Gypsiedrifter said..... Ok why was she sick?

As I am not a doctor or other health professional I can only give you my unprofessional opinion as a patient for the last 44 years, with a lung disease and the last 6 years as a transplant recipient.

as mentioned above it was probably an immune response to the vaccine, the body is busy making antibodys hence you may feel like crap for awhile, this happened to my sons and as they got older they handled their vaccines better.

flu like symptoms seem to be used to describe many ailments, although many are the same, the only way to really know is to get to the doc as soon as the symptoms appear and have a sample of the nose/throat taken and tested, this will show if it is the influenza virus or something else.(this is what i need to do because of my reduced immune system - which helps prevent organ rejection)

as she was only sick for 3 days it probably wasn't a flu virus, if it was the real flu she would have been sick for more than 3 days.

if there are any real doctors or medical scientists out there please enlighten us with your wisdom

vaccinations are important for the people who really need them

Unfortunately emotion is a far stronger beast than logic and reasoned thought in the human brain and therefore we will go with our emotions and pick and choose the facts to suit the decision our emotions have already made. [As any good salesman will know].

Our opinion of vaccines is no different.

If you doubt this...anyone care to explain love? haha....oh god, that could be a whole other thread...let's not!

So Gestalt, how come when I get Lovey, i get very strong heat moments,

my body seems like its on fire, and limbs become hard and uncontrollable,

I start telling lies. Does that mean Love is not good for me Healthy Body or

mind should i stop loving myself

recieved this mail this morning

anyone wishing to research vaccines should take evidence from both sides, the ones trying to sell it to you, and therefore have something to gain.
and the ones who are trying to alert you to the very real dangers....

and no not every health professional is taking it, and you can not be forced to be vaccinated.

***** below is a copy and paste post ******

Could Baxter's A/H1N1 influenza vaccine ("Celvapan")
endanger your health?


Dear Health Professional,


Please read this letter carefully, regardless of whether or not you support vaccination.


In 2009, the NZ Ministry of Health decided to purchase 300,000 doses of an A/H1N1 influenza vaccine manufactured by Baxter International for targeted distribution to health professionals, police, firefighters and other emergency personnel in the event that the A/H1N1 influenza pandemic warranted its use.


www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/7846/distribution-talks-underway-for-swine-flu-vaccine
www.moh.govt.nz/moh.nsf/indexmh/influenza-a-h1n1-questions#vaccine (as of 28/10/10)


As you probably know, fears that the new A/H1N1 strain would turn out to be devastating have proved to be largely groundless with NZ's influenza death rate being comparable to that of seasonal influenza.


www.eurosurveillance.org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=19319


Baxter International's recent safety record in the production of biological products is very poor. You may recall the problems with the company's Heparin in 2008 in which at least four people died due to the product's being contaminated, while hundreds more became ill as a result of its use.


www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/99662.php



An investigation into this debacle found that Baxter was sourcing raw materials from an uncertified Chinese factory that had never been inspected by the Chinese drug regulators.


www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/97598.php



In February 2009, Baxter distributed to sixteen labs in four different countries a bulk seasonal (H3N2) influenza vaccine product that was contaminated with live bird flu (H5N1) viruses. This could potentially have sparked a deadly H5N1 influenza pandemic, but fortunately staff in a Czech laboratory discovered the problem in time.

www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2009/02/27/8560781.html

The Czech Republic subsequently refused to enter into a contract with Baxter for A/H1N1 influenza vaccine as Baxter refused to guarantee the vaccine's safety nor take responsibility for compensating recipients who might suffer side effects from the vaccine's use.



www.ceskenoviny.cz/tema/zpravy/baxter-not-to-provide-anti-swine-flu-vaccine-to-czechs/391210



Despite having been informed of Baxter International's recent history of producing contaminated biological products, the New Zealand Ministry of Health maintained its supply contract with Baxter. This decision is currently the subject of a complaint to the Solicitor General - as is the decision to continue a vaccine supply agreement with CSL despite an FDA inspection of its Australian vaccine production factory which found numerous safety code violations.


www.entrepreneur.com/tradejournals/article/202644880.html



Baxter's A/H1N1 influenza vaccine ("Celvapan") is produced in "Vero cells" which are derived from green monkey kidney tissue.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vero_cell


Cell lines of this type have the potential to be contaminated with viruses such as Simian Virus 40 (SV40) a monkey virus of known oncogenic (tumour producing) potential. (For information about SV40 and cancer in humans please see: www.sv40foundation.org/Alexander.html


The Minister of Health responded to a request made under the Official Information Act (OIA) by stating that the Vero cell line used by Baxter has been tested and found to be free from SV40. However, he refused to release the documents necessary to prove this assertion. (This refusal is currently the subject of a complaint to the Ombudsman.)


