Harness line lengths...

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General Gps & Speed Waves Foiling Gear Reviews Lost & Found WA NSW QLD SA VIC TAS

Harrow

NSW

4521 posts

Harrow

NSW, 4521 posts

19 Jul 2006 10:19am

I use 22 inch, but only because that is what someone gave me. What does everyone else use?

Do different lengths suit different types of sailing or conditions?

Crash Landing

NSW

1173 posts

Crash Landing

NSW, 1173 posts

19 Jul 2006 12:07pm

22-28 depending on the conditions. Freestyle, waves, strong winds etc I like to be further from the boom/sail - better for one handed jumps etc. If I'm underpowered I'd use shorter lines.

I tend to sail with lines about 2-3 inches apart on the boom - this'll obviously make the lines longer.

Ones that can be changed when you are on the water are good - I've often sailed with harness lines a lot longer for heading out and shorter on the way in..

I guess it also depends on what harness type you have.

Boris

261 posts

Boris

261 posts

19 Jul 2006 11:19am

I don't use any. I'm so f**ken strong.

MikeyS

VIC

1509 posts

MikeyS

VIC, 1509 posts

19 Jul 2006 1:32pm

Ah, Boris. You mean you don't use harness lines to keep that chunk of manhood restrained?

Harrow

NSW

4521 posts

Harrow

NSW, 4521 posts

19 Jul 2006 1:33pm

At least I got one serious answer before the circuis clowns arrived.

I guess I should be thankful for at least that.

rosey

NSW

575 posts

rosey

NSW, 575 posts

19 Jul 2006 2:02pm

medium ones are the easiest, you dont want to be close to the boom whist underpowered coz you are more likely to fal and not unhook, goin straight into your sail...

mineral1

4564 posts

mineral1

WA, 4564 posts

19 Jul 2006 12:27pm

Harrow, still learning with these things, looking at the advise on the latest or month previous windsurfing mag from UK, the rule of thumb is supposed to be as long as the length of your forearm (from elbow to inside of thumb.)
Tried this and it was too long for me, but would guess that as I get better, I want to be further out on the harness. Right now I use 26".
Only a short arse 5'9" myself.
Have a fixed set, and an adjustable set, never changed the adjustable, so cant tell if they are better or not.

Crash Landing

NSW

1173 posts

Crash Landing

NSW, 1173 posts

19 Jul 2006 2:58pm

Elbow/Hand thing is a good measure. I used to do a lot of slalom sailing on flat water and found the best length of harness line (except when overpowered) was just a little longer than the length between thumb and little finger when the fingers are spread as wide as possible. Hopefully that makes sense. I'd guess it made a loop of 22cm's (from bottom to boom). This got a really good, upright stance which improved early planing. As soon as it got really windy the loop was made bigger - elbow to beginning of hand.

Adjustable are good if you stay out on the same sail but change downhaul and fin sizes rather than change sail. A longer line gets more of your weight on the board and therefore more control!

MikeyS

VIC

1509 posts

MikeyS

VIC, 1509 posts

19 Jul 2006 3:16pm

Sorry Harrow. I retract my silly comment. I promise to only give serious, direct answers to all questions in future. I'm not a clown, but I can juggle. Boris made me do it.
I find adjustable lines to be the way to go, but not sure about the length. Just like moving the base a few cm forward or back, or tuning downhaul and outhaul, sometimes you get that "sweet spot" by adjusting harness line length, as well as position on the boom. Certinly longer lines seem to give better control in high wind and chop. Being too close to the boom doesn't give you much margin for correction or fast unhooking, ie increased chances of catapulting.
Yours seriously.

Waiting4wind

NSW

1871 posts

Waiting4wind

NSW, 1871 posts

19 Jul 2006 7:28pm

I used 22" for years (except in surf)and felt totally comfortable and dialed in, and I'm a tall guy. A while back I was told that to go fast I needed longer lines. I tried it and it was like learning to sail all over again, but now that I'm used to it 24/25" works really well. Definitely get yourself a set of adjustable 22-26 and experiement.
Des

Waiting4wind

NSW

1871 posts

Waiting4wind

NSW, 1871 posts

19 Jul 2006 7:28pm

Gestalt

QLD

14968 posts

Gestalt

QLD, 14968 posts

19 Jul 2006 7:49pm

yes harrow,

different lengths for different sailing conditions and also different harnesses.

for up to 15 knots with big sails (8.5 and up) i set my boom level with my eyes and run 24" set 15cm apart. (i can only just hook in by standing on my toes while using a seat harness and sometimes find it easier to jump a little in the light winds to unhook. when planning i can hook in easily).

