ...i haven't been dragged like that for a while ..winter swell is here .

Browy
QLD, 14 posts
11 May 2020 2:39PM
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I purchased the 8"3 Placid last week and surfed it for the first time on Friday morning. Solid 5ft beachy which was getting pretty sucky. The board handled it really well. Coming down from a 8"11 Maddog was quite a step but i started to think that the only thing the Placid needed was just a fraction more nose rocker to help with the bigger/steeper drops.

I also have an 8"1 Jl Worldwide that is best on glassy days but the sweet spot in this board is very small from a balance perspective.

What i could not believe was the stability in the Palcid. For a board with only 2 more ltrs of volume over my JL the stability is amazing. It runs onto the waves very easily and you can get into "surf stance" really early on the take off which gives you much more direction control time to weight shift to make the drop when trying to out run a close out.

I would argue that a longer board is not needed to take out the bumps on that fast down the face movement. The main reason i started looking for a replacement for the Maddog was because of the board chatter and bounce on the face of a wave that was a little bigger and lumpier. It was hard to control and turn because of the bouncing around no matter where i had my weight.

Gboots
NSW, 917 posts
11 May 2020 4:40PM
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The Sunova construction (the XXX not sure about new one) reduces "chatter " . It feels like butter on a sunova . My Starby Pro starlite has plenty of that "chatter" and my ankles feel more pain when not using the Sunovas

Tardy
3501 posts
11 May 2020 3:34PM
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yes boots...the wood is a great absorber of bumps and they flex ,my naish's where also chatter boxes ..the more carbon in the board the more rigid and stiff they become ,pretty sure naish still uses carbon in his GT 'S .
GOOD you like your placid browy ..great board and good stability ...i like mine a lot
you will get better and in tune with your board even more ..as time goes by .you like it as a quad or thruster .

surfinJ
475 posts
11 May 2020 10:52PM
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My Acid is a custom. At 30" wide it has till now just slipped in fine till about double overhead. And felt in control at speed. But my gun and and a PSH 9 all around at 28" wide definitely feel more like an ideal width.



Kami
1479 posts
11 May 2020 10:53PM
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Souwester said..
I reckon the location of the width is a huge factor, too far up the front and I can agree that it would hold you up, similar to the literate discussions - not the total but where it is and other parts of the boards design should be considered.

BTW Tardy, looks like you rip on the 9'1 in the clip, super fun!



Southwester, You rightly point on the width position. At my home beachI did experiment some really pull-in nose with that 8'9" 29" < 100 Twinzer which has a easy take off board in over head and onshore situations ( shifty and unpredictable ) . I'm 79kg 176cm.
Easy take off because the narrow nose digs into the face. It's loosing some paddling ability but the length of 8'9" give back some as an exchange.
Once take off the narrow nose comes up or pierces trough the chop when later on the rail curved length got stability while bottom turning down the flat. Twinzer set-up made of Mr and Gx are doing the necessary drive to provide speed and stability trough long wall. Quiet flight...
Then dues to this width pulled past the middle to the rear, this board get very loose to cut back and hit the lip after a long trajectory.
Hoops I was going to forget mentioning about the bottom...slighty rolled all along to have a smooth transfer in relation with a flat rocker, this one enhancing the speed while paddling for the next wave


So when it get overhead and heavy, I better like to go out with the Blue 7'11" 28'5"
Although these 2 boards (red and blue) are quite different, they have in common the front part of the board less positive than the rear part that is the meanest parameter between choosing width or volume is the ability to throw the front part of the board down the face for early take off to avoid this way the bumpy part of the wave staying closer to the curl ( which is usually smoother than the bottom)


Yes Tardy , your Acid or Insane was definitely the choice to get those gnarly waves











surfinJ
475 posts
11 May 2020 10:53PM
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Those are some beauties you got there Kami.

Browy
QLD, 14 posts
12 May 2020 10:58AM
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Tardy said..
yes boots...the wood is a great absorber of bumps and they flex ,my naish's where also chatter boxes ..the more carbon in the board the more rigid and stiff they become ,pretty sure naish still uses carbon in his GT 'S .
GOOD you like your placid browy ..great board and good stability ...i like mine a lot
you will get better and in tune with your board even more ..as time goes by .you like it as a quad or thruster .


Tardy, the guys at SC Board sports recommended to run it as a quad so i am going to give that a go for a couple of weeks. It is the first board i have run as a quad.

Will give it a go in thruster mode later to see how it goes. First impressions are it may be a bit easier to throw it around in thruster set-up.

TBM
NSW, 28 posts
12 May 2020 11:37AM
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Back in the day - one board with glassed in fins would be used (only could afford one board) and you adapt your paddle in, take off, foot positioning and surf style to suit the conditions, break and swell. I tend to have the same approach with my surf sup. One board for my main surf break and keep the same fins. Too often multiple fin changes, changes in surf sup boards for the same surf break etc mean riders do not truly know their board. Different boards for point breaks reefs, beaches etc I have . But there is something about using the one board and adapting and connecting to the board in a range of conditions and surf size mean you know the board really well and your surfing grows. Anyway, just my take on things.

lam
VIC, 99 posts
12 May 2020 12:16PM
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TBM said..
Back in the day - one board with glassed in fins would be used (only could afford one board) and you adapt your paddle in, take off, foot positioning and surf style to suit the conditions, break and swell. I tend to have the same approach with my surf sup. One board for my main surf break and keep the same fins. Too often multiple fin changes, changes in surf sup boards for the same surf break etc mean riders do not truly know their board. Different boards for point breaks reefs, beaches etc I have . But there is something about using the one board and adapting and connecting to the board in a range of conditions and surf size mean you know the board really well and your surfing grows. Anyway, just my take on things.


