Dolls Point Guidelines.... some points to add

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pintofpale
pintofpale
SA
229 posts
SA, 229 posts
23 Nov 2007 12:58pm
Regardless of who's done what to who at Dolls point and what sort of kite you decide to fly what has someones race got to do with anything? Personal slurs, especially based on which country you might have come from just make the perpetrator look like a total dick. I wonder why Laurie lets this garbage go on on a kitesurfing forum?
Moritz
Moritz
NSW
180 posts
NSW, 180 posts
23 Nov 2007 1:59pm
How funny... 9 months away from Dolls and the forum and not much change here....

Here are my 2c:

I'm generally against establishing rules. Rules generally constrain and they do not always make sense for all the parties kiting. I rather view things as recommendations (or kite conduct). I would propose for Dolls:

1. It is recommended to maintain 2 line length from the beach, if you are someone that doesn't have outstanding kite control (i.e. beginners/intermediates). The same applies to advance riders trying tricks they don't nail all the time.

2. We should establish a recommended launching/landing area and a kite "parking" area. When I was in Egypt, they had a very simple system. They stretched a 40m rope in an "L"-shape creating a "virtual" box. The rope was pinned down to the sand with 3 camping pins. This box was the launching and landing area, but no kite was allowed to be left in the area (neither were lines). I would propose this to be in the section where the beach is wider and not at the top (very narrow) section of Dolls. The top section should be used to park/rig the kites. Given Kitepower is the biggest beneficiary of Dolls Point and best placed to provide this infrastructure, I would propose them to put up the rope

3. I agree it should be recommended to roll up the lines. At least those kites that "come late". If you're the first kite on the beach, you can probably get away with your lines being on the sand (no one is going to get hurt by the lines, given no one is recommended to launch from there anyway). It just becomes annoying when there is a salad of lines and the one of the bottom wants to go to launch.

4. No self-launches/landings are recommended. Even if you're a pro in doing it, it is recommendable to have someone to assist you. Even if you want to practice it. That also applies to foils. It is safer to have someone close by with an eye on your launch who is in a good position to help if things go wrong.

5. It is recommended entering the water from the launch zone and not through walking up the beach like many do. Walking up the beach to the groin should really only be done when the wind is super light and it is extremely difficult to stay/go up-wind. Otherwise, it is recommended for the rider to go into the water from the launch zone and tack up wind in the water. It is not only risky to walk up wind (kite may end up in the trees, etc.) it is also annoying for those riding to always have one line lengths + a kite hovering over the water when they are trying to use the flat section behind the groin.

Ok, maybe it was 4c....

Anyway, Granini/Bozo/Boozo et. al. this is my addition to the post

M
laurie
laurie
QLD
3902 posts
QLD, 3902 posts
23 Nov 2007 1:02pm
pintofpale said...

I wonder why Laurie lets this garbage go on on a kitesurfing forum?


Because they post faster than moderators can delete!

There was hope that it could keep on the subject matter, but it seems to keep returning to "playing the man" .. - time for the particpants to resolve it via Personal Messaging.

This forum is for discussing Kitesurfing, improving yourself and the sport!

Thank you.

pintofpale
pintofpale
SA
229 posts
SA, 229 posts
23 Nov 2007 3:17pm
amen!
granini
granini
NSW
99 posts
NSW, 99 posts
23 Nov 2007 4:36pm
Moritz,

Moritz said...

How funny... 9 months away from Dolls and the forum and not much change here....


LOL.

But being constructive:

I basically agree to your recommendations but would like to add some comments to the following:

Moritz said...
4. (...)
That also applies to foils. It is safer to have someone close by with an eye on your launch who is in a good position to help if things go wrong.


I wanted to make this comment to one of your previous post but thought it would have made no sense.

But now: having someone next to the foil while launching will not reduce the risk at all. Even if there is something wrong with the bridle the foil will go up within a second out of reach for the assistant. A launch assistant would only make sense next to the guy who launch the kite to hold him in case something goes wrong to give him the chance to trigger the security. Having said that, the risk that something goes badly wrong while launching a foil is much lower than with a tube:

- Flying lines stay connected to a foil -> no chance of mixing up front/rear or right/left lines.

- Foils have almost no pull when you launch them because they need to be inflated to produce pull and this happens only when they are at 12 by pulling the rear lines and flying them from left to right to inflate the wingtips. Tubes have a lot of pull immediately when they will fall back into the wind window -> not a foil that has not reached its shape (Wingtips straight).

They look scary when they are launched but this is controlled.

Moritz said...
5. (...)
it is also annoying for those riding to always have one line lengths + a kite hovering over the water when they are trying to use the flat section behind the groin.


That's the next point where I would like to make some comments. As basic rule because of the limited space I would not recommended keeping the kite always over the water side. If you see somebody coming in, bring your kite over to the beach side to give him room. Otherwise it would make it difficult for people coming in. Have a look at the following photo:

http://www.acr.net.au/~msc/photos.htm

The kites are on the beach side and not on shore side.

Cheers

Granini
maxim
maxim
NSW
84 posts
NSW, 84 posts
23 Nov 2007 5:36pm
Ok, I tried being nice.... There is no way at DOLLS (can you hear me??) that you should EVER move your kite while on land towards the TREES!!, WALL!!, or any where past 12.. Kites on land entering the water HAVE RIGHT OF WAY.. If you can not understand that, please kite away from the setup area, there is simply not enough space and this is a RULE/RECOMMENDATION that all locals respect. Please try to fit in, after all we need to keep our beach safe.
granini
granini
NSW
99 posts
NSW, 99 posts
23 Nov 2007 5:54pm
maxim said...

Ok, I tried being nice.... There is no way at DOLLS (can you hear me??) that you should EVER move your kite while on land towards the TREES!!, WALL!!, or any where past 12.. Kites on land entering the water HAVE RIGHT OF WAY..


What line length do you use? 150 m? Do you need a demonstration next time how to move the kite towards the wall side while staying on the beach? When I can do it with 27 m lines + 3-4m bridle why can't you do it?

And here we go again, read my post carefully. I was not talking about right of way rules. (I know that the guy on the beach has priority, but I thought we have sorted it out in our small private conversation).

And again, I was not talking about keeping the kite permanently over the beach. I see most locals keeping their kite over the beach in order to give the incoming people space, and this is what I try to do as well when I see people coming in. Remember courteousness/respect.

Cheers and lots of wind for the weekend hopefully here and down at merimbula

Granini
Moritz
Moritz
NSW
180 posts
NSW, 180 posts
23 Nov 2007 8:04pm
Granini,

I'm not going to argue with you on the foils thing. It's not imporatant enough given you are probably the only one with one down at Dolls.

With regards to flying the kites over the beach, I must agree with that Maxim guy. The top section of Dolls point is too narrow. My 24m lines + bridle get very close to the trees (even at a 70 degree angle, i.e. 11o'clock). Keeping the kite at 12o'clock is not ideal either.

So I stick to my recommendation. Kites should be launched on the wide section of the beach and riders should then go straight into the water and not walk up to the rock groin. If you can't go up wind, there is still plenty of space downwind and people who can't go up wind are definitely not recommended to be walking with the kite in the air close to trees, etc anyway....

Trouble
Trouble
NSW
193 posts
NSW, 193 posts
23 Nov 2007 9:14pm
Moritz, you need to spend some more time in sydney. even if your points are valid they dont count for at least another month!
Moritz
Moritz
NSW
180 posts
NSW, 180 posts
24 Nov 2007 2:10am
Why don't they count for at least another month???
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