Moreover, the Vero cell line used to culture the A/H1N1 influenza viruses for Baxter's "Celvapan" vaccine, is a neoplastic cell line. The FDA is currently investigating whether residual DNA from neoplastic cells (like Vero cells) used in vaccine manufacture can cause cancer in vaccine recipients.


www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/ScienceResearch/BiologicsResearchAreas/ucm127304.htm


The NZ Minister of Health is aware of this risk. However, he has no plans to cooperate "at this time" with the US FDA on research on this issue. According to the Minister, the Vero cells line used by Baxter in the production of "Celvapan" is one that minimises the possible cancer risk from the vaccine. However, he refused to release any of the documents to prove this assertion.


Moreover, he stated that the NZ Ministry of Health would not conduct independent testing of Baxter's A/H1N1 influenza vaccine prior to its use in New Zealand. Such testing could provide vaccine recipients with assurance that the vaccine is not contaminated with H5N1, SV40, any other adventitious microorganisms, oncogenic DNA fragments or any other inadvertent contaminants that could pose a health risk. In other words, The Ministry of Health is relying solely on information supplied by Baxter - which has a massive financial interest in its products - attesting to the safety and efficacy of "Celvapan". Given the recent history of the company, I don't find this reassuring, do you?


The datasheet for "Celvapan" is now available on Medsafe's website. www.medsafe.govt.nz/profs/Datasheet/c/Celvapaninj.pdf


It is worth reading to get an idea of the possible side effect profile of Baxter's influenza vaccine. (Please note that it appears that there are as yet no Phase III trials Baxter's A/H1N1 influenza vaccine; thus much of the data on the datasheet comes from trials of Baxter's H5N1 vaccine. Moreover, the Phase III trial of Baxter's H5N1 has yet to be completed.)


clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00711295?term=H5N1+influenza+vaccine+%2B+Baxter&rank=2


Using data from an H5N1 influenza vaccine to justify the use of an H1N1 influenza vaccine was considered acceptable for the registration process, due to the "pandemic". Potential side effects of concern for Celvapan include sudden hearing loss, paresthesia, arthralgia (from H5N1 influenza vaccine trials) while post marketing surveillance of H1N1 influenza vaccine recipients include convulsions, anaphylaxis and influenza-like illness, among others.


It is also important if you are pregnant (or treat pregnant patients) to realise that according to Baxter's datasheet there have been no clinical trials on the use of its A/H1N1 influenza vaccine "Celvapan" during pregnancy (or while breastfeeding). This is of concern because pregnant women vaccinated with A/H1N1 influenza vaccines in North America have reported foetal death and miscarriages.


preventdisease.com/news/09/110709_H1N1_vaccine_miscarriage_reports.shtml


www.theflucase.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2593%3Ais-the-h1n1-swine-flu-vaccine-causing-miscarriages&catid=1%3Alatest-news&Itemid=64&lang=en




Another factor to take into account when considering whether or not to be vaccinated with "Celvapan" is that influenza vaccines have a long history of producing disappointing results in terms of preventing influenza or influenza like illness. A recent article published in the British Journal of Medicine stated that:


"In children under 2 years inactivated vaccines had the same field efficacy as placebo,8 and in healthy people under 65 vaccination did not affect hospital stay, time off work, or death from influenza and its complications.9"

The author also expressed surpise at the lack of safety studies:

"A Cochrane Database Systematic Review found only one old trial with data from 35 participants aged 12-28 months.8 In the general population of elderly people, despite a dataset of several million observations, safety was only reported in five randomised controlled trials (2963 observations in total) on local and systemic adverse events seen within a week of giving parenteral inactivated vaccine."

