upwind paddling

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bigmc
bigmc
NSW
257 posts
NSW, 257 posts
4 Jan 2011 12:31pm
Hi guys and all the best for 2011. Advice would be appreciated. When paddling upwind. Is it better to head directly in to the breeze or tack as in sailing. I paddled across a bay yesterday with about 10 - 12 knots of southerly blowing directly against me. I felt that tacking made it a bit easier. Is there a technique?
Any feedback appreciated.

cheers

at least the paddle back was cruisy
Lobes
Lobes
885 posts
885 posts
4 Jan 2011 9:45am
I tend to go directly into the breeze. I dont really have any evidence this is better but it just feels like less distance to me.
angie pangi
angie pangi
QLD
1782 posts
QLD, 1782 posts
4 Jan 2011 12:38pm
bigmc said...

Hi guys and all the best for 2011. Advice would be appreciated. When paddling upwind. Is it better to head directly in to the breeze or tack as in sailing. I paddled across a bay yesterday with about 10 - 12 knots of southerly blowing directly against me. I felt that tacking made it a bit easier. Is there a technique?
Any feedback appreciated.

cheers

at least the paddle back was cruisy



Hi bigmc,

I find just paddling directly straight into the breeze far easier then tacking. Paddling directly into the breeze allows the nose of your board to stay straight and you can push thru any chop abit easier. Side on is harder as the chop will try to steer your board to.
but all this depends on what size raceboard and what type of race board you are paddling.
Certain race boards will cut thru wind and chop with easy but others not so good.

Boards like the 14ft naish javline is a great upwind board, it cuts into wind and chop so easy but is tippy for some.

stuff like the Naish Glide 14ft is nice and stable but the nose rocker catches the wind but when you turn around it will be super fun.

Heaps of other race board examples but these 2 differant boards give you a good idea.

Hope this helps.

XX angie

Muzz65
Muzz65
NSW
70 posts
NSW, 70 posts
4 Jan 2011 6:49pm
Funny this has come up. I'm new to Sup and was caught by a 20 knot southerly last week out on a lake with 2 km to go.

I have a 10'6" Suplove escape and after battling nose to the wind for what seemed like ages I tried tacking and found I made more progress.

I found keeping the board about 30 degrees to the wind like when sailing I could paddle easier and faster. After each tack I would only paddle on the lee side of the board which I think made things easier too.

It would be interesting to test similar paddlers on the same borads in the same conditions tacking vs nose to the wind.
Radman
Radman
WA
629 posts
WA, 629 posts
4 Jan 2011 3:57pm
small paddle helps try the naish 7' well priced at $270 reduced diametyer shaft still flexes when you lean onit
ka43
ka43
NSW
3105 posts
NSW, 3105 posts
4 Jan 2011 8:38pm
I had the same problem last week trying out a Fanatic Fly 12'6". Couldnt get the bloody thing to go anywhere but across the wind. I asked on here and got some great tips. Tried again and hey presto, it was chalk and cheese.
So moving forward I used the sharp bow as a "nose fin" and it was great. So I perservered and paddled straight into the wind and it was HEAPS better than tacking or edging into the wind.
newby acting on advice from very experienced guys and gals, just my 2 cents worth as a convert.
Simondo
Simondo
VIC
8025 posts
VIC, 8025 posts
4 Jan 2011 9:51pm
Get yourself a few downwind course options !! Problems solved ! And heaps of fun!
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
4 Jan 2011 9:54pm
I got caught in a fierce storm on Lake Moondarra up in in far NW Qld a few days ago, and I just wussed out by kneeling.
Up to 12-15 kts you can still stand and paddle, but after that, my body is just too much sail area, and kneeling gets rid of that. Standing, I go straight, as any yaw is quickly made worse into the wind. I also use big long strokes rather than short quick ones, else I waste too much energy on the paddle return. I did heaps of upwind on Lake Tinaroo in the big southerlies of late winter, without a center fin, so I had to really work on the technique.
I can still paddle just as quick kneeling, if not quicker, cos I can put more welly in. I did about 1km in strong storm winds without too much hassle.
It;s was lovely really, in the big warm raindrops.
Maroubra SUP
Maroubra SUP
NSW
148 posts
NSW, 148 posts
4 Jan 2011 10:20pm
My boards are for surfing... 8'5 & 9'3. I can only tack upwind cos of the yaw. But when I tack upwind & do it right, I can paddle upwind ok. Hard work tho'
bigmc
bigmc
NSW
257 posts
NSW, 257 posts
5 Jan 2011 12:51am
Thanks everybody
Looks like straight in to the wind is favoured
Might try a few more windy days and try different things
Kneeling and prone paddling will also reduce that sail area I suppose
I was on a Starboard Freerace 31" wide
Sharp nose, wide mid but stable

cheers
BillyD
BillyD
30 posts
30 posts
5 Jan 2011 3:08am
Technique I learned from some seriously good French SUPrs. If the wind is strong, yes, do tack. But drop your leeward (offwind) foot back slightly, so that your shoulders are now more parallel to the wind, thus reducing the wind resistance from your body. If the wind is strong, you should also move out towards the windward rail - indeed, in really strong wind your windward foot (i.e. the one nearest the wind) can be right out on the rail, and your leeward foot on the centreline. This is because if the wind is pushing you, you will have a lot of weight on your leeward foot, so if it's on the centreline you won't then sink the rail and fall in.

