Time to Harness?

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Murph
Murph
WA
14 posts
WA, 14 posts
21 Sep 2006 11:32am
Hi all,

I'm chasing a bit of advice. I'm a novice who can't water-start, jibe etc yet but am starting to straight line sail OK. I'm at the point where I think I need to start using a harness as my arms are now wearing out before I fall off!

I've got a harness and loops on my boom and what I'm chasing is some advice on how to go about learning to use my harness. ie hooking on, sailing position, boom height etc. Also what role should my arms be playing once I'm in the harness?

Any help appreciated.

Cheers,
Murph
nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
21 Sep 2006 11:38am
Hi Murph,

Firstly, the boom should be around shoulder height when sailing normally.

Getting the harness line position right requires a bit of trial and error, but when you've got it sussed you should have an even pull on both hands, and should be able to let go the boom with both hands and sail along. If you find you're pulling too much on the front hand, move the harness lines forward, if back hand has too much pull then move the lines backward.

The two lines should be around a handswidth apart on the boom, this is a nice compromise.

Hooking in can be a bit tricky at first, basically you do a big pelvic thrust so the hook grabs the lines. Lean back, and take some weight off your arms. Sometimes if the lines are too low then you do a sort of sideways grab so the hook grabs the side of the harness loop, then sit back and the hook slides down to the bottom of the loop.

Good luck, give it a go, you won't look back

Edit: Forgot to add, learning the harness will involve many catapults. This is where the sail sheets in and pulls you violently over the front of the board, still hooked in. It can be painful, and can damage the nose of your board. If you can get your hands on a boom bra then this helps to limit the damage to the nose in a catapult.
To avoid catapults, keep your back foot well back on the board, without sinking the tail. Also be prepared to unhook from the lines while you're underwater and underneath the sail. The first time this happens there's a tendency to panic, but just think it through slowly and you'll be fine.
JayBee
JayBee
NSW
714 posts
NSW, 714 posts
21 Sep 2006 1:44pm
Take a look at

www.guycribb.com/page0076v01.htm
under tuning there are two articles - "Truth about harness lines" and the G-Spot. They will give you a pretty good place to start for harness line setup.

Try using longer harness lines initially (even just get some rope and knot it to the boom if your existing lines are short).
Hook in, put some weight on the lines and you are off.
As you improve you will tend to shorten the harness lines to take more load off your arms. They are too long if you are planing and still taking significant boom load on your arms.
You will notice that planing becomes a lot more enjoyable (and that the board behaves differently) once you learn use the harness to support some of your weight.
Most of all, just spend lots of time practicing inteh harness.

Have Fun,

JB
Murph
Murph
WA
14 posts
WA, 14 posts
21 Sep 2006 12:04pm
Thanks guys, I appreciate the advice and will take it all on board.

I've got a mast deviator at my mast base to stop nose damage - should I use a boom bra as well, and what is it?

I've got some short lines on the boom at present but have just scored some longer lines off an old boom which I'll put on instead of the existing ones.

If it's not blowing to hard I'm out this arvo so if anyone sees some fool flying over the front of his board it's probably me!
mineral1
mineral1
WA
4564 posts
WA, 4564 posts
21 Sep 2006 1:36pm
Murf, it fits around the clew on your boom to stop it belting the crap out of your board nose when you get launched.
Look on surf and sail web site and put it in the search box and you should see photo of one.
Another item is mast protector, fits to mast either at base or just below boom so the mast doesn’t belt the crap out of your rail on board when the same thing happens.
Mineral
PS be caurful this afternoon, its a bit on the blowey side for learning harness
nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
21 Sep 2006 1:53pm
quote:
Murf, it fits around the clew on your boom...


Errr.. that should read "Fits around the mast clamp" I think
Crash Landing
Crash Landing
NSW
1173 posts
NSW, 1173 posts
21 Sep 2006 5:10pm
Nebs you used to be able to get a boom bra for the clew end as well. But I guess this was a mistake?!?

Interestingly reading the latest guy cribb article it turns out you don't need a boom bra at all because the boom end is too high the board anyway. I will be checking this next time I'm out, and if he's right I'll take it off.

I still find the mast below the boom to be the worst part.

Anyway.

Carry on
Harrow
Harrow
NSW
4521 posts
NSW, 4521 posts
21 Sep 2006 8:01pm
Murph,

I've been using a harness for 20 years, but only learnt to waterstart last season.

This season I'm gonna learn to gybe.

Loops and vulcans, 2008.

Regards,
Harrow.
Haircut
Haircut
QLD
6491 posts
QLD, 6491 posts
21 Sep 2006 9:31pm
like kivin bloody wilson once sung - can we cut through the bullsh!t and get down to the goodies straight off

gybes are soooo 1980's, there are now so many cooler ways to turn around. learn to tack and vulcan, then if your bored, learn to gybe
jsn_batman
jsn_batman
WA
86 posts
WA, 86 posts
21 Sep 2006 7:41pm
and if your feeling good, sailing flat out jump round the front of the mast to the other side of the boardcarve hard upwind while flipping the rig(360 just for fun[}:)]) when youve past through the eye of the wind, sail away,

uta can be done, youve probably seen me do a couple in safety bay, but they get a little tricky above 25 knots,
mineral1
mineral1
WA
4564 posts
WA, 4564 posts
21 Sep 2006 8:51pm
nebbian,
Errr.. that should read "Fits around the mast clamp" I think

Errrr... yep as per usual your right what the f... was I thinking.
(Probably dreaming about this afternoon gently 15-18k's and yep it was fun as well) Pity that big Tilly lamp went down behind the sand dunes, otherwise I probably would have still been out there


Murph, hope you got the idea
nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
22 Sep 2006 2:39am
Hey Harrow,

Don't let Haircut fool you, a willy skipper spock 180 with rail grab might look good in principle but in the end it's just another way of making froth.

