FarNorthSurfer said..
in all cases the larger board and foil are less able to get going in light winds

Yes agree. If the board is too big you cannot pump it well and if it's very wide it accelerates worse.

For me -10L to +10L is the sweet spot and I prefer +10L in the light because it's easier to taxi.

All this for normal boards... with the new downwind boards the rules change.

Big wide boards and slow foils CAN work but you'll notice that DavidJohn describes not foiling through gybes and instead waiting on another gust.
With a more efficient board and foil you don't need that gust, you can gybe through lulls that a big slow foil just won't. Also you may be able to downsize on your wing.

425Foiler said..

camerongraham said..
My E3 DW board is 6'1" x 23" @105 litres
with a GT2200 foil and CWC Strike 8M I have been the only guy on the water the past few sessions whilst others have waited on the the shore for enough wind for their setups.
i can get up and stay up in sub 8 knots very easily
I'm 6' and 80kg so I can stand upright and wait for wind, even in large chop and waves.
At 6'1" the board looks large but in reality feels quite nimble as you stand forward and there is not that much board in front of your feet. I find light wind winging a heap of fun as I can go slow and focus on keeping the board flying learning board/foil skills instead of relying on sheer wind power to keep flying. Yesterday I was riding in a Harbour with a large opening to the ocean so swells and waves were coming through even though the wind was light, so I had heaps of fun using the wind to get me onto the swells and floating along with barely any wind input. Since getting the E3 DW board 6 weeks ago I haven't ridden my wing boards (70 litre and 58 litre) as this board is just so easy and fun.
Edit: the black lines behind the mast are cable guides for my FoilDrive, but I'm hardly using it for winging as I can get up in such light winds with the big wing and big foil. I did use my FoilDrive with this same setup the other week in 5knots and had a very relaxing session with no frustration, very minimal pumping and glorious smooth water

E3 + FD Assist is exactly what I was thinking of to get a few more sessions in on a flat water lake this summer.
Do you think that setup offers enough benefit over a traditional board and applying a little more throttle to justify the cost?
You mentioned winging in 5 knots, even if that's not the norm that's definitely encouraging.

Moving to a 7m wing + FD got me a lot more days on the water last summer, but if I could go even a knot or two lower that would be worth it to me.

Any more comments on using the FD would be appreciated.
---
50yo, 75kgs
Intermediate foiler
LW setup: 110 Naish Hover, Axis 1150, 7m CWC

My very first session on this setup (FoilDrive/8M Fone/GT2200/E3 DW) was in extremely light wind, sub 5 knots and I would classify it as wind assisted FoilDriving rather than FoilDrive assisted winging. Sure I could get up, but to stay up I pretty much had to efoil. The subsequent session on this setup was in marginally stronger winds (5 to 8 knots) and the FoilDrive was only needed to get up and then the big wing and big foil let me capture any available breeze to stay up. I then went out another 3 sessions in light wind without FoilDrive and had no problem getting up and flying whilst others stayed on shore or went out and just flapped about. So in my experience the setup let me enjoy the light wind without the frustration of endless wing and board pumping. So yesterday I thought I'd try to isolate exactly which component is the magic ingredient.
Conditions were very light (again) and one guy was out on a 6M SLS just taxiing around trying to pick up a gust
Instead of the 105litre Kalama E3 I decided to use my 5' 70litre board to see if the board was the key
First up though I offered my 8M Strike to Michael who had given up on the session with his 6M, he grabbed the 8M and I grabbed his 6M SLS. He popped up on his first attempt and scooted away. I pumped his 6M and eventually got up, so in my mind the big foil (GT2200) allowed me to get up and once up the 6M wing was more than adequate. After 10 minutes I caught up with Michael and we swapped wings. Now with the 8M Strike I was up and flying without any effort whereas poor Michael couldn't get going again on his 6M, so he ended up just flapping/taxiing back to shore. He was blown away by the 8M Strike and I'm sure he's trying to hunt one down now. I then thought I'd change it up and go for a higher aspect foil so I swapped out the GT2200 for an RS1300. I went back out and really noticed how much more effort was required to get up, lots of wing pumping, lots of falling off, lots of swearing. I managed to get up a few times, but the wind started to die as the sunset approached and I ended up having to lie down and paddle 500m back to shore. I'm sure if I was on the E3 with the GT2200 I would have been able to get up and foil back to shore instead the paddle of shame. My takeaway from the last session - if it's less than 8 knots, run the DW board, 8M wing and big foil for a very stress free session.

