eppo said..

north_kiter said..
Out of interest who in this thread is a team rider, employee, importer, retailer or gets a discount on all their armie gear

Well I'm not but your continual antogonism is damn annoying imo. Let's talk and share info on the mast. Cut the crap dude or leave.

ha ha na not leaving fun winding you guys up , I just don't believe any non olympic certified mast is worth 2k, be it armie, axis etc, these companies are exploiting the sport and participants, for that they should be shamed not endorsed.

Armie keeps raising the price point for all gear in Australia, and you guys praise him, come on...he's a businessman interested only in money, hence why he prices all his gear so high

I personally don't care if you guys buy his gear

north_kiter said..
fun winding you guys up

Just to recap your constant posts on a subject that you're not really interested in of a product you wouldn't ever buy:

New Armie mast is not worth the price.
You used to have Armie gear but have moved on.
Armstrong needs a 85cm mast but you like your mast that is about the same as the 80?
America Cup design and development couldn't possibly contribute anything to watersports
You don't like Armie.
You really don't like Armie.

I have to admit I'm not sure the new mast is worth it to me, but seeing how the price is easily available I can can decide for myself. Look forward to more reviews from the guys that are actually trying the mast out.

People on this forum are so considerate and polite. I'm trying to follow your example.

WHS said..

I have to admit I'm not sure the new mast is worth it to me, but seeing how the price is easily available I can can decide for myself.

Look forward to more reviews from the guys that are actually trying the mast out.

People on this forum are so considerate and polite. I'm trying to follow your example.

Important points here.

1. most of us here are grown ups and can make our own decisions
2. the most valuable reviews are from people actually riding the gear we are talking about or who are genuinely interested in advancing the discussion (It's great to have people ask questions when they are displaying good intent)
3. civility is the way forward

As I posted a few back, Though I do feel pretty clear about some of the key differences from my old mast, I didn't want to rush back and post a detailed review until I had another session or two. That said, I don't disagree with anything that others are experiencing. The degree of improvement over my V1 85cm was astonishing. Seemed to also bring out a new level of performance from my HA725. I'll add, while the longer length definitely takes getting used to, I think most folks will figure it out and adjust quickly.

Separately, I was talking to one of the more talented local riders I know on Oahu about masts, he recently switched from a more flexible mast/foil (don't remember which brand) to an entirely different brand F-0ne and said effectively "everything was better" but he wasn't sure how much the stiffer mast had to do with it. From what I'm reading from some of you and my experience from yesterday, I think there's reason to believe that a stiff mast can make a significant difference. He's also riding a 95cm mast and ripping waves like he's on a short board.

I've had a great run with many amazing days on the 85cm mast, but now there's an option that helped me to resolve some of what I wished was better and also helped me to learn what I didn't realize I didn't know, lol.

We've got some solid 15-25mph + winds shaping up this week that should coincide with a day or two of head to double overhead swell. Based on how much the glide was improved with the 935/725 combo, I can't wait to try the HA525. If that actually ends up with a similar improvement, there are fun days ahead. I post a deeper review after some of that water time.

SeattleKook said..
Eppo you wrote: "Never once felt I needed the extra on the old 85cm mast. This is because it gives you more breaching leeway I think." Can you help us understand this a little better? I ride 925 in heavy chop but small waves so I need to keep the foil close the surface/ride high on the mast to milk the energy of the waves. What I thought limits my height and causes me to ride lower than I want is to keep the foil tips from breaching when turning, but maybe I'm wrong and I need to ride lower to keep the mast the mast from ventilating during turns?
I'm really on the fence between buying the 795 vs 935. 935 would sure make going upwind easier in the heavy chop and be more forgiving but worried I'll sacrifice turning and milking the small waves?
Thanks for the review/information!

For the only reason I would go shorter than 935 is if you foil in a shallower area or you only want 1 mast for prone, DW and wing. Otherwise the 935 gives you more options. 925 and V tail is a lose as I can handle. If it gets bigger, choppier 195 tail. If you ride lower in the mast stiffness things up, if you go high is lose and quick but without any flex. You push your turns, great for jumping and gives you a lot more room on the surf.

MidAtlanticFoil said..
New Mast: 14mm at thickest point
V1 Mast: 15mm at thickest point.

hmmm very nice, should be fast, same thickness as gofoil

north_kiter said..

Oahuwaterwalker said..

WHS said..

I have to admit I'm not sure the new mast is worth it to me, but seeing how the price is easily available I can can decide for myself.

Look forward to more reviews from the guys that are actually trying the mast out.

