not sure if i got lucky kiting there today, but i had a mad session there kiting up closer to the pier, having the whole spot btween 2 of us for over an hour. even when it got more crowded, the vibe was good, everyone giving each other space

Apparently there were 2 guys body dragging up in the advanced area yesterday as well as the usual couple of beginners. I drove past about a month ago and saw a kite caught on a yacht and two guys absolutely struggling near the pier.

What I loved about the sport when i started was that there was no localism, everyone helped everyone it was a real golden time, similar to when surfing started, or when I started snowboarding at Hotham in 92, when there were only 15 boarders on the hill.

Now that the doors have opened for kiting and it is a lot safer than 5 years ago, every bogan can have a go, and we are now seeing these guys rear there ugly head in the sport. Beginners giving lip to other kiter's after being told that they are acting dangerously in an area where kiter's are trying some big tricks. While 100m up the beach another newbie is getting a lesson from a dude talking on his mobile the whole time! Can't wait until next week when he thinks he can kite where all the good guys are!

I avoid StKilda pretty much all the time now, but it annoys me how much i used to love kiting there and it only take one little incident to ruin a day's kiting. I think some of these newbies need to settle down, pay their dues, learn to read other kiter's probable movements and make kiting a more enjoyable experience by sticking to their limits. Getting lifted 5 feet off the water does not make an advanced kiter sorry!

I can't believe there is attitude at Dolls coming from good riders.... I can't remember the last time I saw a good kiter out there.

JEFFERSON said...

I can't believe there is attitude at Dolls coming from good riders.... I can't remember the last time I saw a good kiter out there.

They're often hard to see on really sunny days - the light shining off all that tinsel is really quite distracting.

No seriously, I've seen some good riders at Dolls recently - pulling tricks right in front of the beach, unhooked, displaying the regulation amount of crack. With predictable results. After all, if it weren't for all those beach-nannas tut tutting and sucking air in through their teeth like a row of jet turbines, it'd only be about 13 knots on any given day.

If I've not been banned or at least bollocked once every session at Dolls by the straight-legged crimson-face brigade, then I just don't feel like I've been out....

Thing is though, I don't mind to odd bollocking at Dolls. When push comes to shove, I hardly ever ride there, and so I think the locals are entitled to tell me what to do - it's their spot and they wear it worst if kiting gets banned. I happen to think they are overzealous and drunk on power, but if that's how they roll in Sydney, so be it!

I think it is really sad that the topic of 'locals' and 'advanced' versus 'newbee' riders is cropping up so often in the forums.

I am an absolute newbee, and make no appologies for that. I try my hardest to stay away from the masses, but when you're set up in a clear stretch of beach, it is hardly my fault if someone then comes and rides right alongside. I was recently kiting so at no point was I within 200 meters of the regular kiting area at my local beach. Next thing I know, one of the 'locals' (and sponsored team rider) decides to use me as a turning poast, at one stage riding over the toe of my board!

I, like others in this thread, am a passive guy, but I can tell you I struggled not to ark up at the kid. Sure he could pull tricks and sure he didnt have to pay for his own gear, but I really dont see the point in crowding out a newbee. After all, we are the ones who buy your second hand gear and let you, or your team boss, afford the latest of everything.

Settle down and let us all enjoy the wind, especially if we have made the effort to stay out of your way.

Its not about advanced riding, its about cooks that are still learning the basics getting caught up with guys and girls that ride at a much faster pace. Think about it. Nothing worse than someone riding at you with a poo man stance and bad edge control, you never know what there thinking

Some people just dont get it

Actualy there is something worse and thats an overconfident rider, teabagging down the line towards you way out of controll and way overpowered after trying a trick at the wrong time and place.

Sounds like you dont get it either , its about mutual respect bro, read the first post!

Wookster said...

JEFFERSON said...

I can't believe there is attitude at Dolls coming from good riders.... I can't remember the last time I saw a good kiter out there.

Here here

To the older arrogant d!ckhead riding a red Rebel (10 or 12m) a couple of weeks ago who almost kitelooped into me then had the nerve to have a go at me you could do right by getting your head out.

I must clarify this - I am talking about St Kilda. To the old arrogant fart on the red Rebel who told me I "had to know what I was doing here" after not looking where he was going. What a tosser. You know who you are.

Wookster said...

