Forums > Kitesurfing General

Did you ever want to design your own kite?

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Created by decay 1 month ago, 27 Apr 2020
decay
89 posts
27 Apr 2020 10:33AM
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Hi Guys,

Being locked at home thanks to CV19 here in Cape Town has given me a chance to look at a new project.

A few years ago I wrote my own parametric kite design software. Over the last couple of weeks I've rehashed it into a web enabled tool called Karoro:

app.shapediver.com/m/200426-kite-design-with-le-scaling-18

Very much a work in progress, but feel free to have a go and let me know what you think.

Cheers

DK








Robbo2099
WA, 723 posts
27 Apr 2020 1:31PM
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Looks awesome mate! I made my own kite once, back in 2004. It was MISSION!








cauncy
WA, 7856 posts
27 Apr 2020 1:54PM
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Rob Smallwood and some mate's made a 21 mtr kite I had the displeasure of blowing it up once

Kamikuza
QLD, 5174 posts
27 Apr 2020 4:14PM
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No, but I really want to design a bar...

Gorgo
VIC, 4363 posts
27 Apr 2020 4:33PM
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I made a few foil kites in the early days of kiteboarding. Downloading and printing a design and making it was not super difficult. It definitely got easier with a little practice. Sewing is fun. Taking over the living room to mark out and cut is also kind of fun.

Designing my own kite was a whole different task. You can enter the parameters into the design software and it will render it and give you all the stuff to cut and sew.

None of that helps you build a kite that would actually fly. I decided there were way too many variables to deal with to build kites and test out the effect of changing various parameters. Way too much time and way too expensive.

I know of a few people who have become professional kite and paraglider designers. They were all taken on by existing businesses and learnt the trade in a sort of apprenticeship.

All the good guys now are full-on rocket scientists. There's way more science and mathematics than there used to be. Some paraglider manufacturers buy the designs from contract designers then the test pilots trim and tune the wings into their final form.

decay
89 posts
27 Apr 2020 3:26PM
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21m C kites are quite possible - if thats your thing....







Plummet
4714 posts
27 Apr 2020 5:32PM
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Looks very cool. But why go to this effort for others. What's your end game decay? Are you looking to manufacture kites fir dudes who design the kite using your software?

decay
89 posts
27 Apr 2020 6:08PM
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Hey Plumment,

No 'end game' at the moment, just hoping for some feed back on what might a new take on kite design technology.

Whats the point of having a cool tool in the tool box if no one else gets to try it?

If it proves to work and be useful for more people than just me, who knows?

Cheers

DK

drsurf
NSW, 90 posts
28 Apr 2020 12:28AM
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Hi DK.

Your design software is impressive and it takes some real skill to create and release as a web app.

However I notice that you've created an LEI kite similar in design to many sold by the usual kite companies. I'm not knocking you for this, just wondering if you have the skill, and no doubt access to and understanding of the practical aerodynamics of kitesurf kites, if you could come out with something completely different and revolutionary which could take kitesurfing a giant leap forward from where we are today?

I say this after 20+ years of flying LEI kites of various brands and styles, and riding TT's surfboards and foils, I tried a snow kite with a hydrofoil. It was a revelation and I now mainly use these snow kites, the Flysurfer Peak4's, for foiling and can't get over how a simple, lightweight, inexpensive kite, never designed for water use, has become my go to kite 95% of the time. I sell the Peak4's as well and I know many others who have had the same experience.

I guess what I'm saying is are we just at the stage of minor incremental changes to existing designs or is there something we haven't tried yet which could be fantastic. Seeing as you have plenty of time in lockdown I thought you might like to ruminate on this

RAL INN
VIC, 2834 posts
28 Apr 2020 3:52PM
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Used to be a free download version of Surfplan.
Fun to use and play with.

Plummet
4714 posts
29 Apr 2020 1:29AM
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Fair enough. I've thought about making a kite momentarily. But the upskilling required would be huge. The labour to make it would be massive and I would end up with a kite around the performance of 2006 kit if I was lucky.


I don't think the average Joe has a hope in hell in getting close to current kite performance. Kite designers have been honing their designs for years and years with continuous improvement and incremental changes. It's really those small changes in angles and bridle placements that make all the difference. Hell even a 5cm change the bridle adjustment of my enduro makes it go from awesome to crud.

Being in the kite industry i'm sure you have access to the latest magic number. so that will make your build a success.

Post up some pics of the build and some footage of you blasting on it when complete. It certainly is an awesome feeling designing, making and riding something you design yourself.

