KA CONCEPT

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4XL
4XL
VIC
222 posts
4XL 4XL
VIC, 222 posts
14 Feb 2007 3:15pm
PERSONAL opinions on what they are like? Are they mast specific, top end control etc etc. Interested in the larger sizes specifically! Are there any worthwhile reviews anywhere?

cheers
mr love
mr love
VIC
2424 posts
VIC, 2424 posts
14 Feb 2007 4:48pm
Visit www.kasail.com and register for the forum . There are many threads discussing the Koncept .
In my opinion the sails perform great , and the GPS-Speedsurfing results would reflect, that with them constantly up in the top ten .
They are ,like most sails now ,mast specific to a degree . They will work on any true constant curve masts eg ,I know they are fine on KA , Powerex and Severne masts and many guy,s are also running on Fiberspar .There is discussion about this on the Website Forum .
I hope I have helped .
reiffo
reiffo
SA
147 posts
SA, 147 posts
14 Feb 2007 7:17pm
4xl,

I ride the 2007 Koncepts and have sizes 5.8, 6.6, 7.5 and 9.0 . They are a very fast stable sail with plenty of low down grunt. The boom lengths are very short which makes the larger sails feel alot smaller then they really are. The short boom length also allows me to ride a smaller fin/board combo without bogging the tail down. IMHO the build quality is on par with GTX/V8 but the performance and handling is superior. I run my sails on a number of different masts Fiberspa, north and Powerex and they seem to work no matter what you stick up them. They are also very easy to rig and tune (which is good for me because I am lazy).
The bottom line for me was that I was able to buy 4 sails for the same price that I would normally pay for 2 and I didn't have to go out and spend another couple of thousand on compatible masts.
Plus they are an Australian company with the R&D carried out locally.
If you go to the KA website as Martin suggested you will be able to also look up some local guys like Peter Dans or Chris Lockwood and maybe catch up with them for a closer look.

Cheers,
Chris
red
red
VIC
741 posts
red red
VIC, 741 posts
14 Feb 2007 9:49pm
4XL .. I had a 2005 Gaastra GTX and it was a great sail good speed, solid build and easy handling.. I then got a 2006 Koncept 5.8.. Every time i changed down to that sail I fell in love .. super slippery feel, scarily fast and feels almost like a wave sail in the hands.. It got to the point that I would be looking for excuses to change down a sail size..

now the 5.8 has a big brother 6.6 and a little brother 5.0.

I rig my KA with gaastra and North mast no worries
4XL
4XL
VIC
222 posts
4XL 4XL
VIC, 222 posts
15 Feb 2007 11:54am
i was chatting to someone yesterday and he mentioned that the 2005/2006 build quailty was poor. What are the thoughts of those who have and currently own the latest and previous models? His words were that 'they virtually fell apart after one season'.

cheers
fitz66
fitz66
QLD
575 posts
QLD, 575 posts
15 Feb 2007 10:57am
There are a few guys in this area using the Koncepts and they all love them, and they are quick. I have just bought a 6.4 Kult and it is a great sail. No cams but plenty of power to get planing and it has a huge wind range, I rig it on a powerex 430 mast and its real easy to tune. Chris Lockwood has just beaten the production board speed record using a Carbon art board and KA sails
mathew
mathew
QLD
2172 posts
QLD, 2172 posts
15 Feb 2007 11:36am
To answer the last question first, just about everyone who uses the Koncepts, absolutely loves them. They are very stable in gusty wind, slippery (ie: very fast), work very well for lighter weight guys because they twist off really well and the 2007 models have really good low-end power. Also, gybing is quite easy for a multi-cam sail (ie: fells quite like a RAF sail, but way more powerful).

You can use most generic brands of masts (eg: powerex), the more carbon the better they work, but they do work fine down to 50% carbon.

The biggest point to remember is that they are speed sails - which means monofilm and not too much reinforcement -> they are not wave sails. Ie: if your body hits the sail at 40 knots... well you can guess the outcome. That said, just get some big stickers to patch the torn area, then go out sailing again -> they are very easy to patch up.

As to the build quality - the only area that really needs some attention is the luff pocket. The cams and sand tend to come together to cause small tears, so you may need to either sand a few mm off the edge of the cam and/or put some extra stick-backed sail tape on the inside of the pocket at the point of cam contact (which is what I did to my 2006 models). Ie: if you compare an RS5 or RS6 there is extra cloth around the cam on the luff pocket.

