There was a incident or argument on the Swan River maybe 10 years back between a windsurfer and a kitefoiler.

Was not there and it was pre foils. The kitesufer in a NW direction sailed fully into the Lucky Bay where all the windsufers were sailing causing mayhem.

There is an unwritten rule that kiters are not allowed there for obvious reason.

The bloke got into a argument with one of the regular windsurfers who rarely sails now and was seemingly adamant it was ok to cause panic and danger.

He was told in no uncertain terms in the shallows to not return ever and duly obliged

stehsegler said..

boardsurfr said..
Simple question: do you know the right of way rules on the water, and do you follow them? If you do, which set of rules is it that you follow (there are at least 2 different sets of rules, and some people who learned one set are not aware of the other set)?

2 sets? Isn't maritime rule for wind powered craft simply "wind from the right (starboard) has right of way" and when both craft are on the same tack the upwind has to give way to downwind?

Wave rules are the second, I'm assuming. Port/starboard is secondary vs going out/in, first on the wave, etc.

All my behaviours have been defensive reactions to harassment, direct threats with ongoing quiet taunting. My kite line was cut at the lighthouse. It is currently temporarily repaired and a new one is on order. I've acknowledged in early posts I've become part of the problem and pulled back. My recent reactions were undesirable and unpleasant to witness I'm sure. I apologies to those who have been there and confused, unaware of the cause. This post was also a reactive mistake on my part. Naive of me to think it would help but it was not fabricated or malicious. I was angry with reason, seeking an end to this. I was cautioned not to post but went ahead. Lesson learned. I'll not prolong this any further. I hope it stops but I will avoid reacting to any further engagement.

My local spot has recently been invaded by a kite school, downed kites and beginners everywhere all congregated right on the end of the flatwater speed run where we need to jibe. What can you do other than deal with them and allow for their inexperience. Even the instructors are clueless, often crossing our path in the safety boat with invisible tow ropes out the back not even watching us bearing down on them. They seem to grossly underestimated the speed a windsurfer on flatwater is capable of, the young instructors themselves have told us in conversations that they have never windsurfed, only kiting. No arguments or dust ups ......yet ! . On another note during my last session I was unaware that I was being encircled by a 2km long fishing net which was sitting 200mm under the surface which I ploughed into at full speed and right down on the harness lines. Needless to say that this resulted in a catastrophic catapult. So as of now local fishos 1, kiters 0. It just goes to show that danger can come from many places and never ignore warning signs. Reason I say this is because as I was launching I realised the fishos were out there and said to a mate will they be netting out there? If they are the net will have floats and we'll be able to see it right?....WRONG!

mob dog said..
My local spot has recently been invaded by a kite school, downed kites and beginners everywhere all congregated right on the end of the flatwater speed run where we need to jibe. What can you do other than deal with them and allow for their inexperience. Even the instructors are clueless, often crossing our path in the safety boat with invisible tow ropes out the back not even watching us bearing down on them.

If it's a commercial school they will need council approval to run their kite school at your local spot. As such they have to adhere to some safety rules. I'd suggest you talk to the instructors how you can better coexist at the location. If they are running a legit school with all permits they will be more than happy to come to an agreement.

Otherwise go to your local council and discuss if this school is actually out to operate there and what their operational conditions are.

stehsegler said..

mob dog said..
My local spot has recently been invaded by a kite school, downed kites and beginners everywhere all congregated right on the end of the flatwater speed run where we need to jibe. What can you do other than deal with them and allow for their inexperience. Even the instructors are clueless, often crossing our path in the safety boat with invisible tow ropes out the back not even watching us bearing down on them.

If it's a commercial school they will need council approval to run their kite school at your local spot. As such they have to adhere to some safety rules. I'd suggest you talk to the instructors how you can better coexist at the location. If they are running a legit school with all permits they will be more than happy to come to an agreement.

Otherwise go to your local council and discuss if this school is actually out to operate there and what their operational conditions are.

They have told us they have all the necessary permits an insurances etc. We have not checked this with council yet. Thinking of talking to them first, especially about the most basic of maritime rules that powered craft give way to sail craft at all times and watch where your going and what's going on around you, see what they have to say and go from there.

John340 said..
Kite surfing does not mix well with other water sports. The combination of long control lines, boosting, show boating close to shore and disregard of other water users around them, make many kiters dangerous accidents waiting to happen. The only real solution is separation, especially in restricted waterways like Golden Beach.