He recommended that in light of the evidence poor effectiveness of inactivated influenza vaccine, poor methodology of some studies and the surprisingly small amount of information relating to vaccine safety, that a "a re-evaluation [of influenza vaccination programmes] should be urgently undertaken."

www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/333/7574/912




I hope that this letter gives you some starting points for investigating the A/H1N1 influenza vaccine programme for yourself - or at least gives you some information to help you make a more informed decision about its use.


As someone who is grateful for the excellent care I have received in the NZ public health system (most recently following an accident in which I suffered three fractures) I have the utmost respect for the good work done by health professionals. My aim in writing this letter is to bring your attention to an issue that could be of vital importance to your own health.


Yours sincerely,


Katherine Smith

from the U.K newspaper Daily Mail.......49 percent of doctors refuse the swine-flu jab.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1208716/Half-GPs-refuse-swine-flu-vaccine-testing-fears.html

if the majority,still do not have grave concerns over these vaccines well......

as dr carley keeps saying......when you inject known poisons into the human body, you are by-passing the bodies own defence mechanism.

the body is in effect being 'tricked' by this direct injection. [this makes perfect sense]

the immune system then attacks itself.[very difficult to turn off once started]


this is called auto-immune disease.

countless doctors/researchers from around the world have linked vaccines to causing auto-immune disease.

Here is something safer and much more effective than any vaccine!

www.mmshealthy4life.com/


Very interesting man!


www.mmsbuyaustralia.com.au/humble's-story.html

pertermac should carry his own health warning: "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing."

Not my intention to get personal or offend...just the spread of half-truths (whether intended or not) in the cyber age has a dispiriting tendency to become "accepted fact" to the masses.

Vaccines have been one of the true miracles of modern medicine responsible for eliminating many devastating diseases. Unfortunately, their very success is fast-becoming their downfall as people start taking for granted that these diseases no longer exist and forget that the diseases are no longer a threat precisely because a very large percentage of the population accepted a vaccine. Having a vaccine isn't simply about protecting yourself. If enough people have the vaccine (say 90%, I'm not exactly sure on that) then you get "herd immunity" where there are enough vaccinated people that the virus can no longer spread at all and it effectively becomes extinct.

Now, if you want to take a seriously selfish approach then you should put yourself in the 10% that don't get vaccinated. That way you don't risk any side effects of a vaccination and you can get a "free ride" from the 90% of the population who did have the vaccine. However, not everyone can do this otherwise there'd be no 90%!!

Personally, I see my life in a bigger perspective and consider there exist such things as doing something for others, something for human-kind. Therefore, I take the tiny risk from the vaccine for the much greater good it does our fellow human beings.

Each to their own. Free choice.

p.s. The Daily Mail (as quoted in petermacs comment) is one of the worst newspapers for hype, out-of-context, scare-mongering stories in the UK. I know. I had to endure years of my parents reading the trash it reports. [At least with The Sun, etc. they aren't even trying to take themselves seriously].

The best advice one can give re Vaccines is to do as much research as you can looking at the positives and negatives.

If side effects are 2-3 days of feeling crap vs 2-3 weeks of no life then weighing up what is the priority for you and your family is the WTG.

Personally IMO i would rather a week of discomfort for immunity against TB, Hepatitis, Polio etc having seen first hand the pain and suffering these and other preventable diseases have on people.

petermac33 said...


as dr carley keeps saying......when you inject known poisons into the human body, you are by-passing the bodies own defence mechanism.

the body is in effect being 'tricked' by this direct injection. [this makes perfect sense]

Is this gal a medical doctor? I am worried that she doesn't appear to understand how the immune system works and she is confusing viruses with poisons.

Alcohol is a poison, and I am happy to have it in my blood stream as long as it's in the right quantity.

petermac33 said...

dr carley website....some very interesting reading,her many interviews have been posted on y/tube.

www.drcarley.com/

Yes, it is very interesting reading. Why is it that 'these type of sites' don't know how to make a web page look good and they always capitalize a lot of words? Surely if they wanted to get their point across better they could look at some basic presentation skills. Is it the CIA that is giving them bad formatting?

