Hey Cobra
A vexed issue no doubt.
I'm of the opinion that it is difficult to own the ocean, in Australia anyway.
I look at localism with contempt.
We have a metro beach in Perth that has all the hallmarks of localism, but the funny thing is, I think it is pretty much a nothing wave. I don't surf it because of the agro and drop-ins. My surf time is important to me for mellowing out, so I find the least crowded bank and do my thing.
Having said that at some surf camps overseas, I am happy that there is ownership of the wave, as I'm paying good coin for relatively uncrowded waves.
When I travel to waves in my region, I always stay wide when I first paddle out, dont snake, and be patient. But I try and go well on the first wave I catch.
I've experienced mouthy localism, but usually from the younger and least capable surfer in the crowd......
Just my thoughts

An oldie but a goodie:

Totally what he said ^^^^

So.
Having trouble finding material now???
Thought I spelled it out alright at the start

lotofwind said..
You got it all wrong though markie, in the surfing world localism isnt just about saying hello and giving out beers. lol
Its the locals saying/thinking/enforcing that they can have which wave they want whether they have right of way or not. (Always thought you agreed with first on the wave??)
The waves are for everyone evenly. If someone thinks that they are more deserving of the waves more than any other person out enjoying them is a tosser.

Just because you may of found a spot first(probly thousands before lol) dosent mean you can take any wave you want. If you think thats right, please come to my local and see if you mind if I short take you any wave I want cause I support localism.

Share people, dont get into the , I have surfed here 4 years ,Im a local crap.

Mark _australia said..
OK I never surfed and hate the aggro i hear about (and have never seen since I started my kooky longboard try-harding)
I do NOT agree with abuse and assaults and letting down tyres and all that shiz but

But as windsurfer .....

Localism ha...... what you are not local to some surf spot { obviously not in the water enough at your local] ...........get over it ,localism is not all bad , lighten up ............

Just cos i like a beer and me pubs just around the corner i aint always pisssssssssssed off.
only with you lofty, no waves for you ever

First out........ last in .................me and a local

There was this dude that spent three years travelling around Oz chasing surf.

Ironically, the worst bout of localism that he experienced was when he finally arrived back at his home beach ...

a break where he grew up surfing at.

lol.

Cobra said..

this got me interested in what others thought.

http://www.surfermag.com/features/crowd-control-2/

I thought that article was a load of farrrrking tripe. I can not believe that Surfer would even publish it. Its fair to say that the conversation did not go down word for word like that or even took place at all. With 3 people in the water - I think there is more than enough space for everyone. There is no real localism where I live. 95% of people are great blokes. There are a couple of idiots who drop in but other than that nothing to worry about. I have lived in some pretty localised places over the years - Raglan in the early 90's I saw and experienced several heavy situations. In those days if you got in the way / dropped in your board used to have its fins punched out and then you would be sent in for the day. If people argued it tended to escalate - but everyone sort of knew that there was no point in arguing as it would end in tears from the local boys. Some other spots in NZ were pretty heavy as well (still to scared to name them ).

When I lived in Manly I saw lots of examples of localism - mainly from the blokes in the board riders clubs who used to sit in packs together and just take any wave they wanted - dropping in and burning everyone and not giving a toss. They then encouraged others to do the same. It became a nightmare. At the Bower when it was big there was a definite pecking order. Same at Dee Why point. Very hard to get a wave without embracing the so called locals as the take off spots can be very small and you need to basically sit on top of one another in between sets. No place for idiots though when its big as a mistake can send you or others on to the rocks.

