It is extremely unfortunate that elite level athletes are being let down by their equipment.
It just shouldn't happen.....it doesn't need to

I have no experience at all with the SUP manufacturer blades, as I've been on Werner the whole time. I'd have to say the same as Greg, too - my 3pc Nitro has been flogged for three years and is still in one piece. Or three pieces, as it were. An now looking at getting hold of one of their bent shaft paddles.

All the years that I've been paddling (6-7yrs almost every day) and I've never broken a Kialoa paddle.. That's partly why I've stuck with Kialoa.. (touch wood).. I've seen the odd one break and heard about others so I know they can and do break.. I replaced a shaft on one of my Methane's once after noticing a suss looking fracture about half way down the shaft about where they tend to break.. (right where your lower had goes).. I have broken a few other paddles (not Kialoa) and is a bad feeling.. Really bad.. Kialoa now use a different type of carbon shaft in their race paddles that seems supa-doopa strong.. I've not heard of one of these breaking.. I've been out on DW'ers with friends that have broken a paddle and it can be very serious.. Having confidence in your equipment is a very important thing.. Especially if you often paddle alone and are a long way out from the shore.. I've always recommended the Naish paddles as a good reliable and strong paddle.. I think their recent problem was with the groove in the adjusting piece so it wasn't the blade or shaft but the skinny extending piece.. I've heard they've fixed that problem now.. I've seen early QB shafts and early Werner handles break.. I've seen a few of the early Starboard paddles break but not seen one of their newier paddles break.. (Yet).. I've seen pics of broken KeNalu's but never seen one break.. I've seen pics of broken Fanatic paddles but not seen one in person.. I guess if you're dealing with light weight carbon fiber there is always a chance of it breaking.. The key is to treat them well.. Don't drop or knock them because it's often where a little nick or chip is that's where they break.

Like DJ, I have never broken a paddle, and I've used Kialoa, KeNalu, and now Starboard. The only instance of a broken paddle that I owned was when I leant a Kialoa to a 12 year old girl at a demo day. An unkind critic might deduce that I have less power than a 12 year old girl, but regardless, Sam from Kialoa kindly replaced the blade on that occasion.

Also, as Husq suggests in another thread, nicks and scratches in the paddle shaft can be revealing. As he implies, when a shaft snaps, it was most likely damaged on a previous occasion creating a weakness.

While we're on the topic of snapping and broken paddles , does anyone have any tried and tested tips for taking your paddle on planes, and are some airlines better then others? Planning on a vicco surf trip late r this year and super keen to take my sup gear this time cheers in advance tortise

PTWoody said..

Like DJ, I have never broken a paddle, and I've used Kialoa, KeNalu, and now Starboard. The only instance of a broken paddle that I owned was when I leant a Kialoa to a 12 year old girl at a demo day. An unkind critic might deduce that I have less power than a 12 year old girl, but regardless, Sam from Kialoa kindly replaced the blade on that occasion.

Also, as Husq suggests in another thread, nicks and scratches in the paddle shaft can be revealing. As he implies, when a shaft snaps, it was most likely damaged on a previous occasion creating a weakness.

Yep, IMO any small scratch or nick in the surface of the shaft can lead to crack propogation. Very small cracks that you would not see. These will only get bigger over time and it will also a break down in the bonding/constuction of the materials due to being exposed to the elements. I use wax on my board not deck grip, so alot ends up on my paddle shaft. I went to get some off with a wax comb and had to stop myself on the first go (stupid idiot)

I have only ever had 2 QB paddles and no others, these have been floorless in perfromance. I like the smooth polished shaft of the older one as far as strength goes.

Tang said..

Al Hunter said..

Good paddles are expensive, unfortunately this is a fact...

I meant to say something about this earlier, and expect I may receive a drubbing.

Good paddles appear to be far more expensive in Australia than the US. I don't work in the industry but do appreciate the concept of margins, but I do not understand why I can buy a paddle in the states and have it shipped here and still save $200+. I am not sure if this applies across all brands, but my werner was quoted to me over the phone from Sydney a couple of years ago (only place which stocked them) at $580 and I managed to order it from the states for $370 including $50 for postage. The shop in the states were still making enough on it at that price. I don't understand why the margin here needed to be so high, and wonder if this applies still, and if it's also across the other brands.

I'd have thought my shipping price would be hugely reduced per unit if ordered in volume, and that the distributors here get the same cost price (or close to it) from the manufacturer? The above example might be considered extreme, but if you reduce the freight to even $20/unit, there's a margin of $240 on top of the margin the US shop was ok with.

Hence why I don't understand why good paddles are so expensive. I'd much prefer to support australian shops, but when I feel I'm being dudded it makes it difficult.

Yours is a 3-piece Werner? There's your answer (or at least part of it). A 3-piece would fit within USPS standard parcel limits (max length 42") so the shipping for you is relatively cheap...and the landed cost to you was under the $1000 limit for GST...and you're (presumably) not trying to make a living by importing and selling paddles...there's a couple more pieces of the puzzle...