KiteDesigner
NSW, 169 posts
29 Apr 2020 10:22AM
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Hey decay, great to see you doing something with your spare time and making your software available to everyone for free,

It gives more people around the planet the chance to nerd out and try different things with kite designs who have the time and mind to do so, and this is where new innovation can come from and grow.

Yeah your plans right now may not be as good as the top brands and not everyone has the time to make a kite and tweak it, but its a start, and that's a good thing, keep it up.


airsail
QLD, 417 posts
29 Apr 2020 11:18AM
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Have you thought about a light weight no strut for foiling. None are available in Oz easily, Gong have one but it is heavy and a Cloud is not available for shipping to Oz.

weebitbreezy
459 posts
29 Apr 2020 5:30PM
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Thanks for allowing us to play with the online tool. I'd need a lot more knowledge to make something useful out of it personally. Let us know when you make updates available.

P.S. Really enjoying listening to your stories on the podcasts recently.

decay
89 posts
30 Apr 2020 5:16PM
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Select to expand quote
drsurf said..
Hi DK.

Your design software is impressive and it takes some real skill to create and release as a web app.

However I notice that you've created an LEI kite similar in design to many sold by the usual kite companies. I'm not knocking you for this, just wondering if you have the skill, and no doubt access to and understanding of the practical aerodynamics of kitesurf kites, if you could come out with something completely different and revolutionary which could take kitesurfing a giant leap forward from where we are today?

I say this after 20+ years of flying LEI kites of various brands and styles, and riding TT's surfboards and foils, I tried a snow kite with a hydrofoil. It was a revelation and I now mainly use these snow kites, the Flysurfer Peak4's, for foiling and can't get over how a simple, lightweight, inexpensive kite, never designed for water use, has become my go to kite 95% of the time. I sell the Peak4's as well and I know many others who have had the same experience.

I guess what I'm saying is are we just at the stage of minor incremental changes to existing designs or is there something we haven't tried yet which could be fantastic. Seeing as you have plenty of time in lockdown I thought you might like to ruminate on this



Thanks for the feedback drsurf.

I can kind of understand where you are coming from - and for sure if I had a whole bunch of time to put into this project I'd like to explore the 'what if'.

However this whole project started life as a 'programming exercise' for myself - a challenge to learn some new skills. Quite honestly I just got carried away - never imgained I'd have the skills to produce a usable tool in this form.

If there is a 'road map' for the project I'd like to make a 'wing thing' version and later a parafoil version - neither of which would be very far removed from the under-lying source code.

Cheers

DK

decay
89 posts
30 Apr 2020 5:19PM
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Select to expand quote
KiteDesigner said..
Hey decay, great to see you doing something with your spare time and making your software available to everyone for free,

It gives more people around the planet the chance to nerd out and try different things with kite designs who have the time and mind to do so, and this is where new innovation can come from and grow.

Yeah your plans right now may not be as good as the top brands and not everyone has the time to make a kite and tweak it, but its a start, and that's a good thing, keep it up.




Thanks mate!

decay
89 posts
30 Apr 2020 5:22PM
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Select to expand quote
weebitbreezy said..
Thanks for allowing us to play with the online tool. I'd need a lot more knowledge to make something useful out of it personally. Let us know when you make updates available.

P.S. Really enjoying listening to your stories on the podcasts recently.


Thanks weebitbreezy - its was fun to go over the past with kitesurf365 - lots of old memories of fun times with awesome people.

I'm hoping to do a 'how to' process video of a typical kite design in the next couple of weeks things might make some better sense once you see that.

Cheers

DK

cauncy
WA, 7856 posts
30 Apr 2020 9:11PM
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Something went badly wrong on my software

Maybe hacked somehow through some vintage porn site

Plummet
4714 posts
3 May 2020 3:46AM
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Select to expand quote
cauncy said..
Something went badly wrong on my software

Maybe hacked somehow through some vintage porn site

Designing a bra for the missus mate?

cauncy
WA, 7856 posts
3 May 2020 2:30PM
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Select to expand quote
Plummet said..

cauncy said..
Something went badly wrong on my software

Maybe hacked somehow through some vintage porn site


Designing a bra for the missus mate?


He hasn't got tits

bjw
NSW, 3183 posts
9 May 2020 7:50PM
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Select to expand quote
cauncy said..
Something went badly wrong on my software

Maybe hacked somehow through some vintage porn site


It looks like a hang glider raped a windsurfer.

decay
89 posts
11 May 2020 12:50AM
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Latest version now up at:

www.karorocad.online



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"Did you ever want to design your own kite?" started by decay