People on this forum are so considerate and polite. I'm trying to follow your example.

Important points here.

1. most of us here are grown ups and can make our own decisions
2. the most valuable reviews are from people actually riding the gear we are talking about or who are genuinely interested in advancing the discussion (It's great to have people ask questions when they are displaying good intent)
3. civility is the way forward

As I posted a few back, Though I do feel pretty clear about some of the key differences from my old mast, I didn't want to rush back and post a detailed review until I had another session or two. That said, I don't disagree with anything that others are experiencing. The degree of improvement over my V1 85cm was astonishing. Seemed to also bring out a new level of performance from my HA725. I'll add, while the longer length definitely takes getting used to, I think most folks will figure it out and adjust quickly.

Separately, I was talking to one of the more talented local riders I know on Oahu about masts, he recently switched from a more flexible mast/foil (don't remember which brand) to an entirely different brand F-0ne and said effectively "everything was better" but he wasn't sure how much the stiffer mast had to do with it. From what I'm reading from some of you and my experience from yesterday, I think there's reason to believe that a stiff mast can make a significant difference. He's also riding a 95cm mast and ripping waves like he's on a short board.

I've had a great run with many amazing days on the 85cm mast, but now there's an option that helped me to resolve some of what I wished was better and also helped me to learn what I didn't realize I didn't know, lol.

We've got some solid 15-25mph + winds shaping up this week that should coincide with a day or two of head to double overhead swell. Based on how much the glide was improved with the 935/725 combo, I can't wait to try the HA525. If that actually ends up with a similar improvement, there are fun days ahead. I post a deeper review after some of that water time.

I think I have been only stating facts observing the industry and brands from the side line. armies's a salesman for the brand, not the business brains that would be making the business decisions that would be the ozone partners other businessmen in the background.

I don't like the fact that the armstrong brand is raising the prices (which is making the sport unaffordable to young kids or people not so well off) and also that is forcing riders to make a decision of shorter or longer mast when they were all happy with the 85cm length.

The brand should've given its loyal customer base an option of a stronger mast in the length they like and have ridden, and I would easily bet they would've chosen a performance 850mm. Obviously they're not happy with the performance of the mast or it's length (as it's a noodle) that's why they are upgrading. Again the reason armie business didn't do this is because it would cannibalise sales of the current 85cm+v2.

At least axis offers it riders all lengths.

I'd dare say gofoil, axis 90cm + mast sales are very low, same probably for other brands, but the industry doesn't publish this data.

But most on this thread belong to the "armie fan club or a sponsored riders, retailers etc" will say oh the 85cm is the wrong size we got it wrong two/three years in a row and 935mm is the perfect option now.

Does this sound like a good brand that deserves your loyalty, I would say no.

Last time I checked the go foil RS page is currently at 23 pages long. Stoked gonfoil riders sharing their info on tails, new wings etc. I enjoy reading it actually, exciting to see crew enjoying their gear. Takuma and lift also have multiple page threads. And yet you feel the need to keep complaining about your personal compulsion for an 85 mast.

there is not one annoying troll on their banging on about pointless negative and seeemingly neurotic points of view. Even some technical issues with loose front foils with some great technical solutions are shared.

Either demo / ride one and offer some insight or go elsewhere man. You offer nothing, you just take. But every now and then you do provide some sensible and resomable. insights. The rest is garbage. Easy to tear down something than to build it up. And if you are that concerned then write Armstrong emails and ask why. Nothing we can do about production sizes here. this crap should have been left on the kite forum pages.


and why are you concerned that's armie should have offered loyal customers an 85 - you aren't even one of them. I am - and I am just fine with the sizes.


man there is even an Armstrong to Go foil thread on the SUp foil page that is 7 pages long. Even that was civil - useful info - and didn't have this childish trolling input. May not be your intention but that's how it is coming across. Please stop it dude. Be useful.

Oahuwaterwalker said..

eppo said..

north_kiter said..

Oahuwaterwalker said..

WHS said..

I have to admit I'm not sure the new mast is worth it to me, but seeing how the price is easily available I can can decide for myself.

Look forward to more reviews from the guys that are actually trying the mast out.

People on this forum are so considerate and polite. I'm trying to follow your example.

Important points here.

1. most of us here are grown ups and can make our own decisions
2. the most valuable reviews are from people actually riding the gear we are talking about or who are genuinely interested in advancing the discussion (It's great to have people ask questions when they are displaying good intent)
3. civility is the way forward

As I posted a few back, Though I do feel pretty clear about some of the key differences from my old mast, I didn't want to rush back and post a detailed review until I had another session or two. That said, I don't disagree with anything that others are experiencing. The degree of improvement over my V1 85cm was astonishing. Seemed to also bring out a new level of performance from my HA725. I'll add, while the longer length definitely takes getting used to, I think most folks will figure it out and adjust quickly.