Let me tell you a story - a couple of years ago when a new paddle came to market, I tried to order one for myself direct from the company in the US. The length of the one-piece shafts was WAY outside the USPS parcel limit of 42". Once you're out of USPS you are at the mercy of UPS, Fedex, DHL and the like who charge exorbitant rates for small consignments, by calculated cube weight - for each paddle the (international) shipping from any of these services was going to cost roughly as much as the paddle. The landed cost for an individual paddle was going to be in the range of $750-800 which was prohibitively expensive. One day, in the chat after a downwinder, it turned out there were a couple of other Melbourne blokes who had tried to do the same as me. They wanted these paddles too - because of the way the cube weight is priced, the dollar cost for bringing in ten wasn't too much more than for one but it was still a bit exxy and a bit of a hassle to bring in quantity because then (as husq pointed out), you're into customs clearance, duties, GST etc, GST on your customs and shipping costs etc etc. One of those Melbourne blokes (not me*) had an entrepreneurial bent and a personal connection to the business owner, so he negotiated an agency/distribution arrangement and brought in an initial consignment of a dozen or so with some extra bits and pieces, handles & whatnot. And so Ke Nalu Australia was born. In the end everyone got their paddles at a cost that was a lot easier to swallow (and that agency is now in other good hands) but it was a long way around. The paddle importers are entitled to earn a feed and SUP in Australia is a small, remote, low-volume market - I'd reckon they're not all getting rich off it.


(*I'm not in the industry, BTW, never have been)

Good points, HC and Deano, thanks for that. I'm not a small business owner in your sense, though "we" are of sorts and I understand the ledger. I don't begrudge anyone the opportunity to make a living, to be sure, and I also appreciate the low volume issue, and partic the wages point. They're all fair issues. I just lament that we end up paying so much more for things that are a lot more accessible/affordable overseas, but ce la vie I suppose.

Sounds like I better get in touch about a paddle, Deano!

cheers

As with any manufacturing process one would expect a failure rate to be the norm. I will say that one of the benefits of buying a 'name' brand and having it break and dealing with your local shop is that you have someone to go back to and get some back up service. I will say our local shop is not always the cheapest but dam if you have a problem you can guarantee that they will provide back up on the products you buy from them. In each case where we have seen a paddle break it has been replaced (where appropriate) with a minimum of fuss. So for us out here in the wilderness you won't find a lot of us complaining about paying (in some cases) a little more then what we could get online, cause if it breaks or doesn't perform the way its supposed to a real person will work through the problem with you and get a solution in place.

Bamboo shafts?

I've been using YOB paddles the last couple of years and am yet to have one break, or even hear of one yet. There are allot of them on the west coast and I've never really heard of one failing. Having said that, it only takes one bad batch off a commercial production line and you've got potentially got a faulty product spread through out an international market.

Early bike frames made of carbon fibre were notorious for cracks and breaking as the race to lose weight heated up, could it just be we are experiencing those growing pains with carbon paddles?

Razzonater said...
I use wax on my board not deck grip, so alot ends up on my paddle shaft. I went to get some off with a wax comb and had to stop myself on the first go (stupid idiot)

I highly doubt a wax comb is going to compromise the integrity of any carbon/glass/resin. You're going to get a lot worse damage from day to day incidental impact than you ever will with a little plastic wax comb.

One thing you could do (you meaning anyone interested in paddle shaft design) is look into combining materials. Two that spring to mind are kevlar or Innegra. Wrap the CF in Innegra and you get the stiffness properties of CF encased in the impact resistance of Innegra. The major problem with that is the added weight.

Alternatively, you could look at different resins that provide protection. Something like this:

www.kbs-coatings.com/DiamondFinish-Clear.html

not sure why you felt you had to change my user name, but I guess that is just the **** stirrer in you.

Wax is sticky, sand particals stick to it, that along with the hard edge of a wax comb will put LOTS of scratches in the suface finish of the shaft. If you dont think that is a risk of defect starting you may need to do a little more reading.

not sure you are still banned, you wouldnt be able to post if you were....and whats a "proper board"???

oh thats right...

Surface finish and thickness on a surfboard is going to be thicker than a paddle shaft. Plus we are talking more psi on a shaft, material thickness, load, load cycles etc. So yes you may be having lots of scratches on your board that you dont know about and they probably wont effect the use of it. Working life of any material/product comes down to many variables. Lots of stuff on your car could be made lighter but the fatigue life would end up breaking it, not just breaking from one or two uses.

This thread was started regarding the pointy end of racing. In other racing where $$$$ are much higher, equipment is changed out before failure, or at least checked for flaws and defects, to a very high involved level. Stuff that is changed out will even be checked and distrcuted to gain valuable information.

What im talking about regarding scrathes and nicks, are the start of imperfections that lead to a greater failure. Stuff you can not see, stuff that leads to the fibres being damgaed. BTW, raw CF is nothiing without the resin around it. SO the resin/surface is part of the structure also.

Surface finishing of materials is basically a whole engineering dept to itself, like heat treating or simple material choice. How far it is taken is only a mater of $$$ and desire.