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Naish Pivot 8m 2018

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Created by pepeman 7 months ago, 13 Mar 2018
pepeman
SA, 110 posts
13 Mar 2018 8:00PM
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Hi all, just a little feedback on my new kite.
I am not affiliated with any kite brands and have been kiting hooked in for about 12 years.
I spend about the same amount of time on a surfboard as on a twintip.
So let's get to the Pivot and how it flys after about 7 or 8 sessions.
As you all would know the Pivot is marketed for both surf and twintip, as many kites are.
It's a medium aspect kite and sure enough it sits further back in the window at all times.
On my surfboard it's everything the marketing says it is ie. fast turns that don't generate power,
good drift and again sitting back in the window just where you want it, I'm loving it.
I think bottom end is not as good as marketing but top end great.
When I get on my twinny however I am not loving it.
I would be jumping to the moon on my Core XR and can hardly get off the water with the Pivot.
It seems it will never hit the zenith when sending it because it sits back in the window.
I am trying to get dialled in with this kite but jumping is just hard work compared to others.
So as has been said many times before one kite can not do it all and anyone interested in the Pivot should get it for its surf qualities and Naish already have a kite for outright surf so wtf I don't know.

Weta
WA, 777 posts
13 Mar 2018 9:14PM
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Mate really after 12 years kiting and you throw up this review. A kite any kite flys exactly the same regardless of the board you are riding. IT all comes down to your level of skill. The pivot generates heaps of power in the turns and boosts to the moon. I think it just won KOTA .

SaveTheWhales
WA, 1565 posts
13 Mar 2018 10:30PM
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Yep coming off the Xr5 your gonna be disappointed in the boost of anything wave orientated... cant have it all.

Kevin only used the Pivot in KOA for the board off "float".
Very easy to go big with strong wind and good ramps like that.
Put it on flatwater and then you see what it doesn't do..
Two very different kites not good for any comparisons..

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 7:03AM
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Yeah I realise that Pivot & XR are very different that's why I didn't name this topic Pivot v XR.
Although the XR was also originally marketed as a kite for both disciplines.
My main point is to express that in my opinion the Pivot leans way more towards surf and it does it great.
I hadn't seen anything up here on the Pivot and just trying to help anyone who can't demo gear.
I possibly finished a bit quick on what seemed like a negative above but I am not knocking this kite at all.
Just knocking the marketing which shouldn't say this kite is equally good in both disciplines.
Had a great wave last sesh on the Pivot with that many turns I lost count.
I will be keeping this kite as my surf/surfboard specific kite.

Richoa
NSW, 417 posts
14 Mar 2018 9:22AM
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pepeman said..
Yeah I realise that Pivot & XR are very different that's why I didn't name this topic Pivot v XR.
Although the XR was also originally marketed as a kite for both disciplines.
My main point is to express that in my opinion the Pivot leans way more towards surf and it does it great.
I hadn't seen anything up here on the Pivot and just trying to help anyone who can't demo gear.
I possibly finished a bit quick on what seemed like a negative above but I am not knocking this kite at all.
Just knocking the marketing which shouldn't say this kite is equally good in both disciplines.
Had a great wave last sesh on the Pivot with that many turns I lost count.
I will be keeping this kite as my surf/surfboard specific kite.


Havent ridden a pivot, but interested in contrast where do you put XR as a surf kite. I think not as kite pulls all the time with only drift whilst water bound in a current. But different styles see different things I guess

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 9:07AM
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Thanks "Save the Wales" for pointing out that Kevin's jumps on the Pivot were board off floats off massive ramps in high winds (by a professional of course)
I too had heard of these amazing jumps done by a pro on the Pivot.
This is one of the reasons I wanted to put this topic up because like many of us average punters out here in the real world this is not going to happen.
Maybe for "Weta" and other awesome kiters like him but IMO it's not a jumper.
Let us not forget it's great for kite surfing (not boarding)

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 9:43AM
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Hey Ricoha, I had been using the XR with surfboard and it's fine as a surf kite.
As you said you just have to allow for the extra grunt but this is achievable by depowering when required.
It will drift when you depower it to a point but tends to drop slowly as well, So needs to be tweaked up when it gets low.
Also a bit more pull though the turns but you get used to it. I rate the XR kite highly as an all rounder !
Not as good as the Pivot with the surfboard but on the flip side if the wind picks up you don't have swap kites to enjoy boosting on the twinny.

jgfoster
WA, 46 posts
14 Mar 2018 8:46AM
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Hey Pepeman . Ive seen people go big on the early pivots15s/16s. Maybe the 2018 have some different characteristics. Could it be slightly overtuned re sitting back in the window and powerless loops it could even be slalling ?. Maybe try de tuning, shorten front lines a fraction or lengthening the back lines. Not familiar with the naish set up but you will figure it out. Small adjustments and one set of lines at a time( front or back ) Worth a try mate , cheers jeff

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 12:46PM
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Thanks for your input Jeff, am happy to hear that you have seen some people go big on Pivots.
I don't think I have a tuning issue, but I will experiment with a little more and less trim than I would normally use to see if I can get dialed in to boosting this kite not that I bought this kite to boost.

