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Lightwind test of 2020 slingshot infinity 99 wing

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Created by CoreAS 3 months ago, 5 Oct 2019
motogon
9 posts
7 Jan 2020 7:37AM
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thedoor, I'm regular size guy - 80 kg, 178 cm. I don't use sails over 6.8, and most of the time use 5.7 - 6.1 on 95 liters Freewave.
Would i76 fly in 8-10 knots of wind with say 5.0 - 5.5 sail? I don't mind to pump.

MagicRide
260 posts
7 Jan 2020 7:49AM
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motogon said..
thedoor, I'm regular size guy - 80 kg, 178 cm. I don't use sails over 6.8, and most of the time use 5.7 - 6.1 on 95 liters Freewave.
Would i76 fly in 8-10 knots of wind with say 5.0 - 5.5 sail? I don't mind to pump.







That's i84 and i99 wind ranges, and you will need a larger sail than a 5.7 most likely. The i76 range is from around 12 - 13 knots plus! I asked a lot of your same questions. Not trying to over step though. I did so much research on this before I purchased!

I got a lot of great info from here on one of my posts tittled, "Last Chance on i76 or i84 wing". A lot of specific, detailed info that you will most likely find helpful.

CoreAS
115 posts
7 Jan 2020 12:42PM
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motogon said..
Is there significant difference between i84 and i99? I'm using "old" 68 wing for 3 years now. I'm "occasional" foiler, as prefer fin sailing when there is enough wind. I did demo of i84 in October (it was 10-13 knots day, i84 x 48 combo on Levitator 130 with 4.4 sail): I did like how easy foil get up, but I didn't like how slow it is. I assume i99 even slower?


I99 is a bit slower and takes a bit more back foot pressure. Once it lifts you have to be straight in the straps.The wind range is somewhat limited so for my weight (92kg) I use the i99 in 5-15

the i84 in 10-18+. This is my most used size wing in the quiver.

the i76 and TC 68 are excellent wings but need more wind for me.

CoreAS
115 posts
7 Jan 2020 12:50PM
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thedoor said..
I had a pretty long session on the i99 and Freestyle 115 today with a 5.7. Wind was probably in the 10-15 mph range.

As advertised, relative to the i84 it lifts on the foil easier and it stays up on the foil in lulls much better.

The center of lift is backwards a bit relative to the 84 and significantly further back than the 76 in B position. (this might be a function of using a larger sail or slower speeds or foil geometry). Also it does not point up wind as high especially in the lulls.

I did miss the speed of the smaller wings, but I love the i99s very low stall speed.



Exactly! The way it keeps motoring through the lightest of holes is staggering.
for light winds my go to was 7.8 or 7.0. I feel so confident with the i99 that I can pump up using a 5.8.
I haven't tried the FS 115 yet but maybe because it has a narrower tail you might lose a bit of leverage for upwind work? the 125 wizard has that "slab" of a tail you can really dig your heel against and drive that thing
sounds like the i99 (we nicknamed the whales tail) is working well for you though

SA_AL
82 posts
7 Jan 2020 2:32PM
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CoreAS said..


I use the i99 in 5-15

the i84 in 10-18+. This is my most used size wing in the quiver.

the i76 and TC 68 are excellent wings but need more wind for me.



Could use i99 with 7.0 sail in 5-15, 6.0 in 10-18 and 5.0 19+ rather than going to smaller wing? I like the slowness and balance of i99 and would like to develop my skills before going to faster wings.

thedoor
107 posts
7 Jan 2020 11:05PM
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MagicRide said..

motogon said..
thedoor, I'm regular size guy - 80 kg, 178 cm. I don't use sails over 6.8, and most of the time use 5.7 - 6.1 on 95 liters Freewave.
Would i76 fly in 8-10 knots of wind with say 5.0 - 5.5 sail? I don't mind to pump.








