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Flysurfer Speed 5

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Created by jamesperth > 9 months ago, 22 Jan 2016
jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
22 Jan 2016 1:18PM
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You may have seen that overnight Flysurfer has released the 5th generation of their “Speed” series of kites.

This series is now in its 10th year, and each new release has continued to build and improve on the last.

The SPEED5 is designed to deliver high all-round performance on any terrain – snow, land or water, and for every ability level. Like its predecessors, the SPEED5 offers high stability, light bar pressure, easy relaunch and a “triple depower” to ensure both novice and experienced riders have an incredible wind range in which to kite.

An higher aspect ratio (6.15 v 5.8 Speed 4) in combination with an optimized profile and rigid leading-edge foil technology increases jumping height and glide ratio compared to previous editions.

The Deluxe+ cloth is Flysurfer’s newest cloth material developed for the Speed 5. I was fortunate to fly the prototypes in October 2015 and felt the stiffer fabric resulted in a more direct bar feel, and increased the turning speed and responsiveness over the Speed 4 Lotus kites. This made jumping easier with longer hangtime, especially for those riders coming off LEI's. If you’ve flown the Sonic FR race kite, the new Speed will feel familiar but easier and more forgiving to fly.

The Automatic Drainage System allows water and sand to exit the kite without influencing performance.

SPEED 5’s also come with German made Liros lines, which offer equal breaking strength with reduced line diameter and thus less drag.

As with all Flysurfer kites, the SPEED 5 also comes with a 12 month free repair warranty. If you like all round free riding, big air and hang time, then the new Speed 5 should be on your radar and I’ll have demos here in WA in due course.

Kozzie
QLD, 1451 posts
22 Jan 2016 6:40PM
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holly ****balls that video is better with the mute button on. thats gotto be a contender for britney spears

got a link to some geeky specs for me cell counts chord lengths etc etc ? im interested

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
23 Jan 2016 8:28AM
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some information here : www.flysurfer.com/en/produkte/kites/speed5/#Technical%20Data

loftywinds2
185 posts
23 Jan 2016 2:25PM
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Self advertising and self-sponsored posts, should really be on their own forum section... Just sayin

Kozzie
QLD, 1451 posts
23 Jan 2016 5:04PM
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windranges

9m 11-33 knots 12m 9-26 knots 15..... 7 knots?? 19 .......5knots ??! 21m! 3 knots?!?

finally release a new bar! infinity v3 "airstyle cough gay cough control bar"

file:///C:/Users/David/Downloads/I3.0-Bar-Infosheet_Airstyle-vs-RacePro1.pdf

holly **** that is TERRIBLE!! i was kinda bit disappointed in general design being so similar to there old one i get it keep it simple and basic but jesus ****ing christ those lines are only rated for 160kg?!?! its been very very standard to have 250 rears 300 fronts or even 300 rears 500 fronts.... yeah there purpose is to reduce some parasitic drag with there new fancy lines but **** me they arent that strong! if i bought this kite first thing i would HAVE to do is replace all the lines i just cant risk it.

i do like the 21m lengths tho. should liven things up a bit.


just going thru the manual ... what the hells going on with GIN?!? first i hear they did "fones" new sonic race kite now theyve done flysurfers new leading edge.... for a company that declared themselves completely seperate from eachother (GIN kiteing / GIN paragliding) they seem to be getting a little more involved ay .... is this perhaps just part of a patentcy agreement ? you just have to use there patent then tag there name onto it or are gin actually getting there hands dirty with the design/production of these things?

looks like according to my calculations the 21m will weigh in at 4.2kgs.... hrmmmmnnnnn i was wondering about that "double stitching"

that puts it at the EXACT same weight (meter per meter) as a gradient golden 4 which is a robust sturdy wing......


<div>this cooooullllddd be the kite ive been looking for..... if its anything like there speed3 release will be months before they release the 21m >_<

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
24 Jan 2016 6:04PM
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Just to clarify

the Race bar comes with the cam cleat and 300/160 kg lines. Jumping is not recommended on these lines for obvious reasons.