Here is a section I just read from her site:

"
On February 4th, I received the following e-mail from a pharma schill in Australia:

Peter Bowditch <[email protected]>

Dear Dr Carley,

I have been looking at your web site and it has raised a few
questions for me. I note that you had your medical licence revoked a year or so
back because at the time you were obviously barking mad. The content of
your site today suggests that the pills, the counselling and the therapies
are not working, and, if anything, you appear to be getting worse. I
checked my thesaurus for possible conditions and I wonder if you might like
to select your particular mental state or states from the following list:

ape, baked, bananas, barmy, batty, berserk, bizarre, bonkers, brainsick,

confused, cracked, crazed, crazy, cuckoo, daft, delirious, demented,

derailed, deranged, dingy, dippy, disarranged, disconcerted, disordered,

displaced, distracted, distraught, disturbed, dotty, erratic, fatuous,

flaky, flipped, flipped out, frantic, freaked out, frenzied, fried,

fruity, idiotic, impractical, insane, irrational, irresponsible,
kooky, loco, loony, loopy, lunatic, mad, maddened, maniac, maniacal, manic,

mental, mentally ill, moonstruck, nuts, nutty, nutty as fruitcake, of unsound mind, off, off one's rocker, out of one's mind, out of one's tree,

out to lunch, paranoid, perplexed, potty, preposterous, psycho,

psychopathic, psychotic, rabid, raging, raving, round the bend, schizo,

schizophrenic, schizzo, screw loose, screwball, screwy, senseless, silly,

touched, unbalanced, unglued, unhinged, unscrewed, unsettled, unsound,

unzipped, wacky, whacko, wild, wrong

Judging by your attitude towards vaccination I would say that "psychopathic" is a close fit and it is obvious from things you said at your hearings that you are paranoid, but perhaps you might like to expand on these so that visitors to your web site can have the fullest possible information about you in order to assess what they see on the site and its relationship to reality.

Thank you.

Your friend, Peter.

"

At least she is game to show at least one of her detractors.

petermac33 said...

it has unfortunately, become more or less become ''accepted fact'' to the masses that vaccines prevent disease.

this ''accepted fact'' is not based on half-truths but a downright LIE!

The British Medical Journal says, "vaccines used against infectious disease have probably saved more lives than any other public health intervention apart form the provision of clean water." They state that "without vaccination, smallpox would not have been eliminated from the world-or at least smallpox is its wild state."

I go BMJ over some half arsed paranoid conspiracy bloke who believes we are all aliens or lizard aliens.

poor relative......The British Medical Journal says,

do not believe what i or anyone else have to say.[inc the BMJ ]

look at the EVIDENCE from both sides and what makes SENSE to YOU go with.

how aliens got into this debate only you know.

“One basic truth can be used as a foundation for a mountain of lies, and if we dig down deep enough in the mountain of lies, and bring out that truth, to set it on top of the mountain of lies; the entire mountain of lies will crumble under the weight of that one truth. And there is nothing more devastating to a structure of lies than the revelation of the truth upon which the structure of lies was built, because the shock waves of the revelation of the truth reverberate, and continue to reverberate throughout the Earth for generations to follow, awakening even those people who had no desire to be awakened to the truth.” (by Delamar Duvaris as written in the preface of “Behold the Pale Horse” by William Cooper).

I'm heading to South America - so in the last month I've had several vaccines: Swine Flu, Hep A&B (+ booster), Typhoid, Yellow Fever....
No troubles, and I wouldn't be stupid/selfish enough to risk catching these preventable diseases/viruses and spreading them to my innocent family!

Only thing I hate is the needle , cant they just give you a pill?

petermac33 said...

poor relative......The British Medical Journal says,

do not believe what i or anyone else have to say.[inc the BMJ ]

look at the EVIDENCE from both sides and what makes SENSE to YOU go with.

how aliens got into this debate only you know.

“One basic truth can be used as a foundation for a mountain of lies, and if we dig down deep enough in the mountain of lies, and bring out that truth, to set it on top of the mountain of lies; the entire mountain of lies will crumble under the weight of that one truth. And there is nothing more devastating to a structure of lies than the revelation of the truth upon which the structure of lies was built, because the shock waves of the revelation of the truth reverberate, and continue to reverberate throughout the Earth for generations to follow, awakening even those people who had no desire to be awakened to the truth.” (by Delamar Duvaris as written in the preface of “Behold the Pale Horse” by William Cooper).

Go post it on conspiracy.com Peter. I'm sure you'll get a zillion interested parties.

This may be a "general" area but I for one am getting pretty bored and tired with this same tedious cr$p in every thread.