JEFFERSON said...

I can't believe there is attitude at Dolls coming from good riders.... I can't remember the last time I saw a good kiter out there.

Here here

To the older arrogant d!ckhead riding a red Rebel (10 or 12m) a couple of weeks ago who almost kitelooped into me then had the nerve to have a go at me you could do right by getting your head out.

Can't think who that is, but I do remember seeing a red Rebel there over the last few weeks, I'll keep an eye out for them, thanks for the heads up.

You must not have seen me out there if you think there are no good kiters at Dolls!
Or maybe I'm a good kiter, who is not so good at kiting??

Sometimes when the beach is not crowded the younger ones creep in closer to throw trick in the smooth water behind the groin, but that practice is really stomped on by the local crew now if there are any swimmer and beachgoers around, even lots of kiters.

There is a reasonably vocal local group, and I'm happy to say I'm one of them who will approach anyone who is acting kooky, always friendly at first, but we get on your case very fast if you don't listen.

Cya and

Goodwinds

Steve

Wookster said...

Wookster said...

JEFFERSON said...

I can't believe there is attitude at Dolls coming from good riders.... I can't remember the last time I saw a good kiter out there.

Here here

To the older arrogant d!ckhead riding a red Rebel (10 or 12m) a couple of weeks ago who almost kitelooped into me then had the nerve to have a go at me you could do right by getting your head out.

I must clarify this - I am talking about St Kilda. To the old arrogant fart on the red Rebel who told me I "had to know what I was doing here" after not looking where he was going. What a tosser. You know who you are.

Just a question for you Wookster, what level of kiter are you?

I ask this because of lot of beginners go into the advanced area and just stand there with their kite at 12 O'clock, thinking they are 100% in the right and that everyone needs to avoid them and anyone that says something to them is in the wrong. What you noobs need to understand is that it is a very small area there and that by you having your kite at 12 O'clock just makes it smaller, the average line length is 25m, which means that we all need to be at least 30m clear of you in a very small area, and the fact you are just standing there makes it even smaller.

Isn't it funny that all the complaining has come from noobs, while the guys who have been kiting for a while are merely pointing out etiquette and kite safety. For those from other states that jump in here without fully appreciating the situation, it is the equivalent of noobs body dragging from West to East along the flat section at Woodies, and standing there with their kites at 12 o'clock while you guys race in to do all your tricks in the flat water, then when you ask the guys to keep the area allocated to beginners getting told to f&*^ off you tosser, a bit rough, and a safety hazard.

Kitepower Australia said...

There is a reasonably vocal local group, and I'm happy to say I'm one of them who will approach anyone who is acting kooky, always friendly at first, but we get on your case very fast if you don't listen.

Cya and

Goodwinds

Steve

That’s bull****. The basic attitude at dolls point is aggressive and selfish. They are just a bunch of tosser without any reason because most of the guys are just doing very basic tricks. So no reason for being unfriendly and arrogant to anybody.

Those guys do not need priority rules they are just cutting off everybody who is in their way even if they have no right of way and Steve I have seen you doing this as well just in order to get the last inch of upwind and forcing other rider going downwind.

Just to make this clear. On the water you have to keep RIGHT not LEFT!

So... you think that those folks are always friendly at first.... Just from one of your last posts:

"I did see something strange in the distance last night looked like a Wipika classic so rode down for a look, there are these kooks flying what looked like a 6.5, on a beach that was less than 10M wide, and they were jammed up one end approx 10M from a rock groin, they could no have picked a worse spot to fly it.
Some guy was giving a lightweight girl a lesson and having to hang on to her harness to stop her from slamming the concrete wall in front of them - amazing stuff."

That is not friendly at all and abusive even if the intention of your post might be right. Why didn't you stop and ask those guys to land the kite and go somewhere else. Instead of that you backstabbed and exposed this action here in the forum in a very offensive manner. That’s **** and cowardly. Especially as a local shop owner it should be in your interest to keep the sport at your closest spot in a positive and good mood...

You should do a survey and ask ALL sydney kiter what they think about you and the dolls point tosser crew attitude. You will be surprised about the result. Most people I have met around Sydney do not like this crew because of this bull**** localism and their behavior.

And what’s that **** about the flat water behind the groin. I have read a lot of your posts and you have told everybody to mind this area its dangerous blablabla...... In the rare occasion I have seen you kiting there in fluky winds I could see you riding closer to the groin as anybody else!

