so you're saying that we can kiteboard as close to an airport as we want? The 4000m airport rule doesn't apply to kiteboards?

Wow, this should be a constructive and entertaining thread...[}:)] to bad most of the SA kite crew are up in Barmera till Monday... anyway
I am not going to argue the semantics of harbour regulations versus council by-law, however if you are interested in ALL the facts i would suggest you research the Civil Aviation Authority restriction regarding the use of kites in the vicinity of the airport.
Largs Bay also requires a SAKSA member’s tag (there is even signage put up by council). Sure if you want to rig, launch, land etc below the low tide mark and argue with the council inspector about yacht insurance/act v by-law etc go for it. I would rather spend my time in the water kiting.
I am happy to support the work and time that the committee members volunteer into protecting beach access and promoting responsible kiting. Having said that I also don’t kite at Henley that often (despite living at west beach) simply because I would rather do downwinders and enjoy the variety of conditions between the Torrens and semaphore, without dealing with the crowd at Henley.

Thanks for your feedback "Not a SAKSA". We don't shy away from criticism as it indicates our message is getting out there.
You've made some interesting points and you are right in many of them.
Kites are vessels, and Public liability Insurance is available through the UK, although I only know of one person in Adelaide who uses it.

Also, the councils' authority DOES end at the low water mark. Very valid point.

I surprised with your homework that you overlooked mentioning that, for instance, you don't need to be a SAKSA member to do the "Latte" run. You can launch north of the Henley jetty and cruise down to Chicken Shop and drop your kite there without any issues from any authorities. In fact, we've been advocating it for everyone who does a Wednesday night downwinder.

Of course there are four major issues that you've omitted so I'm absolutely thrilled to take the opportunity to clarify them.

1. The permit system. The permits are enforced by the councils who control the beaches. If you want to ride at Largs for instance, how do you propose to get on the water without going over the beach? SAKSA works with the councils to keep that beach access.

2. Adelaide Airport. Unfortunately, there is a CASA law that you are not allowed to fly a kite within 4000m of an Aerodrome. Inconveniently, Henley Beach South is within that distance, as is all of Glenelg etc. CASA has kindly permitted all SAKSA members access to the Henley Beach South area between the Torrens Mouth and Gilmore Road. We strongly encourage anyone who wants to kite there that they become members because if CASA revoke that permission, none of us have access. Once again, SAKSA has worked pretty hard to keep access for the kiters.

3. You can't kiteboard "on any water in the state of South Australia". For starters, there are water reserves; there also happens to be banned areas in the Marine Parks from the Department of Environment. Further, unless you are a sucker for punishment, most boating channels have a 4 knot speed limit and I for one can't kite at only 4 knots.

4. Kitesurfing in general. The sport has grown astronomically over the past few years which is a great thing. We have more Retailers, more Instructors and an enormously growing kiter community full of awesome people.
In the past two years we've had more events, greater consultancy with authorities, more involvement from the wider community, and more reasons to protect the accesses that we have.
Of course the $65 that SAKSA members are charged annually is not just about P/L Insurance nor just about following the rules. It's about contributing to the good of the sport including sustaining beach access and bringing the community together.

Once again, I'm very pleased that we receive criticism. It confirms that the message is getting out there and justifies the many hours a week that our SAKSA Committee volunteer towards the benefit of the sport and all that participate in it.
I'd welcome anyone to PM me to discuss any of these matters personally or call me on 0411 454 656.
Cheers,
Will Chapman

What an oxygen thief

awesome someone has finally looked in to this.

saksa people have been a bunch of pricks, like a gang. When I was learning kiteboarding some saksa tossa interrupted my lesson and demanded I move on! ..... or what ??? were do you get the balls for that.
My instructor cooled the situation. and we got on with the lesson. the Nerve of this guy.

Im not a member and never will be. Largs bay sailing club membership is $25 and you get insurance. Called today, joining monday.

sbray said...

I do dispute the covering statement you made "bully-like mentality of SAKSA members".

Not all SAKSA members. But you only need to read this Forum regularly to see this bullying mentality first hand.