Windbot said..

FarNorthSurfer said..
My set up of Slick 7m, Armstrong HS1850 and Patrik AIO 5'9" 115 litre board gets me going reliably in 8 -10 kts. (94kgs)
The Patrik AIO has had some unfair comments at the beach becasue it has cut outs but I don't think thses hold it back much.
It also has a 'fin' instead of a hole for a handle, marginal gains I guess.
I compare this set up to a Patrik Foil Ride 125 windfoil board with Severne 7.5m Turbo sail on AFS W95 foils and there is nothing in it in light winds. I now prefer the wingfoil because its easier to rig up and carry and not much slower.
I also have a Gong Zuma 140 for SUP foil and a CF2400 foil but in all cases the larger board and foil are less able to get going in light winds.
The Zuma is 31" wide and I am finding this is too wide for SUP foil let alone winging.
Anyway, happy to be out when its light although my cycling has really suffered because I am on the water all the time!

Interesting hearing the comparison against the windfoil gear, as that's one I'm always making with my own gear. Aso interesting about the Zuma being less able to get going. Thanks.

Overall there are lots of good comments in this thread, thanks!

Saw windfoiler with dedicated board, sail, foil get going in 2 knots less wind than me on 6m wing, though more skilled wingers were going same as me with 5m. Windfoil looked boring and food wingers having fun on small swells.

DJ, I always that I was the odd one out.
A bit similar, me 75kg, old 2019 Naish Hover 7ft 6in x 28in SUP foil board with dead flat rocker from mid way to tail.
With 6.5 dlab and either Axis 1050 HPS or ART 1099 foiling in wind from 8kn is often possible for me at 76 yo. This board pumps amazingly generating incredible board speed to make foiling easy,. Jybes are easy as swing weight is reduced due to the tracks being well forward.
Thanks JB for selling it to me about 2 years ago.
From 10kn wind and constant I have a Fanatic TE board.

cornwallis said..
Interesting clip - with such a fast foil you can get the added effect of increased apparent wind, maybe foiling through lulls where a big slow foil would stop you

I recently did a similar test with a similar sized DW Board. Started with a 7M and MA1750 wing and felt extremely comfortable cruising in sub 10knts breeze. Wind picked up slightly and put on a HA925 and found myself having a bit of trouble keeping pressure in the wing through the lulls, but it may have been directional/gusty changes giving me trouble. I kept finding myself sheeting all the way in with no power and then have to pump from that position was difficult, where as the larger slower foil was easier to hang out, gliding in that 10-14 mph range and chill, with steady pressure in the wing - and easier adjustments to wind shifts.

Hi, I am 71kg, using the fanatic sky style 55L, Unit 2023 5.5m (not dlab) and Sabfoil 945 (1300cm2) I can easily get going in stable 10kn.
Once I am up I can keep going in lower winds. Stable 8kn with some higher gusts (like 10kn) is very doable with the same setup for me, but if it's 8kn with no higher gusts then it's hard to get on the foil. If I get lucky and get some wave to help me I might get going, otherwise I would have to swim back :)
When it gets lo low winds pumping technique and some physical conditioning is very much needed, don't expect to let the wing still and suddenly start foiling. Also, once you are up you will need to be precise in your jibes, tacks and feet changes...you really don't want to touch the water. A table with no concaves and no weird cuts on the bottom will help you going earlier, the volume is not the only parameter, also the shape is very important.