That's i84 and i99 wind ranges, and you will need a larger sail than a 5.7 most likely. The i76 range is from around 12 - 13 knots plus! I asked a lot of your same questions. Not trying to over step though. I did so much research on this before I purchased!

I got a lot of great info from here on one of my posts tittled, "Last Chance on i76 or i84 wing". A lot of specific, detailed info that you will most likely find helpful.


Agreed

thedoor
107 posts
7 Jan 2020 11:15PM
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CoreAS said..
I haven't tried the FS 115 yet but maybe because it has a narrower tail you might lose a bit of leverage for upwind work? the 125 wizard has that "slab" of a tail you can really dig your heel against and drive that thing
sounds like the i99 (we nicknamed the whales tail) is working well for you though


Maybe but the FS115 goes upwind very well on the other wings. My guess is it's got more to do with the fact that it foils so early that there is not enough umph to point very high. It was going upwind when foiling but more windsurfer angles and the pointing did improve with more wind.

dejavu
39 posts
8 Jan 2020 12:05AM
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What's interesting to me is that we seem to have two almost separate foiling sports -- race orientated and free ride. The bigger wings allow small sails in conditions you'd think would be impossible to get up on foil. A 6.0 metre sail in 5 to 10 knots? I would have thought this to be impossible before I started foiling -- not anymore!

I'm not interested in rigging 10 metre sails anymore. Foiling has me very excited again and its these low wind foils that are opening up so many non-windsurfing days and turning them into fun days, without thinking about whether or not to try a 12.0 metre sail.

Next will be the wind wing (bigger ones are coming for lower winds).

Shlogger
62 posts
8 Jan 2020 12:15AM
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dejavu said..
What's interesting to me is that we seem to have two almost separate foiling sports -- race orientated and free ride. The bigger wings allow small sails in conditions you'd think would be impossible to get up on foil. A 6.0 metre sail in 5 to 10 knots? I would have thought this to be impossible before I started foiling -- not anymore!

I'm not interested in rigging 10 metre sails anymore. Foiling has me very excited again and its these low wind foils that are opening up so many non-windsurfing days and turning them into fun days, without thinking about whether or not to try a 12.0 metre sail.

Next will be the wind wing (bigger ones are coming for lower winds).

Agreed. I've tried both modes and they both rock. But as a surfer, when I realized on the larger win

gs

I could surf chop, strapless w a 5.3.....I was hooked. Once you stand upright and let the sail luff out and just feel the wave energy....it's hard to want to do anything else.

thedoor
107 posts
8 Jan 2020 3:52AM
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SA_AL said..




CoreAS said..



I use the i99 in 5-15

the i84 in 10-18+. This is my most used size wing in the quiver.

the i76 and TC 68 are excellent wings but need more wind for me.




Could use i99 with 7.0 sail in 5-15, 6.0 in 10-18 and 5.0 19+ rather than going to smaller wing? I like the slowness and balance of i99 and would like to develop my skills before going to faster wings.


I havent tried using the i99 in heavy air, but in gusts I did not get the impression it would be prone to overfoiling, so my guess is that if you adjust the sail size you it would handle more wind.

I think because the lift is kind of back and it needs a heavy back foot (depending on set up),as it powers up you could easily combat overfoiling by shifting weight forward. However, I strongly suggest you add the i76 to your quiver (if you dont have one) for 15 and up

CoreAS
115 posts
8 Jan 2020 5:10AM
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I do have to show some love for the i76, its the quickest of all the wings and its my go to for trying new tricks (foil duck gybe and 360)
it flys upwind....Not sure if its my imagination but it seems to foil higher on the mast as well?

i84 just gives me more throttle through holes and carries through light wind gybing very well.

Dejavu,

I went down the race foil route in the beginning (JP135, 7.8 RS flight and F4 foil) it was very powerful and very quick upwind/downwind but I now prefer pushing as smaller kit as possible. The slingshot foil wings are easy to change out without changing sail size, smooth feedback and overall much more fun.

thedoor
107 posts
Monday , 13 Jan 2020 1:55PM
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After my second session on the i99 with FS115, I can say that I like it quite a bit.

