American gun laws

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gibberjoe
gibberjoe
SA
956 posts
SA, 956 posts
18 Dec 2012 10:54am
Well I for one do think that there has been a rise in gun crime in Aust recently.
adelaide , melbourne , sydney, brisbane are having more drive bys etc. It seems to be drug instigated and mainly druggies cop it .
However shooting has always been on the go in aussie. Remember the german whou used people in the kimberly for target practice, I think a dozen was the score.
I have had guns untill the dwaf interviened, because of where, and for whom i worked. we were supplied with govt issue side arms or rifles.
With guns it is easy to produce good arms from any well equipped workshop, and SA cops found one of these bikey backed workshops the other week.
So what do you do .....ban workshops????????
bigmark100
bigmark100
NSW
584 posts
NSW, 584 posts
18 Dec 2012 11:31am
Imagine what will happen in the USA if a major event causes mass civil unrest.
All those guns no the streets. All those gun fanatics.

GreenPat
GreenPat
QLD
4107 posts
QLD, 4107 posts
18 Dec 2012 11:20am
r2908 said...
Canada has the same gun laws as the states ?? explain that !!


Easy to explain. It doesn't. It has tougher laws. Just. I skimmed three of the top Google results I got from "canadian gun laws" search, and two of them state directly that Canada has tougher gun laws than the US. The other doesn't make a comparison, but shows a concern by the author that the laws are being eroded by the gun lobby here. People I work with here who have guns (hunting is hugely popular - I was surprised), have also mentioned how the gun laws are quite strict compared to the US.

So, what evidence do you have to support your statement?

Semantics aside, after the cinema shooting I tended to lean towards the dismissal of gun control in favour of mental health. Now I'm going to agree with Panda, in principle, and say that access to guns should be reduced.

Gun culture is thoroughly entrenched, there are millions of guns out there, but this just doesn't sound like a good enough excuse to ignore it anymore. An Australian style buyback would be quite infeasible there, but something to start reducing gun numbers. More stringent licensing, along Australian lines, reduction of the types of weapons which are legal to sell and own, with exemptions on existing owners to avoid the panic which would ensue if their 'freedom' was looking like being taken away. I don't know exactly what, but I thoroughly agree now that it is easier to do something about guns than crazies.
r2908
r2908
NSW
214 posts
NSW, 214 posts
18 Dec 2012 12:52pm
Sorry I have no evidence to support my statement... The laws are very close on gun owner ship ... I am Canadian too Ay ... Oh Canada oh Canada... Bla bla
evlPanda
evlPanda
NSW
9207 posts
NSW, 9207 posts
18 Dec 2012 1:46pm
Mark _australia said...
Semi-auto's were handed in. Interestingly only the licensed ones...... there is still about 10,000 semiauto "assault rifles" in australia that were never handed in.

Touted as success by the Govt and taken hook, line and sinker by the public who are completely ignorant about firearms.



Less guns = success to me.
Mikedobee
Mikedobee
NSW
331 posts
NSW, 331 posts
18 Dec 2012 2:30pm
Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.


It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."
tmurray
tmurray
WA
485 posts
WA, 485 posts
18 Dec 2012 11:42am
Mikedobee said...
Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.


It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."



I think it's for this reason that suicides are never given media time - it encourages copycat events. It's a very valid point.
tmurray
tmurray
WA
485 posts
WA, 485 posts
18 Dec 2012 11:44am
Every time there's an event like this gun sales go up. I assume also that membership of the NRA goes up as well.

So given that the NRA and the gun industry receive a direct financial and politic benefit from each massacre why do we think they have any interest in limiting future disasters?
Mikedobee
Mikedobee
NSW
331 posts
NSW, 331 posts
18 Dec 2012 2:49pm
tmurray said...
Every time there's an event like this gun sales go up. I assume also that membership of the NRA goes up as well.

So given that the NRA and the gun industry receive a direct financial and politic benefit from each massacre why do we think they have any interest in limiting future disasters?


That's right bro. They don't have any interest on that. That's why many more things like this will happen in the future, because it's always the profit that matters, not some innocent lives.

Are they ever going to stop the war in Iraq, Afganistan, etc? No...
Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
18 Dec 2012 2:59pm
Mikedobee said...
Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :



Not sure what credentials he has to comment publicly?...he's an actor (a very good one imo) and famous for portraying characters. I don't argue with his opinion though as he makes a valid point.

I think the best comment I've heard was made by a USA congress rep this morning on the radio - something like;

(non-verbatim) It's (gun law reform) a complex problem & will require a complex solution - no single solution will address the problem.
Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
18 Dec 2012 3:02pm
GreenPat said...

I wonder if every pro-gun person in the US had a loved one killed by a licensed firearm how many of them would still support guns.


My guess - there'd be more guns (to defend their loved ones). That simply put, is the 'pro-gun' toting mentality.
Mikedobee
Mikedobee
NSW
331 posts
NSW, 331 posts
18 Dec 2012 3:24pm
Sailhack said...
Mikedobee said...
Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :



Not sure what credentials he has to comment publicly?...he's an actor (a very good one imo) and famous for portraying characters. I don't argue with his opinion though as he makes a valid point.

I think the best comment I've heard was made by a USA congress rep this morning on the radio - something like;

(non-verbatim) It's (gun law reform) a complex problem & will require a complex solution - no single solution will address the problem.


The credential of a person with a very good point. Can you imagine the amount of money media made with these horrific attacks?!!!
Gorgo
Gorgo
VIC
5124 posts
VIC, 5124 posts
18 Dec 2012 4:25pm
The Morgan Freeman thing is a hoax. It comes from a joke where "... everything sounds important when it is said in Morgan Freeman's voice ..." That's why (or because) he plays god in so many movies. lmgtfy.com/?q=morgan+freeman+guns

If you take the gun advocates seriously you would end up with teachers dressed in bullet proof armour carrying assault weapons. Australian kids wear sun hats and legionnaire caps. American kids would have kevlar vests and carbon fibre helmets.

This exactly what is proposed by people ( lmgtfy.com/?q=wish+to+god+m-4 ), unlike the "slippery slope" argument (if you ban guns then you have to ban everything else) which is absurd.
beerdead
beerdead
NSW
433 posts
NSW, 433 posts
18 Dec 2012 8:40pm
bigmark100 said...
Imagine what will happen in the USA if a major event causes mass civil unrest.
All those guns no the streets. All those gun fanatics.





This occurred after the Californian earthquake some years back. The Korean shop owners were being targeted by looters, who were shooting back. Certainly ammunition (sorry) for gun ownership, but what caused the mentality to loot in the first place? Was it the need to survive, or personal greed?

I am inclined to view capitalism as a driving force for might being right, and we are simply seeing the results of several hundred years of grooming. It would be interesting to match up the demographics of incidents of mass murder and powerful capitalist nations. The US certainly seems to take first place in both.
And no. I am not politically motivated to any particular form of government, although I believe that it is the mandate of government to care for the population as their first objective.
kk
kk
WA
953 posts
kk kk
WA, 953 posts
18 Dec 2012 5:55pm


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