Live GPS Tracking for a Regatta - How can we do it?

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Live GPS Tracking for a Regatta - How can we do it?

3 years ago

General Gps & Speed Waves Foiling Gear Reviews Lost & Found WA NSW QLD SA VIC TAS

berowne

NSW

1560 posts

berowne

NSW, 1560 posts

9 Oct 2022 2:37pm

Hi everyone and a special call out to GPS experts!

I want to find out the best way to run a regatta with live telemetary. Similar to some of the events at Lake Garda, SailGP, etc.

Target event would be the national foiling comp "Downunder Pro" or even our regular monthly races across the state.
www.facebook.com/groups/1377152212346239/permalink/5621256771269074/

* SailMon seem to have a great piece of equipment but at 500 pounds they are a lot expensive.
* Mini Motion could be good, except I think WiFi range is limited to a few hundred metres so you would need repeaters along the course??
* Mini Motion with 5G and an eSim could be a solution? Lots of engineering required.
* GPSLogit phone app and a budget phone in water proof pouch + cheap sim could also work

Then the other challenge is software to capture and plot the signals in real time. GPS Action Replay seems capable (circa 2008) but can't export live so other screen capture video software is required. Is there another viable solution worth considering?

Open to ideas!

John340

QLD

3420 posts

John340

QLD, 3420 posts

9 Oct 2022 4:53pm

Check with Camd from Royal Queensland Yatch Club. They held the Racing Board Worlds at RQYC a few years ago. They had a website that had live GPS tracking of each race. I don't know what hardware and software was used but Camd should know.

PhilUK

1113 posts

PhilUK

1113 posts

9 Oct 2022 3:11pm

The BIC Techno events use this tacktracker.com/web/shop#/guide

rp6conrad

380 posts

rp6conrad

380 posts

9 Oct 2022 3:56pm

The Lorawan Network is possible a good solution : cheap modules (<50$) and a long range. Data rate is limited, but only GPS co?rdinates should be managable. There are dev. boards on the market which have even a gps on board. Here a link to a complete project :
www.aeq-web.com/ttgo-esp32-lora-neo-6-gps-board-setup-serial-read/?lang=en
There are also industrial modules available which will work out of the box : www.antratek.be/media/wysiwyg/pdf/RM_Industrial_Tracker_20200319_BQW_02_0002.pdf
These try to connect to the worldwide TTN network. Coverage is not guaranteed if you are in the middle of nowhere, but a private gateway could solve this.

berowne

NSW

1560 posts

berowne

NSW, 1560 posts

10 Oct 2022 8:32am

Hey Conrad "The Thing Network" looks ideal!
www.thethingsnetwork.org/country/australia/
I need to RTFM but I wonder if the existing WiFi chips in the Mini Motion would work for this?

Long Range WAN LoRaWAN seems to offer multiple KM coverage, but very low bit rates. www.thethingsnetwork.org/docs/lorawan/

rp6conrad said..
The Lorawan Network is possible a good solution : cheap modules (<50$) and a long range. Data rate is limited, but only GPS co?rdinates should be managable. There are dev. boards on the market which have even a gps on board. Here a link to a complete project :
www.aeq-web.com/ttgo-esp32-lora-neo-6-gps-board-setup-serial-read/?lang=en
There are also industrial modules available which will work out of the box : www.antratek.be/media/wysiwyg/pdf/RM_Industrial_Tracker_20200319_BQW_02_0002.pdf
These try to connect to the worldwide TTN network. Coverage is not guaranteed if you are in the middle of nowhere, but a private gateway could solve this.

An Alternative might be a MESH Network were there will almost always be a node closer to you so real seperation could be only a few 100 metres! Add a [few?] repeaters on the water, such as at least one powerful router with 12v from the boat batteries to get the signal back to shore, or via 5G straight up to the web.
www.thingsquare.com/blog/articles/why-iot-mesh/
Although it seems sub-GHZ networking is recommended for range which I imagine would need an extra chip.

Anyway this could prove interesting!