with a 7.5 i lower the boom to my chin and use the same line length.
with a 6.6 i set my boom just under my chin. same harnees lines..

with the wave gear, 6.5m and down i set the boom just under my chin and use 24". i think these are too long and would prefer shorter. however i always use a seat harness. a waist harness will require shorter.

rather than constantly adjusting your harness line length you can also try your boom height. higher for light winds and or upwind sailing and lower for wave and or speed.

some brands of harness lines allow you to cut them shorter.

i use north adjustable on the race kit. letting the harness line out when sailing downwind and shortening it when sailing upwind is a good feature.

nebbian

6277 posts

nebbian

WA, 6277 posts

19 Jul 2006 5:54pm

I got a set of adjustable lines a couple of months ago, but recently went back to the standard fixed 22" set. The reason is that all those extra bits flying around can sometimes get tangled in the harness hook, making it difficult to get in or out of the harness.

I tried putting the adjuster straps under the velcro, but even then they were a bit of a PITA.

Just my $0.02.

greenleader

QLD

5283 posts

greenleader

QLD, 5283 posts

19 Jul 2006 8:04pm

quote:
Originally posted by Boris

I don't use any. I'm so f**ken strong.

onya boris,
george greenough welded 26cm of stainless bar with a hook on it onto his spreader a decade or so ago.
we used to think this was a bit strange as you couldn't say hi and shake his hand without being poked in the chest by it.
eliminated harness lines though, just hook onto the boom.

DavMen

NSW

1510 posts

DavMen

NSW, 1510 posts

20 Jul 2006 10:23am

quote:
Originally posted by Gestalt

yes harrow,

with the wave gear, 6.5m and down i set the boom just under my chin and use 24". i think these are too long and would prefer shorter. however i always use a seat harness. a waist harness will require shorter.

Hi Gesalt

Do you use a seat harness in surf? - I havn't sailed in surf but hope to soon. I have always used a seat harness, and thought this is someting I had to change (to waist) before hitting the waves.

DavMen

Gestalt

QLD

14968 posts

Gestalt

QLD, 14968 posts

20 Jul 2006 10:39am

hi davmen,

it depends on your ambitions, i am not too good with the surf thing, so a seat harness is fine for what i am trying to do. if you want to really concentrate on surf then a waist harness is probably the go. when in the surf you will be constantly unhooking and hooking back in. a seat harness can be clumsy for this. a waist harness is much easier.

most of my mates up the coast that go in the surf use seat harnesses because they have come from flat water and ocean slalom sailing so they were using what they had when they started out.

racycoot

315 posts

racycoot

WA, 315 posts

20 Jul 2006 8:46am

DavMen, def get yourself a decent waist harness before getting into the waves. I started out in the waves with a seat harness and found that I just didn't have enough movement to cope. Kept getting chucked over the handlebars. Bought a waisty and haven't looked back.

I recommend avoiding the cheapest of cheap harness cos it'll either ride up or damage your back (mine cost ~$200).

Harrow

NSW

4521 posts

Harrow

NSW, 4521 posts

20 Jul 2006 1:00pm

quote:
Originally posted by MikeyS

Sorry Harrow. I retract my silly comment. I promise to only give serious, direct answers to all questions in future. I'm not a clown, but I can juggle. Boris made me do it.
Yours seriously.

MikeyS, Please don't stop - send in the clowns!!!!!

Wow, can't believe all the new things I keep discovering. Never thought harness line length was going to raise so much discussion. Still, I think a set of longer lines would have been useful in the Botany Bay swell and chop on Tuesday. I was certainly close to over balancing and going 'over the handle bars' at times.

Boris

261 posts

Boris

261 posts

20 Jul 2006 11:50am

quote:
Boris made me do it.

Hey Mikey, dobbers wear nappies!

MikeyS

VIC

1509 posts

MikeyS

VIC, 1509 posts

20 Jul 2006 3:52pm

Nope Boris. Not falling for that one. You led me astray once. I've sworn a vow of sobriety and seriousness. I'm not responding!

hobie14t

QLD

259 posts

hobie14t

QLD, 259 posts

20 Jul 2006 4:01pm

Hey nebbian,

I have a set of adjustable pro-limit harness line, they dont have the velcro that NP and others have, they look really basic, the rope through the line just loops back on its self and can easily be adjusted, although there is no gauge to show the length they are at, but I assume you could mark it out with a perm marker pen.

I also find them super strong, I broke a NP adjustable line once during a catapult with hardly any real force. The pro-limit look and feel 100% stronger.