Do you need more examples??? Here is one more: I saw one of the soooo "friendly" local Dolls crew flying his kite while staying on the beach as close as possible in front of an obviously non-local to give him a blast of his wind shadow by purpose. The kite fell out of the sky onto the footpath. Another local grabbed the kite and dragged it down the beach without any comment. After that he told him to keep downwind and away from the groin flat water spot because this is advanced kiter/locals only.

More Examples? Ok only one last:
A beginner close to the water line ditched his kited into the water and tried to relaunch it. A so called local came up and just pulled the QR without any word and told the guy to go downwind because the upper end is for the advanced only and he should back up. The poor beginner had to sort his lines for the next 30 minutes and packed up. Very Friendly!

Some more? Go to the beach next weekend and have a close look what’s going on.

Is this the kind of stuff you discuss in your south sydney kiteboarding club (should be renamed into south Sydney dolls point tosser club)..... How to keep away any new and non local kiter? Do you have practice lessons how to ditch kites of other people and do you discuss strategies like "The ditch and drag"-Move?

Very nice. I can tell you what it worked in my case I have stopped kiting at this unfriendly ****ty spot but can only warn any beginner and non local not to go there.

There are much better spots to go and I can only hope that your behavior and attitude at the south end of botany bay does not end up in a ban for the whole bay!

And finally I am happy that I am not part of this crew because there are so many really nice and friendly people kiting around sydney and the south coast.

The Lazy Lobster who will go surfing now (but not at maroubra)

kiter789 said...

Just to make this clear. On the water you have to keep RIGHT not LEFT!

Funny - every now and then i hear someone say this, and it surprises me. I've kited all over the place and people on the water always seem to go for the upwind/downwind rule on the water. The only time i have ever seen the port/starboard rule in action was racing in the US. It seems kind of crazy to have the upwind person have to lose all their ground downwind just to obey a shipping rule...

I'm sure there'll be a stupidly fierce response to this, but it still surprises me..

IKO right of way rules state:

When two kiter's converge the rider who's left hand is foreward (starboard) of the direction of travel has right of way over the kiter that who is comming from the other direction (port tack). Therefore the kiter that has right of way stays on the same course.
Note that this is for 2 kiters converging i.e. neither kiter is more upwind than the other.

When passing each other, the kiter upwind must place his kite high and the down wind rider must place his kite low.

oops, confusing left and right again - should have paid more attention in grade 1 thanks for the correction.

sillsymark said...

Kited at St Kilda this arvo. Everyone was friendly. DOES EVERYONE ELSE HAVE TO AVOID YOU GUYS BECAUSE YOU ARE CRAP.? DOes EVERYONE ELSE have to WEAR your STUPID INEXPERIENCED mistakes and risk getting flogged becuase you DONT LOOK?
**** that. I'm telling the dickheads to piss off down the beach from now on.

Stay out of the fast crowded spots until people stop staring at you like your a ****stick. Or you are one.

Looks like everyone was friendly down there except for you pal. [}:)]

Well done for disgracing yourself in public - but something tells me your used to it. You should move to Sydney and kite at Dolls Point - Reckon you would fit right in !

Would have to agree that that isn't the best attitude to have out there, espcially at StKilda its packed (have i said this before) and full of riders of all levels, if you are better just avoid the newbs and kooks... its easy, and maybe even help one out occasionally, it'll help keep the beaches safe. Maybe?

sounds like the adage "too many surfers in the line up". The beauty of surfing is you can easily tell guys the rules, if you can't handle the reef break and your dropping in on the shoulder you will be told, or worse depending on how serious it is.

Problem here is the space kites take up, it's hard to talk to another kiter whilst flying a kite and many new kiters have never surfed and have no idea about "rules".

If I go to a new place the first thing I do is talk to the local crew, find out the way the place 'works', otherwise you end up with a pile of **** like this.

I suggest beginners or anyone going to a new spot should do some homework and talk to the locals. It's for everyones benefit, when your up to speed you'll have a nice area to go and rip up, or in surfing terms you'll be dropping into 6ft beasts smacking the lip and spraying the guys that cheer as you go past (whilst they hold the leg rope of the newbie trying to drop in on you)

FFS. [}:)]