Weta
WA, 777 posts
14 Mar 2018 12:06PM
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Hey Pepeman i am definitely not an awesome kiter and i dont Boost big as i ride strapless and haven't mastered the art yet so my comment above on boosting to the moon was unqualified. My comment was from having owned 2 x 2016 pivots so they may have been re-tuned/re-fined the kite slightly in the 2018 version. I found the 2016 pivot to generate too much power at times in the turns riding strapless. I'm now on the 2018 slash which has better drift than my 2016 pivots and slightly less grunt overall but my 7m is a mean ass biatch in anything over 28 knots. I'm getting a 5m next season for the those +30 knot days.

On the tuning i do ride with the back lines shortened one knot at the bar and i have also found the adjustments on the wingtips to make a difference.

thorn
WA, 172 posts
14 Mar 2018 12:07PM
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Hi Pepeman
I've had the 7, 9, 11, 14m Pivots since they started and now have the new ones. Prior to them I flew Ozone Edge kites which are awesome jumpers but pulled me off my edge when surfing and don't drift.
The Pivots surprised me in that I can jump nearly as high as the Edge, remains very controllable in the air and absorb the gusts well. The fact that it is a great wave kite makes it a good all rounder which is what I want.
The only difference between the new and old Pivots that I can notice, is that the canopy is a little stiffer on the new ones due to the Quadtex material. They all fly well.
I am just an intermediate kiter and my technique is simple. From 10 o'clock raise the kite as fast as you can while edging upwind to get as much tension in your lines as possible, at 12 o'clock sheet in and remain fully sheeted in till you nearly land.
If that is not working for you then Jeff's suggestion above about checking your lines may be your answer.
Don't give up on boosting with them as they are extremely capable.

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 3:09PM
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Hey Weta if you want a 5m for 30kn+ Strapless your awesome
I'm surprised to hear you say that you feel power generating during the turn of the Pivot but I guess it's what you are used to, and I'm used to the XR.
And wingtip settings are in the middle and not been moved but will have a go with them too.
Cheers.

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 3:29PM
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Nice to hear "thorn" that you are happy and are calling the Pivot an all rounder.
Edge's have similar characteristics to XR's so you've done a better job than me going to Pivots.

Macster
VIC, 210 posts
14 Mar 2018 5:27PM
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I had the 2016 Pivots. Average height, great hang time when jumping. Ended up going to the FX to do more looping and unhooking as i used to bend the pivot if i loaded it up too much no matter how much i pumped it up.

Use it for surf and freeride and you'll be happy as mentioned but dont try and push it too much into powered kite loops or freestyle.

wave6ft
QLD, 118 posts
14 Mar 2018 6:59PM
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pepeman said..
Nice to hear "thorn" that you are happy and are calling the Pivot an all rounder.
Edge's have similar characteristics to XR's so you've done a better job than me going to Pivots.


Ive not tried the xr but have an edge and a pivot if u say the edge is like an xr they arnt compatible kites to compare against one another anyway pivot is a good allrounder and boosts fine edge is great for boosting and upwind but not an allrounder

eppo
WA, 6582 posts
14 Mar 2018 5:00PM
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Hey pepeman. Can you thank me for my input.

Thanks.

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
14 Mar 2018 7:30PM
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Thanx for your input eppo, it's a real thread now cause you r da man.
Da man, da legend not to mention sometimes a sarcastic bast*#%.
Hey I feel a responsibility to acknowledge people's input as I appreciate any help to get me and my Pivot up.
Am now at the half believing stage that it is an all rounder.
But Core's rock right legend.