Separately, I was talking to one of the more talented local riders I know on Oahu about masts, he recently switched from a more flexible mast/foil (don't remember which brand) to an entirely different brand F-0ne and said effectively "everything was better" but he wasn't sure how much the stiffer mast had to do with it. From what I'm reading from some of you and my experience from yesterday, I think there's reason to believe that a stiff mast can make a significant difference. He's also riding a 95cm mast and ripping waves like he's on a short board.

I've had a great run with many amazing days on the 85cm mast, but now there's an option that helped me to resolve some of what I wished was better and also helped me to learn what I didn't realize I didn't know, lol.

We've got some solid 15-25mph + winds shaping up this week that should coincide with a day or two of head to double overhead swell. Based on how much the glide was improved with the 935/725 combo, I can't wait to try the HA525. If that actually ends up with a similar improvement, there are fun days ahead. I post a deeper review after some of that water time.

I think I have been only stating facts observing the industry and brands from the side line. armies's a salesman for the brand, not the business brains that would be making the business decisions that would be the ozone partners other businessmen in the background.

I don't like the fact that the armstrong brand is raising the prices (which is making the sport unaffordable to young kids or people not so well off) and also that is forcing riders to make a decision of shorter or longer mast when they were all happy with the 85cm length.

The brand should've given its loyal customer base an option of a stronger mast in the length they like and have ridden, and I would easily bet they would've chosen a performance 850mm. Obviously they're not happy with the performance of the mast or it's length (as it's a noodle) that's why they are upgrading. Again the reason armie business didn't do this is because it would cannibalise sales of the current 85cm+v2.

At least axis offers it riders all lengths.

I'd dare say gofoil, axis 90cm + mast sales are very low, same probably for other brands, but the industry doesn't publish this data.

But most on this thread belong to the "armie fan club or a sponsored riders, retailers etc" will say oh the 85cm is the wrong size we got it wrong two/three years in a row and 935mm is the perfect option now.

Does this sound like a good brand that deserves your loyalty, I would say no.

Last time I checked the go foil RS page is currently at 23 pages long. Stoked gonfoil riders sharing their info on tails, new wings etc. I enjoy reading it actually, exciting to see crew enjoying their gear. Takuma and lift also have multiple page threads. And yet you feel the need to keep complaining about your personal compulsion for an 85 mast.

there is not one annoying troll on their banging on about pointless negative and seeemingly neurotic points of view. Even some technical issues with loose front foils with some great technical solutions are shared.

Either demo / ride one and offer some insight or go elsewhere man. You offer nothing, you just take. But every now and then you do provide some sensible and resomable. insights. The rest is garbage. Easy to tear down something than to build it up. And if you are that concerned then write Armstrong emails and ask why. Nothing we can do about production sizes here. this crap should have been left on the kite forum pages.


and why are you concerned that's armie should have offered loyal customers an 85 - you aren't even one of them. I am - and I am just fine with the sizes.


man there is even an Armstrong to Go foil thread on the SUp foil page that is 7 pages long. Even that was civil - useful info - and didn't have this childish trolling input. May not be your intention but that's how it is coming across. Please stop it dude. Be useful.

North kilter is officially suspended, bravo moderators!

I think North Kiter said "It was time for him to bow out " several posts ago ...now someone else has done it for him !

MidAtlanticFoil said..
New Mast: 14mm at thickest point
V1 Mast: 15mm at thickest point.

How's it compare across the lengrh? Specifically on the lower third?

Haven't seen one in person yet. Doubt I'll be able to justify the cost; but as an engineer I can appreciate that it could be that much better. I've got an old 70 and a newer 85 a+ Tuttle. The a+ rides better not sure if it's because it's stiffer or ??

If the new MA foils weren't coming I may be more likely to ante up. But who knows what Santa will bring!


also separately has anyone tried shimming a regular mast for a negative rake to match the new performance style? I've previously shimmed the opposite direction with positive results on an older board; but never thought to try to shim the front. (-I'll probably do that for the next few sessions).

Moderators, thank you for suspending north_kiter.
All, especially MAF, Oahu, and Eppo, thank you for keeping the discussion relevant, informative, and courteous.