Once in this position, you should be able to stay on that side and just get stuck in, until you choose to 'tack'. If you find that you're in that frustrating zone whereby your paddling isn't quite exactly matching the turning force of the wind, so that so that for every 10-20 strokes on the offwind side, you're having to put in just a couple on the windward side to regain your correct course, then introduce just a little bit of ‘bow stroke' action into your paddling; i.e. put the paddle into the water a little further away from the board and pull it towards you at the start of the stroke. This is actually a lot easier when you're in this side stance, as you're sort of pulling the paddle more towards your body. You should find this very comfortable, pretty much just as efficient, and most importantly, it means you can stay paddling just on the one side. By adjusting the amount of bow stroke , you can maintain this entirely asymmetric (i,e.; one-sided) paddling across a wide range of wind strengths and directions.

It takes a little bit of practise, but once you've cracked it you can really motor upwind this way.
BillyD
BillyD
30 posts
30 posts
5 Jan 2011 3:08am
Technique I learned from some seriously good French SUPrs. If the wind is strong, yes, do tack. But drop your leeward (offwind) foot back slightly, so that your shoulders are now more parallel to the wind, thus reducing the wind resistance from your body. If the wind is strong, you should also move out towards the windward rail - indeed, in really strong wind your windward foot (i.e. the one nearest the wind) can be right out on the rail, and your leeward foot on the centreline. This is because if the wind is pushing you, you will have a lot of weight on your leeward foot, so if it's on the centreline you won't then sink the rail and fall in.

Once in this position, you should be able to stay on that side and just get stuck in, until you choose to 'tack'. If you find that you're in that frustrating zone whereby your paddling isn't quite exactly matching the turning force of the wind, so that so that for every 10-20 strokes on the offwind side, you're having to put in just a couple on the windward side to regain your correct course, then introduce just a little bit of ‘bow stroke' action into your paddling; i.e. put the paddle into the water a little further away from the board and pull it towards you at the start of the stroke. This is actually a lot easier when you're in this side stance, as you're sort of pulling the paddle more towards your body. You should find this very comfortable, pretty much just as efficient, and most importantly, it means you can stay paddling just on the one side. By adjusting the amount of bow stroke , you can maintain this entirely asymmetric (i,e.; one-sided) paddling across a wide range of wind strengths and directions.

It takes a little bit of practise, but once you've cracked it you can really motor upwind this way.
SandS
SandS
VIC
5904 posts
VIC, 5904 posts
5 Jan 2011 7:17am

Hi all happy NY , for me on a 11'6 tacking is the best , must faster.

cheers .
robcasey
robcasey
3 posts
3 posts
23 Feb 2011 7:43am
Tacking is great for upwind paddles 20kts or more, unless you're training and need the exercise when distance isn't important. Also standing in quasi surfing stance turns your body enough to slice better through the wind.

In either case, feather your blade on the return to the catch. Rotate your wrists forward after removing the blade from the water, this really helps.

r
Simondo
Simondo
VIC
8025 posts
VIC, 8025 posts
23 Feb 2011 2:29pm
For upwind paddling - I think short fast strokes in the power zone (2 feet in front of your toes to your toes) keeps your momentum going. It may not be sustainable for long periods though, and you might need a rest.

Of course, you need to mix up the tempo to suit the chop/swell.
Gorgo
Gorgo
VIC
5125 posts
VIC, 5125 posts
23 Feb 2011 6:45pm
I would want to see some proper comparison for "tacking" vs paddling straight to be convinced. Say two equally matched paddlers on similar boards taking different paths or one paddler with a GPS making several runs in consistent conditions.

All my upwind paddling was spent fighting the tendency of the board to get blown off course.

Sail boats tack and they only do that because they can't sail dead into wind. Power boats don't tack. A SUP is a powered craft.
CMC
CMC
QLD
3954 posts
CMC CMC
QLD, 3954 posts
23 Feb 2011 5:55pm
Simondo said...

For upwind paddling - I think short fast strokes in the power zone (2 feet in front of your toes to your toes) keeps your momentum going. It may not be sustainable for long periods though, and you might need a rest.

Of course, you need to mix up the tempo to suit the chop/swell.


I think your opinion on the 'power zone' being so close to your feet is going to change the more you paddle in that big canoe Simon.
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
23 Feb 2011 7:35pm
the limited experience ive had with paddling into wind i find it usefull to do short strokes using a more rotating body movement and try to keep the paddle blade out of the wind.Move forward on the board too helps.Tacking does seem to work for me , a body does act as a sail. But kneeling works even better , try one knee down one up if your board is stable enough.But paddling into wind is like pushing you now what up hill.
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