Flex2

373 posts

Flex2

WA, 373 posts

10 Oct 2022 7:25am

GPS Action Replay has a regatta mode (both live and debrief)... Certainly works well for the debrief by just loading up everyones GPS tracks...haven't tried to work out the live stuff...might have to ask Yann (click contact on the website) for more details. Its a great tool for looking at sailing data. You get to try it for 60 days free after which I think it is 30 euros.gpsactionreplay.free.fr/index.php?menu=0

John340

QLD

3420 posts

John340

QLD, 3420 posts

10 Oct 2022 10:04am

Flex2 said..
GPS Action Replay has a regatta mode (both live and debrief)... Certainly works well for the debrief by just loading up everyones GPS tracks...haven't tried to work out the live stuff...might have to ask Yann (click contact on the website) for more details. Its a great tool for looking at sailing data. You get to try it for 60 days free after which I think it is 30 euros.gpsactionreplay.free.fr/index.php?menu=0

KA72 has a similar function

berowne

NSW

1560 posts

berowne

NSW, 1560 posts

10 Oct 2022 11:41am

John340 said..

KA72 has a similar function

I never knew. II'll try that out! Any guides??

PhilUK

1113 posts

PhilUK

1113 posts

25 Oct 2022 4:45pm

I dont know whether you watched the Brest IQFoiling, but they used this
enter.sailracer.org/eventsites/live-screen-tracking-club.asp?eventid=224750&labels=S&templ=club_tracking

For early races where there were 58 in the course races, the system couldnt keep up with the amount of data to process. When watching the livestream, the tracker was a long way behind, 500m or so. I didnt look at it for the medal series races.

I bet they tested the system with a few GPS units, but either didnt volume test it, or did volume test and thought there was nothing they could do about it. Guess it comes down to the CPU power of the kit you use and WIFI upload speeds.

John340

QLD

3420 posts

John340

QLD, 3420 posts

26 Oct 2022 11:15am

berowne said..

John340 said..

KA72 has a similar function

I never knew. II'll try that out! Any guides??

www.ka72.com/Competitions/FreeRace/Guides

seanhogan

QLD

3424 posts

seanhogan

QLD, 3424 posts

26 Oct 2022 11:57am

top software from Dylan, but doesn't do live tracking, "just" replays once you have downloaded all the the files.

jksmurf

218 posts

jksmurf

218 posts

26 Oct 2022 4:04pm

Timely query for me! I

just had 2-level spinal fusion 20 Oct so I'm windsurfing / foiling vicariously from my recovery bed tracking my wife using findmyiphone (my wife has two have it with her). It's slow and doesn't give previous Tracks or speed. Plus update frequency is dreadful, every 3-7 minutes sometimes. Apps are available which will increase frequency but they have too many bells and whistles and suck the battery dead very quickly. I'm thinking 5-10s upload rates.

So I started having a look at small independent GPS (Asset) Trackers, the kind used for vehicles boats and motorbikes. Modern ones are 4G GPS/ BDS / LBS / Wi-Fi positioning (whatever all that means), where applicable. OLD ONES WERE ONLY 2G. Not too exxy, some with 6000mAh some 10000mAh batteries, so I'm investigating some of these at the moment, as batteries should handle 3-4 hours of 50-10sec updates? Might mount it in a waterproof box. You can use your own SIM Cards, no subscription rubbish.
I'd be super interested to hear if anyone else had tried one/gone that route. TKSTAR TK-905B 4G and JIMO JM-LL702 are two models cheap where I live. No affiliation at all btw.

cheers

k.

mmilhazes

100 posts

mmilhazes

100 posts

3 Nov 2022 7:34pm

berowne said..
Hi everyone and a special call out to GPS experts!

I want to find out the best way to run a regatta with live telemetary. Similar to some of the events at Lake Garda, SailGP, etc.

Target event would be the national foiling comp "Downunder Pro" or even our regular monthly races across the state.
www.facebook.com/groups/1377152212346239/permalink/5621256771269074/

Hi

Check out this one: Proregatta
proregatta.com/

I did a regatta that they used this software.
Hi just had to install the app on my phone

rp6conrad

380 posts

rp6conrad

380 posts

16 Nov 2022 6:46pm

In Luderitz, there is a online tracking system. You can see the "live" results : www.gps-speed.com/LSC2022/AutoUpdateGPS.php
On the video's, you can see that the competitors are wearing a "prototype" with probably a ublox M10 gps (logging @ 20 Hz). As the distances are rather small, I assume that the wireless connection is based on Wifi (ESP32, esp-now). In the finishing area, the signals could easily be transferred. My guess that this is a development of Manfred Fuchs, as the page is on his site (www.gps-speed.com). Some pictures :

berowne

NSW

1560 posts

berowne

NSW, 1560 posts

19 Nov 2022 9:17am

Good find!

