surfingboye said..

i towed a euro's kite in the other the other week.
i had been drifting for 5km before it got to me. no rider attached and out past 3 ft waves.
dragged it in and he came running down the beach 10 mins later.
thanked me etc.

so who would've let it drift past?

i reckon help anyone who needs it.
why be a dick?

^As any normal person would do...

I think the real question that's up in the air is rescuing people that don't urgently need it.
I mean I rescue anybody I see floating about obviously having trouble, but what happens when it gets super busy in summer and rescuing people potentially one after another could take up your entire session???... I'm not obliged to rescue anyones kite and if I do it's done out of courtesy for the rider and others on the water, however I'm not about to rescue 8 kiters (who don't really need assistance) in a row and waste my entire session.
If you're my mate I'm going to pull you in, but if I don't know you, you're fine and just happen to be floating over the other side of safety bay (or similar) I'm not going to drop everything just to pull your gear back to the beach.
Why should I waste my session to increase the length of your session??? Get my drift.

Okay here goes again. (Deep breath)...Not that NoBs cares, but that makes sense to me as well.

,..although it does depend on where you are kiting as well. There are some local spots that I know if such and such happens then they could be in trouble if I don't do something.

I have been know to stalk crew, as they float downwind just to make sure, especially if I see them setting up and starting and can see they haven't a clue.

Gotta look out for each other hey.

Figured you might email him waveslave. Lol....

Anyhow apart from his antics here his suspension may be attributed to his latest post on the windsurfing forum entitled 'How good is windsurfing??'

379 Posts - WA
NoBS

Awesomeness with a sail.. Hot birds and cool dudes.. There is no other sport that comes close.

shoodbegood

Had a good afternoon eh! Cool, that's what it's all about!

3798 Posts - VIC
Sailhack
1
Windsurfing - just when you think it can't possibly get better... it does!




Gotta give it to him he is a right sht Stirrer!! I don't think they realised they had a wolf in Sheeps clothing do you?

He was baiting them though, only a matter of time. I feel sorry for the fellas replying with honest integrity about how much they love their sport, not knowing he was ...well being NoBs.

NoBs crosses the line, but Farq he makes me laugh!!!

He's suspended, so not feeding anything...lol.

eppo said..

Looks like I finally agree with NoBs for once.

Let them float, but keep an eye on them. If after a while, you feel it could get dangerous, then you are duty bound to rescue.

Infact I'd say if this person died, was seriously injured i reckon a good lawyer could have your ass on a plate.

But nothing like a good long swim to wake some people up.

You're not actually duty bound (whether you think you are morally bound is another issue) to do anything - especially if you think going out to help could put you in further trouble. Best thing to do is call the rescue service. The laws of the high seas (rendering assistance) don't apply to us. In those instances a minimum amount of safety equipment is required to be carried by vessels and they can help out, even if it is just standing 100 m off and keeping note of the distressed vessel's position.

In fact, if you decide to render assistance, and then realise it's all too hard and decide to kite off, you put yourself in a worse position - in that instance, because you have decided to help, and established a duty of care. You could only kite back to shore if you were doing so to seek help or if the dude explicity said to you, "I'm OK, I don't need your help"

That said, keeping an eye on each other and helping out when we can is what has made this sport so good. It's all about striking a balance I guess. All of us (most of us) while learning have done something that has required a long swim or a packdown - it's part of the learning process.

And that brings me to my personal axe - being fit for the sport, which means being able to swim 2 - 3 km with no dramas.

This is from the Australian Resuscitation Council website.

http://www.resus.org.au/policy/guidelines/section_10/guideline-10-5-%20july-2012.pdf

DUTY TO RESCUE

"Good Samaritans" and Volunteers

A "Good Samaritan" is defined in legislation as a person acting without expecting financial or
other reward for providing assistance. Although jurisdictional differences exist, "Volunteers"
are generally (circuitously) defined as a member of a Volunteer organization performing
voluntary community work.

Lay persons or Volunteers acting as "Good Samaritans" are under no legal obligation to assist
a fellow being, that is, they have no legal "duty to rescue." However, uniquely, in The
Northern Territory, persons are required by Statute law to render assistance to any other in
need.