It doesn't seem slow considering the windspeeds I was in 10-15mph, and it just motors through the lulls.

I have the mast track further back than my 76 and 65 and need a bit more backfoot pressure to get going, especially in the really light air. In the gusts, I would just increase the front foot pressure and it was smooth foiling.

Jameos
9 posts
Tuesday , 13 Jan 2020 11:04PM
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Here's a little theory I have, not sure if it's right. I'm on the 115 Freestyle too, i76 wing, weigh 90 kg and foil in light winds with a 5.4, my biggest freestyle sail. As soon as there's enough wind to pump, I can easily get on the foil. In my experience, a sail has a windspeed threshold below which it simply can't be pumped effectively.

So in my mind, as an active sailor with good pumping technique, I wouldn't get going earlier with a larger wing. It may deliver more lift, but what sets the limit to get on the foil is not the lack of lift from the i76, but the threshold when my sail becomes pumpable. Or am I missing something?

Please don't read into this that I think people shouldn't be on large wings or any stupid claims like that. Just curious.

CoreAS
115 posts
Tuesday , 13 Jan 2020 11:12PM
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thedoor said..
After my second session on the i99 with FS115, I can say that I like it quite a bit.

It doesn't seem slow considering the windspeeds I was in 10-15mph, and it just motors through the lulls.

I have the mast track further back than my 76 and 65 and need a bit more backfoot pressure to get going, especially in the really light air. In the gusts, I would just increase the front foot pressure and it was smooth foiling.


I agree it does take a lot more back foot pressure (especially when comparing against the i76).

I also lean further back in gybes, but as you said the it just keeps motoring through. I was foiling yesterday with a mate, both on the i99 and there was near nothing winds at first, along came a wind line and we were up and flying along.

He prefers the 48 rear and I prefer the 42 rear but our overall set ups are completely different (boards and rigs etc). I also prefer B position which brings the front wing back a bit (which is completely opposite to the recommendations by Slingshot). My back foot is in front of the back strap most of the time as I can instant feel pressure differences under foot, it also a sweet spot if I need to pump the board through a major wind hole.

dejavu
39 posts
Tuesday , 13 Jan 2020 11:22PM
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Jameos said..
Here's a little theory I have, not sure if it's right. I'm on the 115 Freestyle too, i76 wing, weigh 90 kg and foil in light winds with a 5.4, my biggest freestyle sail. As soon as there's enough wind to pump, I can easily get on the foil. In my experience, a sail has a windspeed threshold below which it simply can't be pumped effectively.

So in my mind, as an active sailor with good pumping technique, I wouldn't get going earlier with a larger wing. It may deliver more lift, but what sets the limit to get on the foil is not the lack of lift from the i76, but the threshold when my sail becomes pumpable. Or am I missing something?

Please don't read into this that I think people shouldn't be on large wings or any stupid claims like that. Just curious.


I think you make a good point; however, I believe the strength of the larger wings is their ability to effortlessly go through lulls once up. I say "effortlessly" meaning that you don't have to start pumping or meticulously trim your sail, etc. -- you just glide through to the next little gust.

CoreAS
115 posts
Tuesday , 14 Jan 2020 2:42AM
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Lots of variables in super light wind (and my definition of that is sub 10mph or 8/9 knots). rider weight, water conditions , rig type and wing to name a few.
at 92kg I would still need around 12+mph to foil up the i76 with a 5.8

the i99 as soon as there is a light wind ripple combined with solid pumping and timing I can get lift. Now where we foil the water is flat and so chop will also play a factor.
when you hit a big hole in the wind (as you can see in the original video) I can now glide with the aid of pumping in 5-7mph.

the amount of energy stored in the i99 is incredible , I can't really think of the perfect analogy but if you ran towards a "spring board" like we used to have in gym class, when you depress the spring board down (same as the front wing) it springs back up like a spring loaded pedal and you can use both rig pump combined with the wing energy to keep going to the next puff.

thedoor
107 posts
Tuesday , 14 Jan 2020 12:54PM
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dejavu said..

