I keep hearing people talk about delta kites. A year ago I had never heard of a delta kite. Excuse my ignorance but can somebody explain exactly what a delta kite is? and how it differs from hybrid/bow style and c shaped kites.

cheers

My best description of a Delta kite is... The Delta kite is a modern C kite. It has a C shape leading edge, which gives it more of a forced frame. I do think that a true Delta kite has a pinched wing tip, for example,( F-one Bandit, Air Rush DNA, North Nova.) If you look at the image of these kites you will see that the leading edge & wing tip generally comes to a point. The rear lines are attached to this point & the front lines are attached to a bridle leading to the front sides & centre of the kite. This allows the kite to have full depower whilst giving you the low down grunt & power of a traditional kite. But due to the fact that the leading edge & trailing edge meet at the rear attachment line these Delta kites generally have a heavier bar, not so much in the turning but you have to hold the power on. Now there are kites supposedly called Delta, but I would say they are a Delta hybrid or a second generation Delta. These kites are similar except they have a curved wing tip, where the leading edge rolls backward to meet the trailing edge. For eg. (North Rebel, Core GT, Lou Wainman Rabbit series "currently my favorite free style kite" & the new Noble N62 or 3, GN Mr Fantastic "what were they thinking") This tends to give them lighter bar pressure. All Delta kites are the best relaunch kites & generally won't twist up or get stuck in the surf, a Delta when dropped on the water will always move to one side of the window & sit on its wingtip waiting to be relaunched, all other kites generally will lay leading edge down in the water & you have to roll the kite over to relaunch to the side of the window, they do fly differently to other kites if you have only flown bows or hybrids you probably won't like them at first. They have a very direct feel & are quite responsive to the bar & to the bar pressure & turning. Whereas the bow kites maybe considered smoother, less twitchy, in my opinion no real on off power, more progressive power (smooth), generally lighter on the bar & are great kites for girls. The hybrid, like a bow but with the punch of a Delta or C kite, maybe not as much power in the same size kite as a Delta but a great progressive kite. So many to choose from, I'm not going to go there.
But hey Bennie, see if you can find someone or a shop that does F-one & try a Bandit compared to another brand bow or hybrid. These products I have mentioned are products I am familiar with but I am sure there are many others to review.

I believe delta C's are for beginners.

getfunky said...


Er.. not sure if slave is having a laff but the Core GT 7m I flew would probably be more for intermediate at least. It's not badly behaved by any stretch, but kn fast, so for the more experienced brigade.


BTW - Is the SS Turbo 3 really a Delta bow?

name a 7m kite that isn't fast

I thought the same thing... As soon as you unhook 'Bar pressure' is irrelevant...

A lot of Wake guys are going to the Deltas because they've got that C kite style power and very direct steering etc.

TheChad said...

bennie said...

You say deltas have more bar pressure than hybrids. That would make them less than ideal for unhooking.

I don't quite get the theory behind that statement?

If a kite has a lot of bar pressure it means the back lines are taking a higher percentage of the total force than the back lines of a kite with low bar pressure.

Once you un-hook, all the force of the kite is through the bar, meaning bar pressure is irrelevant.

Is there something i'm missing?

If you think thats the case, try max depower your kite so the back lines are slack and then unhooked and see how it feels. Back line pressure does still affect the kite when you unhook. There is still a different amount of pressure going through the center of the bar vs. the ends of the bar.

sir ROWDY said...

you mean toenails?

sle, bows, delta, hybrids

all toenails

hehe

bennie.
Q?/ But if they have on/off power characteristics, that doesnt sound very "c" like to me.
A/ The rear lines are attached to this point & the front lines are attached to a bridle leading to the front sides & centre of the kite. This allows the kite to have full depower whilst giving you the low down grunt & power of a traditional kite.

Q?/ You say deltas have more bar pressure than hybrids. That would make them less than ideal for unhooking.
A/ the leading edge & trailing edge meet at the rear attachment line these Delta kites generally have a heavier bar, not so much in the turning but you have to hold the power on. "if you ride unhooked, TheChad's got it sussed"
Q?/ also they have more on/off power. That would make them good wave kites.
A/ Yes & No. I like light bar pressure & not so much kite when I surf kite. or I will use a small Delta dwon two sizes 7 use my board & the wave more.
Q/I dont understand how they have more power than a bow if they dont have a flat section in the canopy?
A/ low down grunt & power of a traditional kite" Can some one explain how a C projects it's self in the wind window yo a bow? it would take me for ever.
Q/ Is it mainly wave riders using them? what are the other advantages/disadvantages over bow/hybrids? how does the wind range on a delta compare to a bow/hybrid?
A/ I sell them to beginners, or heavy riders that want a powerful kite with a big wind range, or riders that want to progress faster with easy relaunch..

bennie, Have you had a go on one yet? If so what do you think?

sckitesurf, thanks for taking the time to answer my Q's.

Q/I dont understand how they have more power than a bow if they dont have a flat section in the canopy?
A/ low down grunt & power of a traditional kite" Can some one explain how a C projects it's self in the wind window yo a bow? it would take me for ever.

The 12m sb3 that I currently ride has has much grunt and power as my old 15m C kite and vastly more power than any 12m C kite I have ridden. the extra power generated by the flat section producing more projected area as opposed to a C kite. Hence my question.