sailquik

VIC

6171 posts

sailquik

VIC, 6171 posts

19 Nov 2022 2:08pm

Julien from 'Motion-GPS' has a solution for live speed events and regattas. (His design was what partially inspired the Mini Motion development). His system has a wifi device on each competitor and a base station that receives the data for on shore live updates and tracking. I'm not sure how far he developed it as there didn't seem to be much demand for it when he floated it a few years ago, but it could well be worth asking him about it.

cheekyrafiki

12 posts

cheekyrafiki

12 posts

29 Nov 2022 7:53am

Dunkerbeck has the 1st, 2nd and 5th best runs, he's still so precise.

berowne

NSW

1560 posts

berowne

NSW, 1560 posts

26 Aug 2023 12:10pm

Any updates on live regatta tracking?
I've seen cheap android phones for $86 3G and $112 4G with some kind of likely terrible gps chipset.

elmo

8894 posts

elmo

WA, 8894 posts

26 Aug 2023 12:00pm

Apple air tags or something similar

rp6conrad

380 posts

rp6conrad

380 posts

13 Nov 2023 6:51pm

Life GPS tracking is now available at the Worldcup in Japan : hawkcast.n-sportstracking-lab.com/public_events/185?redirect_flg=1&
More info here : n-sportstracking-lab.com/live-tracking (use google translate...).

Freezer

111 posts

Freezer

111 posts

14 Nov 2023 7:02pm

Thanks Jan. I found some details on the device used:
HAWKCAST

? Basic specifications of GNSS device (GP01)
??Manufacturer: KYOCERA (Made in Japan)
??Model number: LU1CM013 (customized)
??Size: Approx. 83 x 49 x 13.8 mm (Weight: Approx. 63 g)
??Battery capacity: 1,500 mAh
??Usable satellite: GPS /GLONASS /Michibiki
??Location information update interval: 1 second
??Data transmission interval: 5 seconds
??Communication: LTE-M SORACOM PLAN-D (docomo line)
??Built-in acceleration sensor Operating time: Continuous operation for approximately 10 hours

LU1CM013 is IoT device for LTE Cat.M1. Able to uploading location information, temperature, humidity and acceleration data to the cloud. Suited for tracking people/vehicles and state monitoring. They have a cloud application that visualizes the data.

I'm also looking for a subscription free tracker for the car. There are many options out there. Some more explanation at:
www.weenect.com/ie/en/academy/gps-tracker-car-no-monthly-fee/

Monitoring speed and heading for viewers is something else as logging the complete track including the session max. values and getting live feedback from others during your session to push each other on your local spot.

There might be LoRa options for the ESP32 as well as LTE options. But one would also need to build the web-site for logging/storing. Not sure if there are open platforms to do this. We continue dreaming ;)

JonesySail

QLD

1125 posts

JonesySail

QLD, 1125 posts

14 Nov 2023 10:03pm

www.yacht-bot.com/products/yachtbot
looks like these guys have it nailed ...

CarlosSainz

43 posts

CarlosSainz

43 posts

15 Nov 2023 2:01am

It seems they have stopped development :

"The pricing plans have been discontinued, all existing subscription continue to stay active without payment as of Friday 2023-07-07."

Freezer

111 posts

Freezer

111 posts

15 Nov 2023 2:28am

But they have some great information how to build or use it for DIY at:
support.yacht-bot.com/support/home
support.yacht-bot.com/support/solutions/articles/8000015246-first-steps
support.yacht-bot.com/support/solutions/articles/8000009993-api-communication-fundamentals

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Live GPS Tracking for a Regatta - How can we do it?

berowne

John340

PhilUK

rp6conrad

berowne

Flex2

John340

berowne

PhilUK

John340

seanhogan

jksmurf

mmilhazes

rp6conrad

berowne

sailquik

cheekyrafiki

berowne

elmo

rp6conrad

Freezer

JonesySail

CarlosSainz

Freezer

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