The Airstyle bar has the pull / pull depower strap and 300/200kg flying lines.

www.flysurfer.com/en/download/17586/

( Just trying to get the information out there Lofty. It's not like there are FS dealers on every corner. Maybe some kiters want to find out where to demo something other than the most common brands. )

Kozzie
QLD, 1451 posts
25 Jan 2016 9:18PM
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jamesperth said..
Just to clarify

the Race bar comes with the cam cleat and 300/160 kg lines. Jumping is not recommended on these lines for obvious reasons.

The Airstyle bar has the pull / pull depower strap and 300/200kg flying lines.

www.flysurfer.com/en/download/17586/

( Just trying to get the information out there Lofty. It's not like there are FS dealers on every corner. Maybe some kiters want to find out where to demo something other than the most common brands. )


yep and just to clarify further ozonekites.com/products/control-systems/c4-v6-control-system/ 500 kg centers 300kg rears

Drury
NSW, 502 posts
26 Jan 2016 8:02AM
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Kozzie said..

jamesperth said..
Just to clarify

the Race bar comes with the cam cleat and 300/160 kg lines. Jumping is not recommended on these lines for obvious reasons.

The Airstyle bar has the pull / pull depower strap and 300/200kg flying lines.

www.flysurfer.com/en/download/17586/

( Just trying to get the information out there Lofty. It's not like there are FS dealers on every corner. Maybe some kiters want to find out where to demo something other than the most common brands. )



yep and just to clarify further ozonekites.com/products/control-systems/c4-v6-control-system/ 500 kg centers 300kg rears


Confirmed. I wouldn't want to be gliding off of a ridge with lighter lines.

Kozzie
QLD, 1451 posts
26 Jan 2016 1:26PM
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Drury said..


Confirmed. I wouldn't want to be gliding off of a ridge with lighter lines.


but there is less parasitic drag drurrrrrs well be falling quicker then a rock when a rear snaps when a bullet gust hits us hahahaha

but yeah 2 days to manilla xc ! once i get a 50k under the belt itll be time to finally start hacking up some wings and kites and make my parakite to free me from these damn hgfa fees / get out from under the casas umbrella

loftywinds2
185 posts
29 Jan 2016 8:55AM
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jamesperth said..

( Just trying to get the information out there Lofty. It's not like there are FS dealers on every corner. Maybe some kiters want to find out where to demo something other than the most common brands. )


All good mate. But some in here are unbelievable.

INTHELOOP
QLD, 1833 posts
29 Jan 2016 11:42AM
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can't wait to get my hands on the 9m and 12m Speed5s. BOOOOOST!!It will be interesting to see how they go at the Red Bull king of the air..

billtotal
QLD, 29 posts
31 Jan 2016 5:35PM
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Hi James, just wondering how the FS 5 9m will behave in the upper wind range with gusts. My Lotus 8m is surging forward in gusty conditions and is not really fun to fly in those conditions, unlike my FS 4 10m gust munching big air machine.

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
1 Feb 2016 3:49PM
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Hi Billtotal.

My 12m Speed 5 has just been delivered this afternoon but it will be a few days before I can ride it myself.

The surging you describe - can you give me a little more information ?

If it's surging only (not collapsing) then the first thing to check is the front / rear line length (all 4 lines equal with no depower on and bar sheeted in fully) . After 10 hours of use or so, Flysurfer state that you need to lengthen the rear lines a knot or so under the bar floats to compensate for the shrinkage that occurs during the bedding in process. A kite with too short rear lines could certainly exhibit stalling / surging characteristics in strong wind. I notice this first in light wind when I find myself having to pull on a lot of trim to stop back stalling - this is a sure indication the rear lines have shrunk and is easily fixed by lengthening the rear lines as described (or shortening the front lines on the Speed 2/3 series - there is an adjustable black rope above the trim strap for this reason)

If you are seeing the canopy collapse, then power up as it falls deep in to the window and surge forward again, then i would check the mixer AFTER making sure the front / rear line lengths are correct. Stock trim for Speed 4's is B&C equal when A=Z. Check your kite and reset if necessary. If you are already at a Neutral setting, then then shorten C by 0.5cm at a time, on both sides (ie move the knot towards the bar, away from the kite) and retest. This will increase stability of the canopy.

Let me know how you get on.

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
1 Feb 2016 6:29PM
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It's arrived !! First in, best dressed for demos.






