wind resistance (2-4mm is quite thick)

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Originally posted by hosko

wind resistance (2-4mm is quite thick)

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Thats so funny . It makes as much difference as some dude sneezing on the beach,. A kite company tried using that one once to justify using thinner lines, when the reality was they were saving pennies. Bloody Pikies.

Carry a small stick and loop the larks heads around it as you take them off the pigtails. When you wind/unwind your lines, they wont tangle.

drm, I think you're onto something with the stiffer lines, Ozone's say their new lines are stiffer for this reason.

"Flying Lines - New for all our 2007 kites land and water is a new Dyneema line that is thinner and also stiffer due to a better coating technique. The thinner lines still retain the 300kg breaking strain so we have gained performance thanks to less parasitic drag as the lines fly through the air. The stiffer lines are also a lot easier to handle and do not tangle easily making your rigging time hassle free."

If the topic is tangled lines, as it started off at, I always say a good pack down makes for an easier set up!
I rarely have any probs with tangles!

So bite me!

to be tangle free, just wind up on your bar nice an tight walking towards kite an then disconect lines from kite when you get there
an no tangles
If you disconect lines then wind up .....Tangles when you setup next time.

My experience with Q line is that it is crap. Too stiff to separate easily as you walk the lines to the kite. I got rid of it as soon as I could for other lines that separate better with the wind helping as I walk downwind. Sounds like a good idea to wind up the lines before disconecting at the kite. I haven't tried that.

blownaway speaks word of wisdom

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Originally posted by hosko
i'm sure you're very smart though oakie and would like to justify your comment?

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Thank you Hosko, I am, you've obviously heard the rumours.

There was no dissing meant and yes, you are right - the drag on the lines does have an effect - the figures are easy to work out. But the thing to keep in perspective is that reduction in drag generated by thinner lines is weeny - negliable, compared to that of the board and kite in the first place. Changing the edging angle of the board by a very small amount would have a far greater effect of the toal drag than any change in line diameter.

I thought it was pretty funny that a kite company used it as a marketing point though??

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Originally posted by drm

I always seem to struggle with line tangles, and I was thinking about ways in which they could be avoided.

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If you haven't found a solution.. Easy [}:)]

Have a 4 pack of Smirnoff double black ice vodka =or/and= a 6 pack of beer AND untangle away

If worse comes to worse, have another 6 pack and repeat each night until problem solved.

I've been using a method/habit, for the past 2 seasons, and it has saved me much time at setup... and a sh!te load of dramas. It's good for 4 and 5 line set-ups.

For pack-up:

1. Wrap your bar with the lines still attached to the kite. Wrap the depower and leaders so that the lines will be as equal as possible.

2. Take each line off the kite in turn, starting at one tip and work to the other, and larks-head them to a 60-75cm length of 3-6mm cord as you take them off. Tie a knot in one end of the cord, to stop the flying lines slipping off. (A thicker cord is easier to handle after a session, when your hands are soggy and numb.)

4. Half-hitch the lines at each end of the bar, or use the little elastic loops provided, continue past the lines and tie the cord to the bar too. (This is good because it stops the ends of your lines flapping around, this is where most tangles will come from.)

For set-up: (after the kite is pumped)

1. Untie the cord from the bar. Drop the cord on the ground, with the flying lines still attached, and walk out your lines.

2. Lay your bar on the ground, and walk back to the kite. The front (2 or 3) lines between your legs, the back lines on the outside of your legs. Use the fingers of one hand to comb out any twist/wraps in the lines, and the other hand to tension the lines in front of your combing hand.

3. When you get to the cord, at the end of the lines, take each line off in turn. Start at one tip (rear line) of the kite and work toward the other, only taking one line off the cord at a time, as it's being connected to the kite.

4. Larks-head the cord to the handle/strap on your kite bag/pump.

Doing this (or similar) ritually will reduce your chances of kooking or knotting your lines to very low. This method almost eliminates the lines becoming twisted too.

Enjoy, and kite more.

The best tangle free lines would be magnets. they would completely not tangle. They may be a bit on the heavy side though....

Bloody engineers , cant leave anything alone. Ill give you some marks for the maths though, quite correct - even the drag factor, good lad. Now, without getting into a 'downwind for dummies' (if you've got three days of you life spare, read this thread http://www.kiteforum.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2329828&highlight=), you forgot the following.

If were talking about thinner lines, then we need to look at the difference in drag, not the total - lets make some simple assumptions - thick i.e. stiffer lines are 4mm, thin lines are 2-3mm? Worst case, the variation is 2mm, so the addtional drag from thicker lines equates to 20N or 2kgs.

Also, remember that this does not have a direct effect on the kite end of the lines, but is distributed along the entire length of the lines, plus the fact the while your moving, the wind is not hitting the lines at a perpendicular angle. And thats not even going into apparent wind.

Conincedently, I sneezed while I was on the scales this morning, and was exactly 2 kilos lighter than yesterday. You'll have to shout me a beer some time and I'll impart some other pearls of wisdom. Honestly, when I know Im right, I'm such an arse.

Now back to the original topic - if your setting up using 4 lines and that includes bowmosexuals, attach the 2 front lines before you unwind your lines, then once the bar is out and the lines are laid flat, put some tension on the lines. Walk the backies out and you're away. This is by far the quickest and error free method.

shudddddup a ya mouth!!!!

I just larkshead the lines together too, if the cord I normaly use isn't handy, but using the cord makes it even less likely to tangle.

Horses for courses, as they say, but the general concensus is to secure the ends of your lines to reduce tangles.

You can rush out and buy the newest toy for A$80+ish, use a piece of scrap cord, or larkshead them together... Just do it, and set-ups are less problematic.

P.S. Do the same with your bridle ends (on bridled kites) and reduce twists and tangles there too.