Having decided to assist however, a standard of care appropriate to their training (or lack of
training) is expected. Generally speaking, that standard is low. Rescuers need not fear
litigation if they come to the aid of a fellow human in need. No "Good Samaritan" or
"Volunteer" in Australia, or probably elsewhere, has ever been successfully sued for
consequences of rendering assistance to a person in need. Indeed, legal protection is
provided.

All Australian States and Territories have enacted Statutes which provide some measure of
protection for the "Good Samaritan" and/or the "Volunteer." Guideline 10.5 Page 2 of 7
July 2012

They are required to act at least with good faith and without recklessness. In New South
Wales and Queensland the Good Samaritan or Volunteer is required to act with reasonable
care and skill to a standard which is in fact no different from the common law standard which
pre-dated the legislation. Volunteers must however, act within the scope of activity of their
organisation and according to instruction of the organisation. Organisations which control
the Volunteer however, are generally not afforded the same protection for the actions of their
Volunteers.

The standard of care required of a person who has a duty of care to respond, is higher. Like
other persons in our community who hold themselves out to have a skill, they must perform
their tasks to a standard expected of a reasonably competent person with their training and
experience. However, this does not mean a standard of care of the highest level.

Haha, an interesting read for sure.

What I find odd is that we are talking about societies law.

How could any one sleep knowing they could have helped,

instead choosing to read the headlines the day after.





would you introduce yourself to the family the day after,

as they lay a flower in the water.

eppo said..

Okay take someone who has kited for more than 10 years....

could you be considered a lay person still? What about someone with an instructors certificate...a bronze medallion...

Is there a definition of a 'lay person'? of volunteer?

Seriously. Did you read the excerpt I posted above? It clearly defines these things in the first paragraph.

Look I agree with you, just looking at some different angles.

Remember one time I was surfing at thunder bay with my bro and another mate. Was way to big to hold the swell and the current was downright dangerous. I came in, didn't trust it.

As my bro came in his leg rope snapped and he was sucked up and around heading for that inescapable part of the ocean between thunder bay and south point in about 10 foot of swell!

Now this is my brother and we always look after each other, but I had to make the horrible decision of not going in as I would to be in serious danger. So I ran to the top of the point and borrowed a phone and called sea rescue. By now my other mate had paddled across but the seas were so huge they couldn't even see each other three metres away.

They took turns trying to paddle in, just as they were about to make they were sucked out again and they and me thought it was all over, but luckily a massive wave came in and they both jumped on the board and somehow made the drop and were washed onto the shoreline rocks.

Never seen two people more exhausted with fear of death in their eyes, they didn't speak for about an hour.

Anyhow as I said I agree with you.

And as far as your definition proclamation ...well any definition is not fact, it has shades of grey that can be argued with any good lawyer. You cannot claim to know definitely the situation by posting up such a policy and maintain your position is 100 percent accurate, that's naive.

Some ppl are too stupid to live, I told a noob that he should take his kite down in a howling offshorey a few years ago.....he just said "no problem mate" and ended up with a broken rib, and a trip to hospital about 10 minutes after.....did I help him after his initial response? well what do you think?
I just watched and smirked.
Don't listen then Fluck you!

surfingboye said..

i towed a euro's kite in the other the other week.
i had been drifting for 5km before it got to me. no rider attached and out past 3 ft waves.
dragged it in and he came running down the beach 10 mins later.
thanked me etc.

so who would've let it drift past?

i reckon help anyone who needs it.
why be a dick?

I agree. Help everyone you can. Grab boards and drop them off if some one is struggling to find it.
Check on people if a kites been down a while.

I prefer my karma kitty to be overflowing as experience tells me I am about to do something dumb myself

Hop said..

I agree with paying it forward. I was told that I was a dickhead and needed to change things some 9 yeas ago and because I listened to people with more knowledge and dropped my ego I survived and now very directly advise other dickheads how not to hurt themselves or others. I will always interfere to help and I hope that you guys who see your selves as super kiters have the humility to do the same for your sport / lifestyle.

Yup. Give the guy a hand, explain what he could do better and show it to him, and as a result, one more educated kiter is around passing it on. In the mountains / wildlife / sea, you just help without asking questions. If the the person in trouble is a dickhead, you let him know, but you still help. I can't believe this is even being discussed.