Kamikuza
QLD, 2956 posts
2 Feb 2016 11:09AM
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Surging in gusts is normal. You can control it with the bar, but in those conditions you're better if with a less reactive kite like a tube...

INTHELOOP
QLD, 1833 posts
2 Feb 2016 8:22PM
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james you flown it yet????

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
3 Feb 2016 11:18AM
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Unfortunately not..... the day job is taking priority at the moment, and we've had quite a bit of wind around too. This weekend for sure - Sunday looks a better day for foiling. Might try the Twinnie on Sat if I can.

Loftywinds
QLD, 2060 posts
3 Feb 2016 9:38PM
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Does the FS Speed 5 only come in deluxe material now?

ps. Marvin... come on you love the FS Sonics. Speed 5 won't be for racing surely.

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
4 Feb 2016 11:24AM
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Yep, just the one fabric choice.

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
15 Feb 2016 3:18PM
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Right I've had 2 sessions on the Speed 5 so far - first was some LW foiling in about 12 knots & fading, and the second was yesterday afternoon on a strapless surfboard at South Trigg beach in a 20+ seabreeze. Flysurfer say the wind range on water for the 12m is 9-26 knots, I had too much power for wave riding really but was a good chance to see how it flies in a solid breeze. I'm 90 kgs for reference.

First impressions are the kite feels closer to the Sonic Race kites than the previous Speeds. The bar pressure feels slightly heavier than the Speed 4 (still light in comparative terms) but feedback is sharper. Everything happens a little bit faster than on the Speed 4 - the kite rotates quicker when turning and for me is easily fast enough to down loop on the 21m lines. I think the move to the Deluxe+ fabric has helped here. In addition to the higher AR, the canopy is also thinner in cross section than the Speed 4, and much less rounded / ballooney - Flysurfer have spent significant efforts to reduce creases and wrinkles in the cells (double cordwise ballooning) and the result is a much smoother aerofoil with better efficiency.

The canopy is super stable - what I noticed is when launching, like the Sonic FR, the center section fills quick quickly, and you need to actively backstall the kite to continue inflating and force the wingtips out. Once they fill however, that was was it - rock solid. This meant that with slack lines - either foiling downwind or bottom turning towards the kite, it seemed to hold it's shape in the air with more rigidity than than the previous generation. Maybe the kite has more internal pressure ?

I also noticed the leading edge has very little deformation in gusts - you could see the leading edge "square off" on my Speed 2 & 3's in gusts, but with the the stiffners in the leading edge, I couldn't notice this at all.

I can't comment on how it jumps & glides - not really had a chance in the 2 sessions I've had, but I'm guessing with the higher AR, hang time won't be a problem. I'm hoping to get a few more sessions this week ....

In conclusion the Speed 5 seems like a nice mix of Speed 4 Lotus and Sonic FR - very balanced and stable to fly, great depower and wind range, and impressive power & upwind performance.

Kamikuza
QLD, 2956 posts
15 Feb 2016 8:45PM
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Send a 15 to me, I'll tell you how it jumps :D

Love that purple!

Loftywinds
QLD, 2060 posts
16 Feb 2016 11:37AM
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Looks bloody long for a 12m

Kozzie
QLD, 1451 posts
16 Feb 2016 1:55PM
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jamesperth said..
In addition to the higher AR, the canopy is also thinner in cross section than the Speed 4, and much less rounded / ballooney - Flysurfer have spent significant efforts to reduce creases and wrinkles in the cells (double cordwise ballooning) and the result is a much smoother aerofoil with better efficiency.



the higher aspect ratio is literally the chord length


is this what you mean by thinner cross section?!? and what does ballooney mean?

and im unfamilular with "double cordwise ballooning" i know what chordwise means, basicly its just an expression you use when explaining the direction like a wind from the south is a southerly and if your talking about an aerofoil and your trying to say the 1meter section (chord) not the 12m section (span) you would say chordwise it is one meter.

all i could find was this

//Double Cordwise BallooningDouble Cordwise Ballooning is minimizing the creasing of the cells on the SONIC-FR to an absolute minimum. With exactly calculated arc-shaped panel cuts, double-stitched and glued seams a perfectly smooth, high performance airfoil is created.