Totally agree

colas
3835 posts
12 May 2020 1:02PM
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TBM said..
But there is something about using the one board and adapting and connecting to the board in a range of conditions and surf size mean you know the board really well and your surfing grows.


What I found is that you need both.
- some periods where you use only one board, to refine your technique and go very far in understanding it
- some radical change of boards (long, ultra short, Simmons, ...) to widen your perspectives

Basically go far and go wide to cover the largest "surface" of experience!

TBM
NSW, 28 posts
12 May 2020 3:17PM
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colas said..

TBM said..
But there is something about using the one board and adapting and connecting to the board in a range of conditions and surf size mean you know the board really well and your surfing grows.



What I found is that you need both.
- some periods where you use only one board, to refine your technique and go very far in understanding it
- some radical change of boards (long, ultra short, Simmons, ...) to widen your perspectives

Basically go far and go wide to cover the largest "surface" of experience!


Agreed. Otherwise I'd be still surfing my 70's board with glassed in fins.

Souwester
WA, 1045 posts
12 May 2020 1:33PM
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I love the idea of one board but it's just not practical, I only have 1 atm and think a second would be spot on. One I'm comfy on for majority of the time and a high performance one for a challenge and when good waves are around for a period of time

Gboots
NSW, 917 posts
12 May 2020 4:54PM
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Right now if I had to limit to two boards to cover everything it would be :
Acid 9'1 - comfort and assurance board
Speeed 7'11 - When not concerned about conditions

Both very different and both can teach me a lot

Tardy
3501 posts
12 May 2020 3:57PM
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I Don't think i could do one board anymore ..

i get bored ...I love a challenge every now and then ,,,plus you never stop learning

if i had stuck with one board ,i would never of found out what size suits me .

3 is ok

supthecreek
1965 posts
12 May 2020 9:42PM
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Select to expand quote
TBM said..
Back in the day - one board with glassed in fins would be used (only could afford one board) and you adapt your paddle in, take off, foot positioning and surf style to suit the conditions, break and swell. I tend to have the same approach with my surf sup. One board for my main surf break and keep the same fins. Too often multiple fin changes, changes in surf sup boards for the same surf break etc mean riders do not truly know their board. Different boards for point breaks reefs, beaches etc I have . But there is something about using the one board and adapting and connecting to the board in a range of conditions and surf size mean you know the board really well and your surfing grows. Anyway, just my take on things.


What you say makes a lot of sense, there is a lot of value in really being in sync with your board.
I get in the groove with one board and dial it in for a long period.

Then, I need change.
Having always been a "quiver" person since 1972,
I move between boards without issue.
My brain builds a "chip" for every board, so when I swap out, there is no adjustment period.

I change boards to keep surfing fresh.
Each board brings something different, and I enjoy that.
Like a golf bag.... where each club has a purpose.

I look at the conditions, then open my van and one of them says "pick me!"

but I have tried to trim down a bit.....




anchorpoint
103 posts
13 May 2020 6:05AM
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supthecreek said..






sweet lord supthecreek ! did you actually manage to fit 13 SUP inside!!!

cantSUPenough
VIC, 1925 posts
13 May 2020 10:57AM
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Browy said..

Tardy said..
yes boots...the wood is a great absorber of bumps and they flex ,my naish's where also chatter boxes ..the more carbon in the board the more rigid and stiff they become ,pretty sure naish still uses carbon in his GT 'S .
GOOD you like your placid browy ..great board and good stability ...i like mine a lot
you will get better and in tune with your board even more ..as time goes by .you like it as a quad or thruster .



Tardy, the guys at SC Board sports recommended to run it as a quad so i am going to give that a go for a couple of weeks. It is the first board i have run as a quad.

Will give it a go in thruster mode later to see how it goes. First impressions are it may be a bit easier to throw it around in thruster set-up.


For what it is worth, I struggled a little with my Placid for a while (8'7 125L, I am 100 kg) but perservered in part by trying different fins. I am using thruster C-drives and lovin' life! I have never understood fins and the difference they make, but I know I did not like the board until I found the right fin combo.

For what it is worth, I find it a bit slow in smaller surf (waist high or less) but love it as it gets bigger. I have been using it until I think the waves will be consistently overhead (with some anger built into them) and I have been switching back to the Acid (or Insane for the much bigger waves). I have had a bit of trouble with it bouncing around but at my local break I solve that by getting more weight forward.

Tardy
3501 posts
13 May 2020 1:51PM
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FINS make a HUGE difference ,,,once you find the right combo ...fibreglass them in

creek ...i want that van ..now ,

stehar
NSW, 317 posts
13 May 2020 4:07PM
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Ok - looks like 6 boards in the " rehab " van -- what are your keepers?

Steve

SupChickadee
VIC, 105 posts
13 May 2020 9:25PM
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SuptheCreek - i need a van BUT I see there is no room in your the for sleeping on overnight supstar trips?



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"wider boards give lift .duh ." started by Tardy