That is an opinion. My equally invalid opinion is that windsurfing does not mix well with other water sports. Going exactly 90 degrees to the wind at full speed with very little ability to slow down, speed up, or steer more than a few degrees. This makes it an accident waiting to happen. All the other water sports can slow down, speed up, and turn on a dime, and happily coexist in limited spaces with no aggro.

/just saying the view from one's own perspective can be misleading...

And therein lies the problem KBGhost. You and your ilk are seriously under the impression you can do whatever you want whenever you want and anybody else should get out of your way or put up with it. Must be a bad gene. You are NOT entitled!!!!!

stehsegler said..

John340 said..
Kite surfing does not mix well with other water sports. The combination of long control lines, boosting, show boating close to shore and disregard of other water users around them, make many kiters dangerous accidents waiting to happen. The only real solution is separation, especially in restricted waterways like Golden Beach.

I disagree. Here in WA between Port Beach and Cottesloe kiteboarders happily coexist with windsurfers and wing dingers. There are zones kite-boarders are supposed to adhere to which bar a few cowboys most do. The cowboys usually get told in no uncertain terms to leave the area. By cowboys I mean those people you refer to.

Sounds like a form of segregation. The same occurs on the Broadwater at the Gold Coast

AusMoz said..

KBGhost said..

John340 said..
Kite surfing does not mix well with other water sports. The combination of long control lines, boosting, show boating close to shore and disregard of other water users around them, make many kiters dangerous accidents waiting to happen. The only real solution is separation, especially in restricted waterways like Golden Beach.

That is an opinion. My equally invalid opinion is that windsurfing does not mix well with other water sports. Going exactly 90 degrees to the wind at full speed with very little ability to slow down, speed up, or steer more than a few degrees. This makes it an accident waiting to happen. All the other water sports can slow down, speed up, and turn on a dime, and happily coexist in limited spaces with no aggro.

/just saying the view from one's own perspective can be misleading...

Seriously???

I always find posts like KB Ghosts post quite interesting. A view inside the mind of a kiter, and all these things they think we can't do. bit silly doing it in a windsurfing forum though. Wanna be wearing a flame suit.

but i'd take his post as more of a poke back to John340s post. theres plenty of friendly co sport sailing going on in a lot of plenty of places around the country. It looks like this thread may have been started as a sh!t stir of of sorts, and its working brilliantly so far. one bad egg doesn't mean the whole batch is rotten.

Apart from taking up car parks and rigging area , , we get along great with our fellow kiters. We do have a large area to play in . I could definitely see a problem if squashed together in a small area .
I would make 4 rules to co exist. 1 , when reaching , coming head on , a windsurfer should pass upwind . This way we can safely pass closely . 2 , a windsurfer should not bear off downwind close to a kiter ,either head on or overtaking. 3 , a kiter should not boost upwind anywhere near anyone . 4 , and most importantly, Everyone needs a good look around when changing direction . If you can't because your learning or don't want to do this because you think you have a right of way , you shouldn't be in a crowded place . Unfortunately a kiter takes up a lot of room when learning and is dangerous in a crowded place . Learning wingers and windsurfers are not compared.
This is only my opinion and clash with general boating rules that are complex to think about in the heat of the moment and don't work mixing kiting and windsurfing .

^^^^^
What kind of beer ? Please not that yellow stuff

All of the above is why I love open ocean sailing the most. Just me and the big fishies

Imax1 said..
^^^^^
What kind of beer ? Please not that yellow stuff

Your beer is yellow and warm, I won't tell you how I made it but it doesn't have a fruity overtone

snorkel962 said..
On a positive note a couple of weeks ago I had a few sails at GB and was really impressed with the friendly cameraderie at the beach there. Didn't seem to matter what gear you were on from kites to wing dings to windsurfers people were up for a smile and a chat on and off the water and there was a lot of give and take being shown with avoiding other craft.

The area in question has some deep water so those with foils prefer to share the space with those who have regularly windsurfed there. For those who kite, there are two areas nearby where they operate in large numbers when the conditions are good. Most windsurfers avoid these areas. Sometimes an odd kiter will try to avoid the crowd of other kiters and set up in the area where windsurfers predominate. Some novices have done this and they were a bit dangerous to other water users. On the other hand, those who foil or wing are usually much more experienced so they don't cause any angst.