Richoa
NSW, 417 posts
15 Mar 2018 8:57AM
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I guess we don't know your idea of not boosting, you might be getting 10m and expecting 12m, from my perspective Id say hey 10m pretty good and would buy a Pivot as allrounder on that info.
But if your guy pulling 12m on yr XR and only getting 3-4m on Pivot then there is something clearly a miss with either you or the kite, maybe both. Therefore need to break down what yr doing to try and identify the problem. Which Im sure plenty on here would love to have a crack at solving:)
Then we have, maybe, only getting 3-5m on XR which is built for big boost and then struggling to get 2m with Pivot, if so we could possibly conclude yr not doing it quite right and the variance is down to the Pivot being technically harder and what ever is holding you back on the XR is magnified on the Pivot (given you are very experienced guessing this not the case)

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
15 Mar 2018 12:48PM
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Ok Richoa I'll give you some idea on the numbers (bit like pulling ur pants down in public) (lucky I'm big)
I've never measured how high I boost but I'm sure I'm more of a 10m man than a 4m kook on average when I'm comfortably lit on my XR 9m with most landings smooth, not all.
Having landed 10m jumps with a smooth touchdown I feel my technique is sound (pop then send)
Consistancy isn't always there but some things are beyond what you can control, like getting f*k#d over on takeoff by some chop or fatigue or testosterone overload :)
On the 8m Pivot when there is enough wind for at least a small jump of say 7-8m, I feel like I am 3m kook with the kite in front of me rather than above me.
I think you could be on the money with the Pivot being a more technical kite requiring a skilled operator to boost well and perhaps a slightly different technique required to the XR, like a lot more speed etc.

wishy
WA, 1286 posts
15 Mar 2018 10:30PM
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Richoa
NSW, 417 posts
16 Mar 2018 7:05AM
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wishy said..




Nice shot, looks like you launched of a ramp whereas I think the op is talking about off flat water.

off topic, so how high would that jump be considered, looks huge?

lucy5
QLD, 49 posts
16 Mar 2018 9:56AM
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pepeman said..
Ok Richoa I'll give you some idea on the numbers (bit like pulling ur pants down in public) (lucky I'm big)
I've never measured how high I boost but I'm sure I'm more of a 10m man than a 4m kook on average when I'm comfortably lit on my XR 9m with most landings smooth, not all.
Having landed 10m jumps with a smooth touchdown I feel my technique is sound (pop then send)
Consistancy isn't always there but some things are beyond what you can control, like getting f*k#d over on takeoff by some chop or fatigue or testosterone overload :)
On the 8m Pivot when there is enough wind for at least a small jump of say 7-8m, I feel like I am 3m kook with the kite in front of me rather than above me.
I think you could be on the money with the Pivot being a more technical kite requiring a skilled operator to boost well and perhaps a slightly different technique required to the XR, like a lot more speed etc.


Maybe see your local kite school they might have an instructor who can give you lessons to help you boost better

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
16 Mar 2018 2:07PM
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Nice pic wishy !
Got the Pivot dialled obviously.

StKKiter
VIC, 59 posts
16 Mar 2018 3:00PM
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Isn't that a Park you are on Wishy?

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
16 Mar 2018 4:05PM
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Wtf I thought those wing tips were a bit square.
So you got the Park dialled wishy ?

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
16 Mar 2018 6:06PM
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Just going back through the previous threads on the Pivot which I was completely ignorant too
And discovered that Naish kites use a low split front line bar.
I have been using my Core high split front line bar. Oops.
Maybe it makes a big difference.

SaveTheWhales
WA, 1565 posts
16 Mar 2018 6:24PM
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Yes you'd lose out a bit in the jump / power side as the low v allows the kite to open up and flare more..
What you'd gain is turn speed on the high Y but lose some windrange. Some kites actually fly better with a more stable leading edge..

Normally a low Y kite will still fly well on high Y but not the other way round.

Fine tuning gear can be done lots of different ways

wishy
WA, 1286 posts
16 Mar 2018 9:16PM
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Not sure if it's a pivot or a park, but to be honest you could have boosted 50foot that day on a wave kite.

I just took the photo after I packed up. Don't know the guy.

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
17 Mar 2018 7:03AM
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Select to expand quote
SaveTheWhales said..
Yes you'd lose out a bit in the jump / power side as the low v allows the kite to open up and flare more..
What you'd gain is turn speed on the high Y but lose some windrange. Some kites actually fly better with a more stable leading edge..

Normally a low Y kite will still fly well on high Y but not the other way round.

Fine tuning gear can be done lots of different ways



Yeah that sounds consistent with what I'm getting out of the kite at the moment.
Which was lacking on power overall.
I thought it felt like a 7m and I haven't been in enough wind for a 7m to boost.
Time to go Bar/line shopping.

WWS
SA, 114 posts
18 Mar 2018 7:03AM
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And Pepe, now that you have a new bar (courtesy of me!!!) and 25 to 30knt winds, you can send that pivot high and get back to us with a review after today!!! I might see you at the beach

pepeman
SA, 110 posts
18 Mar 2018 10:13AM
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No probs Matt although I'm feeling like a bit of a numpty kook at the moment



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"Naish Pivot 8m 2018" started by pepeman