For what its worth, I regularly use my set on Port Philip Bay and am quite happy to launch into 10+ ft jumps. But I wouldn't use them in surf (sand problem again...).
mkseven
mkseven
QLD
2315 posts
QLD, 2315 posts
15 Feb 2007 11:53am
How do the 9m Koncepts handle, are they stable enough- they are down on battens and cams to all other race sails.
kato
kato
VIC
3530 posts
VIC, 3530 posts
15 Feb 2007 7:30pm
I,m currently using the 06 mod 5.8 and 5.0,and apart from putting my knee through the 5.0 I,ve had no problems.These sails get a lot of use and are never washed.I make sure that there is no sand on them when there rolled up.If you wash them in fresh water make sure that there dry before you roll them up.UV kills sails quicker than anything else.I rig the 5.8 on a north drops( gives a bit more twist in the head and the 5.0 on a pryde X6.These sails work well and are a great price.
reiffo
reiffo
SA
147 posts
SA, 147 posts
15 Feb 2007 11:11pm
mkseven,

I have the 9.0m 2007 koncept which I use 10 - 18 knots and have found it to be the best big sail I have ever owned. I have had gtx's rs4's and nitros in 9.8m and 8.5m and find the 9.0m has as much power as the 9.8m but feels smaller than the 8.5m. I generally sail it overpowered without any outhaul and have never had it get out of shape and the cams actually rotate I managed to get a 33knot peak out of it last weekend with a 30knot 10 second average which is pretty quick for a $850 sail.

4xl,
I am very rough on gear but have not had any problems with them. When I got them I layed one along side a GTX and found very little difference between the build quality. They dont have as much writing or branding which gives them a more simplistic/plain look to them. I cant comment on last years because I was sailing gaastra.

Cheers,
Chris
mkseven
mkseven
QLD
2315 posts
QLD, 2315 posts
16 Feb 2007 7:48am
Thanks reiffo 33knot peak out of a 9m is still bloody good. Sounds like i'll be making a good choice if I get KA.
Bubber
Bubber
WA
2 posts
WA, 2 posts
16 Feb 2007 6:51pm
Hey Reiffo,

Your comment "simplistic/plain look to them" means to me lack of build quality.

Yes they peform exeptionally well and are very fast.

Through the embassador program prices are good but you pay for what you get and sorry the quality is not upto the GTX and the latest V8.

I have with family members owned KA and they do not last. My worry would be in 12 months time they would look terrible and be unable to move them. The market for race sails in SA is limited. So I would keep them until they fell to bits. Buy some other sails and overall the cost would be greater than the $900+ Gaastras which I can move because they last and have reputation for that. Which is what I do regular.

Also I gather from a 5.8 Koncept tester leech flutter is a concern when well over powered as well. Something that hasnt been a problem in sails since the late 90s.

No dealer network for many years since Windsurfing Glenelg last held them in late 90s in one of KAs earlier forms. You cant take them back easily when problems arise!!!!!!!!

Buy Koncept and get magnificint speeds but long term be wary. KA quality burnt me once and I am not going there again.

Regards,

Bubber

reiffo
reiffo
SA
147 posts
SA, 147 posts
16 Feb 2007 11:10pm
Hi Mark Macdonald aka Bubber,
I am not sure why you didn't use your normal login?
I am a little bit confused about your motivation for your post but you have every right to your opinion. Given that you have addressed this to me I felt obligated to respond.

Build quality refers to stitching, battens monofilm thickness etc. I can lay the Koncept along side your gtx next time we sail and I can point out to you what build quality is.
My experience whilest working in a sailboard shop in Perth in the early 90's was that pretty much all the brands used to fall apart so I would be reluctant to single out any particular one.
Hmmm, hasn't your brother just experienced some bad luck with one of the brands you mentioned in the past couple of weeks. My understanding is that he is out of pocket to the tune of about $2000 due to poor build quality and cant get a warranty.

I think you lost as much on your last trade in as you would have paid for for a Koncept, I cant remember you actually ever selling either of your sails.

The "tester" was your nephew, who I had lent my 5.8m to to try out and you can read his review on GPS-speedsufing if you like.
I have not experienced any abnormal leach flutter and I used to find my both my Nitro5 and GTX had more. You probably havent found this as you would normally have to either be sailing overpowered or be going quicker then 18knots Ouch..... Sorry

My post was not intended to put down any other brand as I believe that most brands make quality sails, so I would like to applogies to any other GTX/V8 sailors if my comparison has also offended them. My intention was purely to put forward an opinion of someone who has sailed the current model KA Koncept.
If you would like to join this exclusive club then next time we sail together, this weekend hopefully, feel free to take mine for a spin. You really should take me up on this offer and take my kit for a sail as you will notice a difference.

Cheers,
Chris (I cant be bothered making up another login name to hide my true identity)
choco
choco
SA
4186 posts
SA, 4186 posts
16 Feb 2007 11:43pm
What does it cost the sail makers to get a sail made $250?
Personally i think all imported brands a way over priced and as soon as you walk out of the shop you instantly loose $400 off your $1,000+ race/slalom sail.
With regards to KA sails they are pretty close to being in the ball park with regards to price for a new race/slalom sail $800 +/- range.
I don't own a KA sail but you are already $300-$500 better off buying one ,plus the KA sails can be rigged and perform with a variety of masts unlike some others which you have to buy the recommended mast that cost as much as the sail.
If i can get 2 seasons out of a race/slalom sail and it delivers in terms of performance then i don't mind using it as a tarp when it falls apart.

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