Am I the only person who gets a woody whenever I see a perfectly executed carve gybe?
DavMen
DavMen
NSW
1510 posts
NSW, 1510 posts
22 Sep 2006 8:20am
quote:
Originally posted by Harrow

Murph,

I've been using a harness for 20 years, but only learnt to waterstart last season.

This season I'm gonna learn to gybe.

Loops and vulcans, 2008.




Hey Harrow
You been copying me Sounds like my windsurfing history.
DavMen
thecat
thecat
VIC
35 posts
VIC, 35 posts
22 Sep 2006 1:32pm
Hey Murph

I was at your point about 2 months ago, wanted the stronger winds but just couldn't bloody hold on when I got up, felt like my forearms were about to explode !

Think the lines I bought are about 22 ish inches and they seem fine, certainly wouldn't want longer.

It IS inevitable your going to get thrown, the first thing I did was to just spend a whole weekend constantly hooking in/out until it felt nautural and I could do it quickly, this will help prevent the throws when you get that split second advance warning (IF that is).

The one thing you don't mention is if your using footstraps ? I hadn't really bothered that much before harness, I hooked my rear foot in but couldn't say I really did anything once it was there. Now I'm getting used to the stronger winds and plaining I find them essential for controlling the board whilst hooked in. I've got them set at intermediate for the front so they're about 2/3 out from middle. I tried moving all the way to outside but at the moment it just puts too much pressure on edge of board.

Keep us posted on progress, your getting to the fun part !!
Combs
Combs
WA
152 posts
WA, 152 posts
22 Sep 2006 12:53pm
When I was learning to use the harness lines back a couple of years ago, I was terrified of the hook, the feeling of being trapped and the feeling of being tied to the sail. So to get over all this, I went out in really light wind (certainly not planing weather) and just went up and down getting into and out of the lines.

At first I only stayed hooked in for a matter of seconds and then gradually increased the time.

Now I feel really uncomfortable if I am not hooked in.

Basically the lines and your harness do all the work. Your hands should just rest lightly on the boom to tweak it from time to time. At first you won't do this. You will be hanging on just as normal and you will keep loosing the lines from your hook as a result. Just gradually commit more of the pull of the rig to your harness though.

Once you start to feel comfy with the harness and lines, get into those straps. Then you can really start to lock it all down and feel in control.

Have fun
Murph
Murph
WA
14 posts
WA, 14 posts
22 Sep 2006 1:50pm
Thanks all,

I got out last night at Pelican Point and gave it a go. The wind was a bit light and gusty and I was the only one out but with a 115litre board and a 6m sail the light winds don't worry me to much.

I took advice from yesterday and put on some long lines. It still took me a few goes to actually hook in but I managed. The first time in I must have sheeting in and as a result took a high speed trip over the nose (like everyone said I would). A couple more trips over the nose and I worked out that unhooking was a good option.

It feels completely different to sailing without a harness and I guess it will take a while to getting used to leaning back and using my body weight rather than my arms. I managed a couple of great runs (by my standards) and now I understand the difference a harness makes.

I'm not using the footstraps much yet and tend to sail with my rear foot in the middle of the front and rear straps. I've been in the straps a few times but I don't think I've had enough speed up and tended to sink the tail.

I'm interested in finding out more about gibes vs tacks etc. I can turn at all yet so will have to learn one day!

Again, thanks for all the advice - it certainly takes a lot of the guess work out!

Cheers,
Murph
Crash Landing
Crash Landing
NSW
1173 posts
NSW, 1173 posts
22 Sep 2006 4:06pm
quote:
Originally posted by Combs

I went out in really light wind (certainly not planing weather) and just went up and down getting into and out of the lines.


My mate did exactly the same and it worked a treat. Just get used to it. I also did the "peter hart" thing with him and had some rope and two loops. We just leant against each others weight so he knew what to do with his legs and how it would feel. Looked stupid but worked well.

He uses 28 inch lines as I do - much better and easier to hook into!

racycoot
racycoot
WA
315 posts
WA, 315 posts
22 Sep 2006 2:24pm
Pelican point spoils ya.

Holds you back from waterstarts and gybes.

Ya gotta resist the urge to jump off, stand up turn around by hand and beach start.

Aim for the deep hole near the boat ramp so that if you stuff up you have to waterstart. Now there's motivation!

(for the eastcoast brigade, PP is waist deep all the way out)
Harrow
Harrow
NSW
4521 posts
NSW, 4521 posts
22 Sep 2006 10:05pm
quote:
Originally posted by racycoot

Pelican point spoils ya.

Holds you back from waterstarts and gybes.

Ya gotta resist the urge to jump off, stand up turn around by hand and beach start.

Aim for the deep hole near the boat ramp so that if you stuff up you have to waterstart. Now there's motivation!

(for the eastcoast brigade, PP is waist deep all the way out)

racycoot is right. the reason i took so long to waterstart and gybe was because I'd take off from Dolls Point, and go right across to Towra Point, get off on the beach and turn around and come back. What ever you do, DON'T do that.
NotWal
NotWal
QLD
7436 posts
QLD, 7436 posts
22 Sep 2006 11:15pm
G'day Murph,

Once you are using the harness you will find it MUCH easier to get into the footstraps. If you are using the harness correctly your feet feel quite light and if you're not in the straps it feels very insecure.
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