Back to the discussion. I've been loving the 935 for winging in 10-32kt conditions (so far) for all reasons mentioned previously. I had the opportunity this past weekend to try a friend's 795 for proning. I used to struggle linking more than four or so waves on the 34L FG with the 925-the 725 was beyond me. The 795 just makes everything so much easier. I also noticed that popping up my 82kgs was a lot more stable. I wish I could use the 935 for proning but my local spots are, for the most part, far too shallow. The big big big problem with these masts is wanting more than one size.

eppo said..

hilly said..
GoFoil have just announced a new mast as well. Cedrus and NoLimitz are getting everyone to up their game which is great. Unfortunately, they all up their prices as well. A new Armie mast with the new wing looks the business. Might have to try yours Eppo when you get it all together

Damn - go foils mast is already good. Jeepas!!

It's a good mast. Just an absolute hassle to travel with. Can't have it all!

paulweller2 said..
Moderators, thank you for suspending north_kiter.
All, especially MAF, Oahu, and Eppo, thank you for keeping the discussion relevant, informative, and courteous.

Back to the discussion. I've been loving the 935 for winging in 10-32kt conditions (so far) for all reasons mentioned previously. I had the opportunity this past weekend to try a friend's 795 for proning. I used to struggle linking more than four or so waves on the 34L FG with the 925-the 725 was beyond me. The 795 just makes everything so much easier. I also noticed that popping up my 82kgs was a lot more stable. I wish I could use the 935 for proning but my local spots are, for the most part, far too shallow. The big big big problem with these masts is wanting more than one size.

I'm interested in the prone side of foiling mostly and I weight 80 kg so I'm keen to hear about the different experiences with the new masts. I'm pretty happy with the 85 A+ and 925/725 wings as I can pump comfortably and turn them really well with 50 fuse.I'm not really longing for anything extra ,but sounds like the extra stiffness and new profile increase control and efficiency. My only doubt without having ridden one ,would be the extra chord length of the new mast especially down lower as theoretically it would make the mast track better but also not be as loose as the narrow chord A+. I would not like to lose any rail to rail turning that I enjoy on the A+ atm.
Any feedback on this ?

robbo1111 said.. take it as carry on luggage

WTF you get a 90cm mast on as carry on

I just pack mine in with the board fits easy. Adds protection.

robbo1111 said..

eppo said..

King Crash said..

eppo said..

hilly said..
GoFoil have just announced a new mast as well. Cedrus and NoLimitz are getting everyone to up their game which is great. Unfortunately, they all up their prices as well. A new Armie mast with the new wing looks the business. Might have to try yours Eppo when you get it all together

Damn - go foils mast is already good. Jeepas!!

It's a good mast. Just an absolute hassle to travel with. Can't have it all!

Why? It's a mast ?

Mast and fuse one piece so it doesn't pack down like the Armstrong or others so you can't take it as carry on luggage

Ah right. Not a biggy
for performance.

MidAtlanticFoil said..

He just had his first prone session with the 1125 in small waves and the new mast and said he was blown away by the added efficiency. Reckons he can go for 4-5 waves now compared to 2-3 before. Said he can pump pump glide glide glide, where as before there wasn't that rest glide with the 72 or 85.

I had the same experience on my HA725 on my first session. I was able to generate glide similar to the 925 on the V1 85cm, maybe even a little more.

This is what midweek on is looking like for Hawaii. We're also supposed to get some decent surf. Looks like I'll have the opportunity to try the 935 with the 525 in some solid conditions. While I can certainly appreciate how the stiffer mast would work better with larger foils, my ride on the 725 suggests to me that the benefit will go across the board.

Oahuwaterwalker said..

MidAtlanticFoil said..

He just had his first prone session with the 1125 in small waves and the new mast and said he was blown away by the added efficiency. Reckons he can go for 4-5 waves now compared to 2-3 before. Said he can pump pump glide glide glide, where as before there wasn't that rest glide with the 72 or 85.

I had the same experience on my HA725 on my first session. I was able to generate glide similar to the 925 on the V1 85cm, maybe even a little more.

This is what midweek on is looking like for Hawaii. We're also supposed to get some decent surf. Looks like I'll have the opportunity to try the 935 with the 525 in some solid conditions. While I can certainly appreciate how the stiffer mast would work better with larger foils, my ride on the 725 suggests to me that the benefit will go across the board.

That's sounds like there is no noticeable downside to the extra chord length , I like to ride fast and turn fairly aggressively especially on the 725 using a cut down 195 tail, I have shelved the V200 atm because of the uncontrolled flex under high loaded turns so will be interesting to hear if the new mast helps with that also, thank guys looking forward to some more prone reports with upcoming swell !