I guess in recent years the old days of bashings and car damage etc have been left behind - these days - people seem to feel stronger among packs and all operate together and ruin it for others who are not part of the gang. Basically by taking over the take-off spot or just burning people on waves and thinking its funny knowing that the person who got burned is not really going to do too much about it whilst everyone else is there. Personally I do not bother surfing places like this. 10 is a crowd if you ask me. I think the only place in the last 10 years where I have had any grief was at Caves when one of the old boys told me to paddle in before i even got out the back. I sat wide and kept out of his way and my head down as he paddled by. Over the next 30 mins he loosened off and within the hour was asking me questions and giving me set waves. So things can be turned around if you are pleasant. A smile and a hello costs nothing. As does not getting in peoples way whilst paddling out and not paddling around people or dropping in and make sure when its your go - you paddle hard and catch the thing - if not be happy to drop back to the back of the queue. If everyone is reasonably civil and friendly you should never experience a problem. There have been times though that I would like to teach some of the younger crew a thing or two though. One of the guys I surf with brings his son out a lot for the earlies - one day his son dropped in - Dad made him apologise and told him that if he ever does that again he will take his board off him for 3 mths. Within a few weeks that bloke become one of the nicest people in the water - and has just continued along that route ever since.

My only comment is that supermarket chick is a farkin good sort

BTW would you describe that dude in the supermarket as a 'Hipster'.
Just not sure what a 'Hipster' is.

Ted, you know I've got no chance of reading all that ^^^^^.

whippingboy said..
Are we talking about real locals or the local surf nazis ?

i remember a punch on one night in the early 80's ,,it was the local surfers and the local surf life savers, about forty guys punching on over a beach

they both thought they were right.both sides had nice blokes in their clubs, some today are still embarrassed in taking part.

https://surfpeople.com.au/howto/localism-and-how-to-avoid-it/
Another interesting read

Gonebush said.....
A large part of the surfing experience for me is being out there and relaxing, enjoying the ocean, so I would rather surf a lesser quality uncrowded wave than spend all my time jostling for a perfect wave. I think the whole localism thing is a wank.

I totally agree.

As said earlier I never even bother if there are more than 10 people as a general rule. That day at Caves it had been pretty busy early - it was cranking. I surfed Cactus - a much lower quality wave but still good fun. I came in had breakfast and then sat around by the rocks waiting for the crowds at Caves to drop off. When it got down to 5 I made my way out there. It was just one bloke who was unpleasant. It is an absolute quality wave and one I had always wanted to have a crack at. That morning it was as good as anything I had in Indo in the last 20 years. Absolute perfection. It was uncrowded and there were plenty coming through. I was probably never going to get that opportunity to surf it again like that so had to take that opportunity. It was also one of the main reasons I was there anyway. In terms of why I was respectful and not wearing a pink stripped wettie and riding a goatboat was simply that that place is well known as being high up the localism chain - 5 vans had been burnt out recently. I wanted to avoid jostling for waves and enjoying the ocean. So I picked my time.

Was amply rewarded to - probably the second best surf of my life. It was that good. I would show ya pictures but I was too scared to take any

Three years ago, Caves, glassy but with a bit of a wobble. No one out. Got talking to a local for an hour, he gave me some inside knowledge on the paddle out and lineups. Really friendly generous guy. I went and surfed for 90 minutes or so. Good fun but nowhere near the perfection Ted describes. I went in and old mate was still there. Chatted for another halfa. As I left he said, "everyone will be here tomorrow. Don't bother saying hello because I won't talk to you." Next morning the whole bay was good fun so I didn't bother getting out with the 20+ guys on Caves but after my surf went up for a look. D mate was there and I said hi. True to his word I got the thousand yard stare and some harsh comments to my back as I walked away. Very high school. Brave with their mates and to your back. But I wasn't going to argue because two weeks earlier a local had sent two blokes in. They didn't go. Next morning they tried to surf and got the snot belted out of them by 9 guys and told they had until noon to leave camp or there was another hiding coming.

Personally another mates experience there sums it up for me. He was at Caves with one local who said, "You guys don't understand. All we have in our lives are our beer, bongs and barrels." If that's all you have, I guess it's not surprising you end up a violent, brain fried coward.

The etiquette of surfing is pretty simple and I try to follow it wherever I surf and I try to surf places where others do the same. Wait your turn, don't snake, don't drop in, get out of the way even if it means getting the set on the head.