couldnt find any other source other then from flysurfer possibly some patent nameing **** going on here. from what i can tell they just "discovered" the correct size of there cells and double stitched it..... not exactly new.....more like decades old....
with everything you do on a wing like adding twice as much glue and stitching it changes the weight. it seems they have done this so that they could have a higher pressure in the cells.

now a higher pressure in the cells is really going to limit there lifetime. i wouldnt be buying any of these bad boys second hand at all. or even a 4 year old new one thats never been used because that glue starts to go even in storage. it would be very integral to this kites structural rigidity.

all and all sounds ...... good.... i like the idea that you noticed there was so much pressure in there that the leading edge didnt flatten out. that will definitely help its flight characteristics. keen to see how they go in the larger sizes and the short lines have me excited but im thinking.... 21m on 10m lines chopping out the bar entirely and gerry rigging up some toggles.


get some ****ing jumps in or if shes light find a few dunes and do a couple hop and glides for me :D

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
16 Feb 2016 3:23PM
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That is a cracking diagram !

my comments about higher AR are self explanatory - it's the relationship between span and chord, so I'll leave it at that. AR is higher than the S4, but not as extreme as the Sonic.

With "thinner cross section" comment, I was referring to what is shown as "thickness" on the Side View airflow diagram. The Speed 5 is thinner than the Speed 4, which i believe reduces drag.

Now for my highly technical term "ballooney"..... :)

( I should have taken a picture of my S4 and S5 inflated next to each other at the beach, but the image below will be ok.)


What i wanted to highlight is the Speed 4 (and previous editions) have quite obvious 'corrugations' in the top and bottom skins due to the shape of the cell profiles - ie it's not a smooth surface like an airplane wing. If I interpreted Armin's comments correctly from his presentation in Montenegro, "Double Cordwise Ballooning" is a construction technique designed to minimize the corrugated effect, especially on the leading edge. When you look at a S4 & S5 next to each other, the difference in profile is quite noticeable. The goal overall is to improve the lift to drag ratio.

Porkyhorse
NSW, 23 posts
16 Feb 2016 6:47PM
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Any idea on Aus pricing yet lads?

Loftywinds
QLD, 2060 posts
16 Feb 2016 8:47PM
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Porkyhorse said..
Any idea on Aus pricing yet lads?


LOL... yeah pretty obvious question that should have been answered by now...

Picture this...

"Roll up... greatest kite ever (psstt until Speed 6 comes out of course), BUT my good man.. don't let a bargain go by without checking this beauty out...
It's got profile... oooh yeah... it's got speed.... aha..... it's good contours that leave the Speed 4 in ancient history.... oh and the price my good man!? Well it's only $3,600 !!!!"

Record scratch moment.

PRAWNDOG
WA, 306 posts
16 Feb 2016 7:22PM
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Tell him he's dreaming

jamesperth
WA, 504 posts
16 Feb 2016 8:29PM
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Lads. Pricing in AUD on my website right now.


www.specialistkiteboarding.com/#!product/prd1/4456161051/speed-5

Kamikuza
QLD, 2956 posts
17 Feb 2016 12:11AM
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Loftywinds said..

Porkyhorse said..
Any idea on Aus pricing yet lads?



LOL... yeah pretty obvious question that should have been answered by now...

Picture this...

"Roll up... greatest kite ever (psstt until Speed 6 comes out of course), BUT my good man.. don't let a bargain go by without checking this beauty out...
It's got profile... oooh yeah... it's got speed.... aha..... it's good contours that leave the Speed 4 in ancient history.... oh and the price my good man!? Well it's only $3,600 !!!!"

Record scratch moment.


Save yourself some money and get a Pansh for $100, so you don't feel so bad when you slam it into the water and blow all the cells out.Price is what it is--look at what you're getting. If you can't see that value, you should stay outa the thread ;)

Porkyhorse
NSW, 23 posts
17 Feb 2016 4:36AM
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jamesperth said..
Lads. Pricing in AUD on my website right now.


www.specialistkiteboarding.com/#!product/prd1/4456161051/speed-5



Bring on the quiver baby. Cheers mate.

INTHELOOP
QLD, 1833 posts
17 Feb 2016 9:19AM
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i like boosting a lot too and i maybe this puppy goes even bigger than the sonics ???



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"Flysurfer Speed 5" started by jamesperth