Trant,

Great start. This is the kind of thinking we need to encourage and the kind of ideas that we need to be investigating here in Oz: It builds on work already being done in other places without the necessity of re-inventing the wheel.

This idea, along with hopefully others like it, should go on the agenda of the next AKSA meeting and also be discussed at state level organisations.

The growing dissatisfaction amongst instructors with the IKO is not an insignificant issue -- currently we have an internationally-controlled but locally-affiliated model that does not meet local needs -- by creating a locally-controlled but internationally-affiliated organisation like Trant suggests, many of these issues could be effectively managed locally, resulting in better meeting the needs of the Australian kiting community.

BKSA would reject me cos I'm Welsh

Currently the OZ KSurfing trailer has historically been attached to the IKO - which has shot it self in the foot by all accounts.

The objective is to have a useful organic (i.e. evolving) training system which has recognised standards and a future.
Alot of the IKO material was/is good but the organisation has lost touch.

In the mean time other organisations have filled the gap. So let us move with what is currently in our best interest. Culturally lining up with the poms and their system is straight forward, I assume that the quality, content and organisation would matched and exceeded the current IKO.

So the next thing on the agenda is get a poll taken to canvas opinion from those interested in the issue (likely an on-line one in seabreeze would meet the criteria) and - the big one -- sound out the UK organisation to gauge their interest in the potential affiliation.

I know we have the capacity to develop and ultimately get a training structure of our own (likely get a Commonwealth grant to help achieve this..) - but realistically we do not have more than a grass roots splintered organisation. There are a number of reasons for this and is not intended as a critic of AKSA or anyone else. Back to the point having a solid recognised and organic training regieme. As mentioned above by Trant - we would benefit from the suggested association.

I am totally for it..

well it's better than the alternative!

"your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries."

theDoctor said...

Kitepower Australia said...

AKSA should draw on the knowledge base of the pioneers of our sport to help formulate a training standard, etc.

....pioneers like Alex Sanz...?

why did you have to bring up his name!

Put down the rum and go to bed doctor....patients orders!!

or just teach for beer...


.... works for me

Sleep in Rowdy?

sir ROWDY said...

I don't sleep... Just lurk.

or loiter

maybe a bit of dithering.

DANEgerous said...

I've been thinking about getting an IKO qualification as I intend to do some travelling over the next few years and imagine it would make me more employable (to kite schools). I would probably never teach in Aus though as I get paid well doing other work. If an AKIA was set up, do you think schools around the world (europe) would recognize it? Do school around the world require (current) IKO certification to employ you? Any thoughts on this?

I do realize that doing something like an IKO course would be essential to improve my ability to teach.

x2
except that i would like to have the option to teach in Aus.
Dumb Question but is it a neccessity to have the IKO approval to teach or is it more that the local council etc needs you to be accredited etc or just have the public liability insurance ?
Can i put an ad in the local paper and as long as i have the relevant insurance is that enough for me to have council approval to teach ? Does the council have the right to approve it or is it up to the IKO ?
It seems that the IKO dont have the insurance anymore anyway.
Every morning i drive past the many "personal trainer/boot camp guys" using the same beach where i would like to teach Kiting .Do they have to be affiliated with whoever is deemed their IKO equivalent to be able to use a public beach ? Do they need council approval ?
It is a PUBLIC BEACH
I guess what i am asking is what you really , legally need to be able to set up a teaching type thing .Is it up to each individual council or can the long reach of the IKO get you to stop ?
Who determines how it works ?
My head hurts..

Hi Robertnaish,

To legally teach you need several pieces of paper:-

1. You need to have some form of recognised accreditation (In Oz, thats IKO, but could be BKSA)

2. You need to have insurance to the tune of between $10M-$20M (Depending upon council, the amount varies but minimum is $10M and again depending upon council, you need to have an approved insurance company not an offshore insurer). IKO Insurers were not recognised by JCC so I had to get an Australian underwriter.

3. You then need the councils approval and permits to operate a business in a public Place. Called a TIPP (Trading In Public Places) License. If you operate your business on Public or council lands, you need it! (Fines are Like $5000 first offense). All those PT's you speak of should have legitimate permits from council. I'd say if one does, they all will.

4. You also require permits from the relevant waterway authority (In WA it is D.E.C. or Dept. Environ. and Conserv.), in NSW it would be Waterways. This may or may not be necessary, need to check with your relevent authority.

If you have an accident teaching and don't have relevent permits, you are deemed to be operating/trading in contravention to the law which null and voids your insurance. So realistically, if you teach illegally, you may as well save money on insurance coz it wont help you anyway. INsurance costs anywhere between $3000 and $5000 p.a. and that is soley Third Party. Other insurances are also sensible and are cost Plus.

Disclaimer: I am not advocating teaching without permits or insurance. Do it properly or don't do it at all.

This is why there aren't too many legal schools Australia wide. I believe of the 8 or 9 schools in Perth area, only 5 are legal to my knowledge. Up to you to guess which are which. [}:)]

Cheers,

DM

the skipper said...


Possibly good to clarify that if you wish to occupy Council land and solicit services such as Watersports tuition and accept money onsite then you require permits etc.

As far as i know in Australia as we know it, you can accept money in a commercial premises and impart your skills in the great outdoors, Whether it be outdoor bbqing, fishing techniques, rollerblading etc.
Most serious operaters would choose to be insured however paying fees to offshore schemes for insurance for any Aussie business would take a lot of trust unless there was also cash to be made out of it.

To sum it up.

This is Australia, anyone can teach piano, hunting pigs, macrame, and tree climbing skills if they don't nuisance the public.

A large operation accepting money on council space is a different issue looking at it from the outside. My 2c.

You require a permit to USE public space for commercial purposes regardless of where the transaction occurs and you need to insure your customers for any risk to them and caused by them in a public space.

All insurance goes to offshore insurance companies.

I have recieved another email today.

30 days to go, if I pay up I can have my licence for another 2 years without any further contact from IKO.

Again no mention of level 2, cep's or any other requirements,

Will keep you posted.

I had a bit of a whinge to iko and called them a bunch of money grabbing opportunists.

Their email back was not so nice but has a confidentiality clause attached.....

wankers!