There is a variation in the stiffness properties, some will prefer aluminium over carbon and vice versa depending on your riding style, the lighter usually the better, however a heavier foil may help in stabilising a low volume or sinker board, a one piece mast is technically stronger and you have less dissassembly if the box plate and fuse are one piece

I have recently bought the 85cm Axis carbon to compliment (upgrade) my 60 and 80cm aluminium masts. I've been using the 1300 png with them.
I'm definitely not saying I'm the best rider out there - far from it. However, after 2 sessions and 3 hours on water I can't tell any significant difference from the 80cm ali and 85cm carbon masts. Maybe the carbon assists with pumping up on foil a little better? A little more feedback from the front foil? But in my opinion, the differences aren't big. If you're really trying to get good value for money, the ali gear is hard to beat.

Curious - Is the Carbon mast noticeably lighter when compared to your 80cm mast, baseplate and dodadd?

martyj4 said..
I have recently bought the 85cm Axis carbon to compliment (upgrade) my 60 and 80cm aluminium masts. I've been using the 1300 png with them.
I'm definitely not saying I'm the best rider out there - far from it. However, after 2 sessions and 3 hours on water I can't tell any significant difference from the 80cm ali and 85cm carbon masts. Maybe the carbon assists with pumping up on foil a little better? A little more feedback from the front foil? But in my opinion, the differences aren't big. If you're really trying to get good value for money, the ali gear is hard to beat.

rgmacca said..


That sounds like very poor quality control. like windsurfing back in the day with crap fins. I always thought axis were top quality and expect all parts to fit like a glove.

It has nothing to do with quality control. It's a function of aluminum extrusions for the mast, and a socket for the base. Aluminum extrusion dies wear as they extrude, changing the mast thickness throughout the life of the die. So you design the female part to fit a mast at the, die end of life. This being when the masts run at the maximum thickness. The first masts coming out of a new die will start out thinner, making the socket fit more loose. Shimming is the solution.

This applies to any manufacturer with aluminum masts. It's why some bond the bases, to hide this manufacturing tolerance that must be, for this design.

Make the base a permanent tight fit to each mast you own, or buy carbon.

rgmacca said..

DWF said..

rgmacca said..


That sounds like very poor quality control. like windsurfing back in the day with crap fins. I always thought axis were top quality and expect all parts to fit like a glove.

It has nothing to do with quality control. It's a function of aluminum extrusions for the mast, and a socket for the base. Aluminum extrusion dies wear as they extrude, changing the mast thickness throughout the life of the die. So you design the female part to fit a mast at the, die end of life. This being when the masts run at the maximum thickness. The first masts coming out of a new die will start out thinner, making the socket fit more loose. Shimming is the solution.

This applies to any manufacturer with aluminum masts. It's why some bond the bases, to hide this manufacturing tolerance that must be, for this design.

Make the base a permanent tight fit to each mast you own, or buy carbon.

I wouldn't be very chuffed if I had to start looking for coke cans to shim my brand new ?1500 foil set up. Just putting it out there.

Wait until you find out what happens to the carbon mast/fuse connection! Spoiler, since there is no taper to it, it wears out and you have a floppy connection requiring epoxy and/or glass to get it back to right.
Axis had a few design issues IMO and this is one of them, the second being the fuse/front wing connection being fat and only supporting the wing downwards (I snapped a front wing).

Get axis because their wings are good and they come out with products fast, but a company like fone has better connections with the front wing/fuse being one piece and the mast/fuse connection not wearing out.

DWF said..
That is funny. All carbon mast heads wear over time, even the tapered ones. What's awesome, is it's a 5 minute fix anyone any can do. Put epoxy on your finger, rub it on the head. Boom, tight again.

A far easier fix than all the hex/square socket brands. They won't need to release + version with twice as many screws to stop the wings and fuselages from wobbling as the resin matrix wears like others.

Plus no fragile helicoils.

What do you think of just epoxying it all together if you don't need to take it apart for travel. mine stays in one piece, out van-board-van. I do slacken of bolts and tefgel it. Would save the need for any maintenance! And save wear on components/threads.

MarTrench I didn't think there was much difference in weight. The carbon is 2.02kg for 85cm. The 80cm aluminium is 2.32 with doodad and baseplate. So a bit over 10% lighter in carbon.

martyj4 said..
MarTrench I didn't think there was much difference in weight. The carbon is 2.02kg for 85cm. The 80cm aluminium is 2.32 with doodad and baseplate. So a bit over 10% lighter in carbon.

16mm or 19mm mast?

Does the connection with the carbon mast prevent the mast to Fuse connection from comming loose? I'm getting frustrated with the current setup where I have a great first 45min and than the bolts loosen between the fuse and the mast.

DC

Dcharlton said..
Does the connection with the carbon mast prevent the mast to Fuse connection from comming loose? I'm getting frustrated with the current setup where I have a great first 45min and than the bolts loosen between the fuse and the mast.

DC

Foils running through water create vibrations that can loosen screws. They do not loosen when using Tef-Gel.

It some cases a loose screw comes from not having the fuselage seated all the way onto the mast. Once riding, the rider weight seats the fuse fully, then screw is no longer tight. This happens a lot with some carbon masts with tapered ends. It happened to me all the time with Lift foils, until the mast head finally wore out enough to make seating it fully on the beach doable.

Dcharlton said..
Thanks! Still trying to figure out if the Carbon Mast is worth it. Would be good to know if it helped in preventing the screws from loosening but that seems more an issue with using Tef-Gel and ensure it's seating it correctly.

Seems like it's not much a saving on weight. It sure looks cool but not sure that's worth the xtra $$$.

I'm 95Kg and ride the 1050HPS and 890BSC both on black fuse.

DC

The weight difference between the axis carbon vs ali mast is significantly noticeable- especially as you get into the longer masts. That said- the difference is mostly noticed on the beach/carrying your rig to the water. Getting through shore break with a lighter rig is definitely nice- easier to handle. Performance differences on the water differ according to foil span- are related to flex- are increasingly noticeable the larger span wing you use. I much prefer the carbon/it's performance with smaller foils- in the surf/prone. Using an 1150 foil winging I'm on, prefer a 90 Ali mast. The critical point to me where the flex starts to become noticeable/a negative is somewhere around 1000 wingspan. But- different strokes eh? I think a lot has to do with the minute adjustments foilers make- muscle memory... the timing/response you are used to in turns.

Recs? To me- if you're in a consistently high wind area, are mostly riding smaller foils- don't need a 1050, 1150, the carbon is the way to go. Starting out on a budget-100% I'd tell a friend to go Ali as at that point, most are probably learning on larger wings anyhow and can upgrade to carbon down the road. For best of both worlds at a price.... light and stiff and spendy- there is a Cedrus or No Limits carbon mast with adaptors.

Being the drag whore that I have become, I am extremely bothered going back to the 19 alu mast. I feel like I have figured out how to deal with the flexiness of the 999/1099 on the carbon thru muscle memory and technique. I can rip very hard, confident, powered turns on them now.