1553 posts
andy time will come when dupont or any huge corporation will figure out a new fabric or film that has the properties of mono but will never crease..but then again the whole sail industry will be in shambles..
VIC
2424 posts
Hi Jp , Yep , Sorry if my references to design confused you . I am the arty farty guy that draws the pretty pictures and deals with the sails 'Aesthetics'. Andrew is the genius behind the super fast sails , the "shape master" , I just assist him .
Seeya Martin
VIC
218 posts
Hey Arnold "Though I did hear something about 'Leech flutter' with the Koncept, is this from over downhauling the sail and having a really floppy leach? (If so, I can't see that being good for the mono-film)
I only found the leech flutter on my friends 6.6m Koncept in stronger winds, when I had some goes of it. It does thrash around quite a bit, but most of these kind of sails do it to some respect. But it is a really fast sail. I dont know how the monofilm will last, being thrashed that much, it should be a dacron at the top, so the flutter won't destroy it. But my friends 6.6 is still okay today, but I suppose time will tell.
1553 posts
hi sailquick and mr. love, not too worry sooner or later dupont or some chemical co. will come up with a monofilm that can be folded like a flag and still won't be creased..but then again sail companies would tumble..as for mr. love cool colors and graphics it's the first thing customers look too i presume and test later..i'd love to see one this side of the world..
QLD
7436 posts
Mr Love wrote
>Andrew is the genius behind the super fast sails , the "shape master" , I just assist him .<
And Jordo spells the sail names for you.
Oh, nice looking sails Martin. Well done.
QLD
7436 posts
Talking about light tough materials - Aerotech have been using "pentex" in the centre/top panels of their race sails for years. Its a laminated product and has very good uv properties as well as having a soft hand and high durability. So why don't more manufacturers use that?
46 posts
The 2008 KA sails look good. The Koncept looks to be 'tall and skinny'(i.e. short boom and long luff) even more so than last years model compared to the Koyote (I reckon I could break those carbon tube battens pretty easily though, anyone have any experience with carbon tube battens?). Is there a difference in characteristics betwwen a 'short & fat sail' and a 'tall skinny'one?
VIC
218 posts
Hi Arnold. The Battens do seem to be weak. Lately I have seen a few broken top battens in the wave sails, apparently it is a common problem in the Ka wave sails. Also were the battens are cutting through the batten pocket material. Not good at all. Seems all too common with this brand. I would stay way clear.
I even overheard a sponsored sailer saying how they don't care that their sail is falling apart, as they get them cheap anyway.
Stewie
VIC
2424 posts
The top battens on the wave sails is rod , not tube . Some people did break top battens last year . I beleive the loft used the incorrect spec rod in some sails . This has been fully addressed for 08 along with a host of upgrades in materials and construction. Notable changes on the Koncept are heavier monofilm on the higher wear panels , Heavy duty luff sleeve material reinforced at the cams , kevlar leech and luff reinforements and cam zippers which make off the cam rigging easier , so less monofilm creasing while rigging .The materials and construction specs are now equal to any race sail on the market .
Arnold was refering to the tube battens on the Koncept and Koyote .Firstly the bottom batten is still rod , the batten most prone to breaking . The others are tube battens with varying percentages of carbon depending on the batten placement . I don,t know the exact specs , Andrew could answer that . Yes tube battens are more fragile than rod , why they are not used on Wave sails . They do however improve the sails stability dramatically , so for high performance freeride sails and race sails they are well worth it .
1553 posts
to all the designer(s) and shaper(s) of this sail it looks damn fast! too bad not too much exposure upside of aussieland am pretty sure it'll give np,maui,naish, etc.. a run for their money..regards
QLD
575 posts
Ive got an 07 6.6 koncept, on Friday I hit a sandbar at over 25 knots, stopped dead and landed right on the sail. Absolutely no damage to sail or battens. The sail is great plenty of low down grunt, I can plane in 12 knots and still handle over 20-25 with it.
1553 posts
hi fitzz66 that's a one of a kind catapult and one for the books. i hit a bunch of corals once bout 10+yrs. ago trying to impress four dudettes on the beach on my last run crossing from the main island. at full speed and looking at your best stance didn't know it was low@#$%@$#%tide so i catapulted across the sand right in front of them...regards
QLD
14968 posts
stewie and arnold,
reading all of the posts i can't really figure whether you guys are winding it up or not. i guess i'm just paranoid after the trolling on the gps site.
my 2 cents worth -
personally i think KA are being missrepresented a bit here. to say the Koncept is weak is just not true. lots of people i know have them and have had no damage. speed sailing does break gear though. the list of broken bones, masts, booms etc in qld is growing with lots of guys trying to go fast and it doesn't really matter what brand of gear. 30+ knot catapults hurt.
also to say "ka wave sails" have a problem with the top batten is not telling the whole storey and it implies all ka wave sails have an issue. once again, friends i know have them and have had no issues. the only wave sail that had a problem with the top batten was the 2007 kaos. none of the others have had a problem that i am aware of in any of the previous years. and of the 2007 kaos not all of them had battens break in the head. as i said. friends have that particular model and have no issues.
personally i have sailed every KA model sail since 2000-01 and own 4 of them currently myself. from wave through to race. i have never had anyhting break/fall apart etc on any of them. they have all lasted and still look awesome. (oh, i forgot, except 1 downhaul pulley which i winched off the sail)
VIC
2424 posts
Sorry NotWal , No spell check on my pencil .
Should we tel Jord "wich" fin he should buy .
VIC
2424 posts
I,m so Konfused I left an l off Tell . Seems I am a Krap speller . Lucky the sails Kick arse !!! Eh
46 posts
I can see how people have different views on products. A few years ago NP had flatwater sails that used really light monofilm, they worked well until they fell apart, I know because I was unfortunate enough to own one, I think NP may have burned a lot of people because of it. I bought another NP sail the next year and that lasted with heavy use for 6 years and it was one of the ones with the flip top head thing, (I forget what they called it) which broke and caused the top panel to be floppy and eventually the monofilm cracked and broke.
So if KA have had problems perhaps they have addressed them in the 2008 model.
Gestalt, thanks for your input, glad you are enjoying your sails. I thought some people might have been trying to start an arguments too but overall the quality of most of the comments has been pretty good.