Jameos said..
Here's a little theory I have, not sure if it's right. I'm on the 115 Freestyle too, i76 wing, weigh 90 kg and foil in light winds with a 5.4, my biggest freestyle sail. As soon as there's enough wind to pump, I can easily get on the foil. In my experience, a sail has a windspeed threshold below which it simply can't be pumped effectively.

So in my mind, as an active sailor with good pumping technique, I wouldn't get going earlier with a larger wing. It may deliver more lift, but what sets the limit to get on the foil is not the lack of lift from the i76, but the threshold when my sail becomes pumpable. Or am I missing something?

Please don't read into this that I think people shouldn't be on large wings or any stupid claims like that. Just curious.



I think you make a good point; however, I believe the strength of the larger wings is their ability to effortlessly go through lulls once up. I say "effortlessly" meaning that you don't have to start pumping or meticulously trim your sail, etc. -- you just glide through to the next little gust.


I agree with deja

This is for James: you might be right, but wouldn't a larger sail be pumpable in lighter wind.

Another thing, am nearly at the point where pumping on to the foil is not the limiting variable, the limiting variable is the ability to stay up on the foil without pumping and I think a bigger sail would probably assist with that.

Jameos
9 posts
Tuesday , 14 Jan 2020 1:36PM
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thedoor said..

dejavu said..


Jameos said..
Here's a little theory I have, not sure if it's right. I'm on the 115 Freestyle too, i76 wing, weigh 90 kg and foil in light winds with a 5.4, my biggest freestyle sail. As soon as there's enough wind to pump, I can easily get on the foil. In my experience, a sail has a windspeed threshold below which it simply can't be pumped effectively.

So in my mind, as an active sailor with good pumping technique, I wouldn't get going earlier with a larger wing. It may deliver more lift, but what sets the limit to get on the foil is not the lack of lift from the i76, but the threshold when my sail becomes pumpable. Or am I missing something?

Please don't read into this that I think people shouldn't be on large wings or any stupid claims like that. Just curious.




I think you make a good point; however, I believe the strength of the larger wings is their ability to effortlessly go through lulls once up. I say "effortlessly" meaning that you don't have to start pumping or meticulously trim your sail, etc. -- you just glide through to the next little gust.



I agree with deja

This is for James: you might be right, but wouldn't a larger sail be pumpable in lighter wind.

Another thing, am nearly at the point where pumping on to the foil is not the limiting variable, the limiting variable is the ability to stay up on the foil without pumping and I think a bigger sail would probably assist with that.


Good points. Sure, a larger sail would go earlier in light winds, I just wondered if a larger foil would, too. Don't want to use any larger than 5.4 on the windsurfboard.

thedoor
107 posts
Tuesday , 14 Jan 2020 1:59PM
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Jameos said..
Good points. Sure, a larger sail would go earlier in light winds, I just wondered if a larger foil would, too. Don't want to use any larger than 5.4 on the windsurfboard.


Yeah there is a lot of variables. For me with the same sail I can get up easier and stay up longer with the 99.

excav8ter
202 posts
Wednesday , 15 Jan 2020 9:52AM
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SA_AL said..




CoreAS said..



I use the i99 in 5-15

the i84 in 10-18+. This is my most used size wing in the quiver.

the i76 and TC 68 are excellent wings but need more wind for me.




Could use i99 with 7.0 sail in 5-15, 6.0 in 10-18 and 5.0 19+ rather than going to smaller wing? I like the slowness and balance of i99 and would like to develop my skills before going to faster wings.