Kitehard said...
I rode lefts and rights in Sou' westers because I could, everyone else went left cause they had no alternative.

lol. ^^^
You crack me up.
Errrr......
What's so groundbreaking about wavekiting upwind on righthanders in junk surf ?
Gumbies ride waves upwind, they ride straight into the breeze cause it's slow and safe (and limiting).
I gather you're on your toeside when going right....
cause you ride tweak on the lefts.
Sure, it can be an amusing alternative......
but if you really want to smash the cake,
you need to bearaway on your frontside and HIT it.

Waveslave-If you try to rubbish Kitehard everytime he makes a comment it makes you look like you are his biatch.

So predictable, even more than the wind we have had this year.

Let it go man.

Erm.. so is the SS T3 a bow or a delta or a bastard offspring of the two?

Haven't seen one in the flesh but the T2 looks pretty straight out bow to me yet SS say the T3 is delta bow... a mystery

getfunky said...

Erm.. so is the SS T3 a bow or a delta or a bastard offspring of the two?

Haven't seen one in the flesh but the T2 looks pretty straight out bow to me yet SS say the T3 is delta bow... a mystery

Oops - answered on the other thread.

T3 = bow - not delta as such.

Use of the term delta is a marketing gimmick, devised to sound alluring and attractive to us wannabee kiters.
Delta wing shape means "triangle shape", don't beleive me then just google delta wing.

The kites being marketed under the Delta name, whether its delta C or just plain delta, even delta bow, whatever, none of them are true delta or delta wing shaped kites.

Delta wing shaped kites look like your traditional pointed nose stunt kite or even kiddies single line kite derr!!
www.kitepower.com.au/
First item on that page.

Sorry you have all swallowed the latest guff to make you loosen your wallet.

So moving on from the name.
The style of kite being sold as a delta is a bow derivative, and if you look at any of the early legainoux designed bows, they all had very swept back leading edges and some did meet the trailing edge at a pointed angle.

I think one of the defining things (apart from the planform or shape of the canopy LE and TE combo) about a so called delta style kite is that they do not have a connecting bridle line from the front bridles to the rear lines or rear line bridle.
That is they do not load share with the rear lines except through the canopy itself, and this is the primary reason why the bar pressure is higher than some bows and hybrid bows
All the so called delta style kites I have seen have a forward mounted simple bridle to support the front half to two thirds of the leading edge tube. This bridle is simple and long allowing the kite to depower 90+% when tension on the rear lines is released and all of the so called delta kites I have seen rely on this feature for emergency depower - that is the safety works on both front lines.

There is nothing really C shaped about so called deltas, someone else nailed that when they said the shape has a high projected area (but at first glance it does not look like it). Some of them do have relaunch issues, especially when directly downwind this is more true of the first gen delta kites. I still see them swum in regularly, although more experienced users have more success, they are still difficult to relaunch especially at the lower end of their wind range.
They are all hungy for apparent wind in order to generate their maximum lift, in other words they need to be ridden fast to get max performance, another reason they suit intermediate and upwards riders IMO.
Begginers with good board and kite skills do well on them though.

Open your eyes, don't beleive all the hype and "special name" gimmickry, surely you've all seen enough of that by now?
The shape works, theere are + and - in the design and it does not suit everyone.

Many designers have gone out of their way to make a kite that is a certain percentage different to the original bow designs, yet still having most of the bow style depower and wind range, so called delta kites are the market leader at the moment, in being "different". :-)

Could say more but I'm tired and going horizontal now.
Bandidos and Core Combat GT are the best designs with the best performance and safety systems that I have seen.
T3 is not a delta its a pure bow derivative, look at the bridle and even the fact that it comes 2:1 (can convert to 1:1)

Cya and

Goodwinds

McDeltaforce

Kitepower Australia said...

Use of the term delta is a marketing gimmick

I totally agree, unfortunately the term 'bow' is almost a dirty word in the kiting community, so the people marketing these products have to come up with something different.

Kitepower Australia said...

Open your eyes, don't beleive all the hype and "special name" gimmickry, surely you've all seen enough of that by now?

hmmm... remember a recent cabrinha development!

Hey Guys,

I fail to see why everyone needs to be able to put a label on things before they are happy.

Imagine if there were no names for kites and you just had to try one to decide if you like it? Gees! you might even end up flying the right kite for you instead of buying some dweebs marketing hype and then you go spruking the kite which doesn't really do what you want, but you need to justify your purchase in order to feel good about it and to conform with what others are saying about the kites. I know soooo many people who do this.

Putting a label on a kite instantly pidgeon holes it into an expected performance category. Unfortunately most of the kites I have tried are very inconveniently not the same in flying characteristics, so this means a name is not necessarily a good indicator of what the kite is about. Does this make sense?

So much BS in this industry, everyone's kites are the shiznit, just read their websites, there are no bad kites! ...... until of course you actually buy one. Then you do the justify thing and try and rationalize the good parts when you really know deep inside it is crap but keep saying that it's great because everyone else says they are. Then the crowd all decide, no they really are crap and you also can then voice what you've known all along and the kites become crap.

Forget the names, distrust the hype from shops, manufacturers, magazines and websites, reviews and forums too, because guys are doing the justification thing. Some know what they are talking about, but you won't know which ones because they each put up reasonable arguments. I don't even expect you to believe my reviews or thoughts, lets just put them all down as entertainment.

The only way you'll know if you like a kite is to TRY IT FIRST!

Good winds,