Check them out I reckon if you want adjustable.

mikey100

QLD

1109 posts

mikey100

QLD, 1109 posts

20 Jul 2006 8:47pm

Have been having this same discussion with fellow sailors recently after reading english forumns and mag articles. Over there 26in- 30in is now the standard- all stating that 22in went out of favour many years ago. So I tried........ moving from 22in to 26in, ends 15cm apart, rear of line attached 1/3 back from the front of the boom. Strange at first, but after 2 or 3 sails I am a convert. I feel safer from catapult, arms are straighter and more relaxed, rig more forward and upright(better mast downward pressure)All I can say is--- give them a go, a couple of goes, and see what suits you.

NotWal

QLD

7436 posts

NotWal

QLD, 7436 posts

21 Jul 2006 11:11am

Yep, I had a similar experience to you mikey100. I think my lines are about 26 to 28 inches. It feels right but I seem to have a lot more accidental hook-ins. Just something to get used to.

jsn_batman

86 posts

jsn_batman

WA, 86 posts

21 Jul 2006 9:19am

Adjustable harness lines are the way to go, however sometimes ], only sometimes are they a pain in the rear when you're going the speed of light on a downwind course and they slip

. But they are good when you bear off and need to go upwind, so you can loosen or tighten them.

Harrow

NSW

4521 posts

Harrow

NSW, 4521 posts

21 Jul 2006 11:36am

quote:
Originally posted by jsn_batman

Adjustable harness lines are the way to go, however sometimes ], only sometimes are they a pain in the rear when you're going the speed of light on a downwind course and they slip. But they are good when you bear off and need to go upwind, so you can loosen or tighten them.

So they're that easy to adjust on the fly? Do they adjust one-handed while sailing?

jsn_batman

86 posts

jsn_batman

WA, 86 posts

21 Jul 2006 9:55am

well loosening then on the fly is easier then tightening them but yep they sure do. just need a bit of force though

. i'm pretty sure they go from 22 inch to 28 or even up to 30 inch, usually only need to adjust then once or twice when sailing.

and no i never use harness lines any bigger then 26 inch on a waist harness.

Gestalt

QLD

14968 posts

Gestalt

QLD, 14968 posts

21 Jul 2006 12:10pm

agree.

i got the 26 to 32in. then cut them down so they were 24 to 30 in. so to shorten them i just pull all of the length in and end up with 24".

to let them go just use your thumb on your sheet hand. just like ringing the bell on a bike.

NotWal

QLD

7436 posts

NotWal

QLD, 7436 posts

22 Jul 2006 6:39pm

On my short booms, the ones I use the most, I have those adjustable lines that are tied through a cringle. They are fixed except that you can, with the help of a fid, loosen and retie them at a different length. I took the precaution of pouring a tube of superglue through the webbing around the cringle because a similar pair (North) that I had before failed by pulling the cringle off the webbing. These are good. I recommend them if you want to try different lengths.

I use adjustable (on the fly) harness lines on the booms that I use with my biggest sail (8.5). They are the ones that use a trapeze clam cleat. The only thing I don't like about them is the way they freely swing around when I'm not hooked in. I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a better setup that is more or less stiff but still easy to adjust.

While I'm at it, the adjustable outhaul I use on those booms uses clam cleats too. Although they work well they get in the way when throwing the sail around. I'm wondering if those AOs that use the triglide buckles a la Loft or Sailworks work as effectively or better?

racycoot

315 posts

racycoot

WA, 315 posts

3 Aug 2006 9:50am

quote:
Originally posted by mikey100

Have been having this same discussion with fellow sailors recently after reading english forumns and mag articles. Over there 26in- 30in is now the standard- all stating that 22in went out of favour many years ago. So I tried........ moving from 22in to 26in, ends 15cm apart, rear of line attached 1/3 back from the front of the boom. Strange at first, but after 2 or 3 sails I am a convert. I feel safer from catapult, arms are straighter and more relaxed, rig more forward and upright(better mast downward pressure)All I can say is--- give them a go, a couple of goes, and see what suits you.

After reading this thread and many other sources on the internet raving about the virtues of longer lines I bought a pair of 26's. Set 'em up same as you, MikeyS, and wow. Wish I did it years ago.

drjukka

QLD

258 posts

drjukka

QLD, 258 posts

3 Aug 2006 10:31pm

Folks,

I must be at the other end of the spectrum.

I have sailed with 20" for years and have only just started experimenting with 22" lines. With the wider style boards the longer lines may make some more sense, allowing your weight to sit further away from the boom.

Still have not made my mind up if 20" or 22" are better, can't see myself ever going to 26 though.

I also find with cambered sails you can narrow the width of the lines as the sail's centre of effort is not moving around as much - but finding the 'sweet spot' is harder.

- J

racycoot

315 posts

racycoot

WA, 315 posts

4 Aug 2006 10:28am

You must like your boom low

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