I have used my i99 with my 4.8 Duotone at least 6 or 8 times this fall/winter. I feel confident using the i84 with the 4.8 as well, but I have used the i99 for how "floaty" it is when i turn downwind and try to get comfortable with luffing the sail, while keeping forward foot pressure on the board to keep the nose down and try to feel the energy of the wave under the foil (hopefully that makes sense). Eventually I will probably go with the i84 as I get more comfortable and probably will buy an i76 this spring.

I've been using my i99 with the following sail sizes...
8.0 from 8-14mph.
7.0 for 12-18mph or so
6.0 for 16-20mph or so
And 4.8 for 20-25mph.

Sure, I could go faster with a smaller front wing, but I'm not there yet.... and may never be. Just being out there, doing something like this is such a rewarding experience. I am so stoked for this coming spring, summer and fall. Planning on going out as much as possible.

thedoor
107 posts
Wednesday , 15 Jan 2020 1:58PM
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@ excav8ter

Seems like you feel you can get more out of the 99 with larger sails (eg 8.0 v 7.0 v 6.0). I am yet to try anything bigger than a 5.7 and was wondering at what point does more sail size not make additional benefit,

motogon
9 posts
Thursday , 16 Jan 2020 1:04AM
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excav8ter said..


I've been using my i99 with the following sail sizes...
8.0 from 8-14mph.
7.0 for 12-18mph or so
6.0 for 16-20mph or so
And 4.8 for 20-25mph.


All of those number surprise me a lot. I'm foiling (occasionally when wind is too light) for last couple years on old 68 x 42 slingshot wings. I use 5.7 at 12-18 mph wind. I don't need i99 for this wind range. Yes, I pump to get going, but this is main point of foiling for me - small sail in light wind. BTW: I'm 83 kg., 60 years old office rat.
At 16-20 mph I don't bother with foil and windsurf my 6.1 on Freewave 115.

excav8ter
202 posts
4 hours ago , 18 Jan 2020 7:47AM
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thedoor said..
@ excav8ter

Seems like you feel you can get more out of the 99 with larger sails (eg 8.0 v 7.0 v 6.0). I am yet to try anything bigger than a 5.7 and was wondering at what point does more sail size not make additional benefit,


I'm still learning this whole foiling thing. Maybe I am using sails that are too big for a particular wind speed, but it feels pretty comfortable for me. I'm not after speed, as much as I am after stability right now. I am hoping to get comfortable with downwind wind foiling this year. Also, getting out in the lightest wind possible.

I have no one to practice with where I live... heck, I don't even know anyone who windsurfs anymore.

I may be off on my wind speed vs. sail size, but I feel I am pretty close. I use a Skywatch anemometer to help me figure out wind speed.

thedoor
107 posts
3 minutes ago , 18 Jan 2020 12:03PM
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excav8ter said..

thedoor said..
@ excav8ter

Seems like you feel you can get more out of the 99 with larger sails (eg 8.0 v 7.0 v 6.0). I am yet to try anything bigger than a 5.7 and was wondering at what point does more sail size not make additional benefit,



I'm still learning this whole foiling thing. Maybe I am using sails that are too big for a particular wind speed, but it feels pretty comfortable for me. I'm not after speed, as much as I am after stability right now. I am hoping to get comfortable with downwind wind foiling this year. Also, getting out in the lightest wind possible.

I have no one to practice with where I live... heck, I don't even know anyone who windsurfs anymore.

I may be off on my wind speed vs. sail size, but I feel I am pretty close. I use a Skywatch anemometer to help me figure out wind speed.


Yeah, I have only have 2 sessions on the 99 so there is still experimenting to do.

How much do you pump to get going?

PS: just reread your earlier post. I am pretty certain you will be able to go from the 99 to the 76 when you do play try to down size.



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"Lightwind test of 2020 slingshot infinity 99 wing" started by CoreAS