Re; CASA

In accordance with the Harbors and Navigation Act 1993
Kiteboards are classed as vessels. Therefor we have the same rights as any vessel with a 25m mast.

Kiteboarders has also been given the clear by the Airport Authority to kite in areas of debate. Because we are vessels ;Documentation available at Adventure Blue. (Jamie Lowden)

Our Group has been diligent in our research.

Once again "Not a SAKSA", thanks for your feedback.
Unfortunately, this time you are not A1 on the money with your facts and I'm sure Jamie won't be too pleased he's been dragged into this.
I've done my research too and spoke with the same person at the Airport Authorities who drew up the "map". The map gives an indication of the flight paths in and out of the airport.
Regarding this matter, he conceded that the Airport Authority's responsibility does not lie with the airspace around it, that is CASA's domain. Hence, why we needed to get the CASA permit and the permit applies not only to the beach but the water space as well.
I haven't kited at Henley for over a year now so I personally won't be missing out if Henley gets banned but if you kite there without SAKSA membership then you give the other SAKSA members two choices to protect their own interests of local access: inform you that you need to have the tag, or call CASA. Naturally, option 1 is a lot less painless.

We're not a "monopoly", we are the sporting association who were elected by our members to protect the interests of the sport and irrespective of if the airport was at Henley, Robe or Whyalla, we'd be taking the same measures to try to get permits for those people.

One last point:
SAKSA membership includes public liability insurance.

Do you think that Lloyds of London or YSA Insurance is going to pay out to the poor person injured or killed if they can show that you were kiting illegally in a CASA zone or flew your kite across a beach restricted by the Council?

Once again, this is a good exercise as it helps to clarify for those new to the sport what obligations need to be met and rules are in place which ensures a consistent message. Any queries, PM me or call.

I don’t believe anyone has any real issues with SAKSA and the good work the committee does, the guy’s problem is with the attitude or bullying of probably a minority of SAKSA members, Jordy’s posts highlights this problem.

This is what needs to be addressed not the legalities of what these guys what to do, I’m sure they will tick all the boxes, even if it’s at greater expense and effort, just to now prove a point. Given time these guys may choose to join SAKSA, but it won’t be because they were intimidated and threatened into doing so, and if or when they do they will be an asset to the committee and club.

There are probably plenty of kiter’s that are not members of SAKSA that regularly kite in all SA locations that will be put off joining by some of the threatening statements they have read in this forum topic and others, if all members could refrain from this type of behaviour on the beach and in this forum, we may just get the guy’s on the fence join, and if you just can’t, get someone with more diplomacy to do so, and in time we won’t see this topic on a public forum again.

My two cents


*Whatever happened to Adelaide Kite Fliers Association, I believe they offered the same insurance as SAKSA, this maybe an alternative to SAKSA for those that have been put off, but still help protect beach access.

p train said...


*Whatever happened to Adelaide Kite Fliers Association, I believe they offered the same insurance as SAKSA, this maybe an alternative to SAKSA for those that have been put off, but still help protect beach access.

I don't doubt that AKFA has the same insurance as SAKSA.
One of the pertinant points of this debate is in regard to flying at Henley.

I had a discussion with a couple of members of AKFA at the SA state freestyle comp at West Beach this year (one member had dual SAKSA & AKFA membership).
The discussion was that the AKFA member was not allowed to kite, on the day at West Beach because CASA had only allowed registered members of SAKSA/AKSA to be exempted for the comp in that area. (a one off exemption for the day at West Beach, prior to the exemption at Henly).

Unless AKFA have applied and won their own exemption from CASA the point still remains that, currently, their members or any other kiters other than those registered with SAKSA are not legally allowed to fly (by CASA ) in this Henley area.

This does not prevent AKFA or for that matter any group, even "Not a SAKSA's group of "lawyers, business owners, public servants and residents", from "re-inventing the wheel" for all of the preparation, meetings, time, and paperwork to apply and then be accepted for their own exemption from CASA.

I am not an AKFA member but from anecdotal discussion, I have heard that AKFA is a good group, which covers all types of Kiting activity in S.A., not just the water sports.......more power to kiting

Regards
Fossil

Greg, thanks for your post and in my opinion, yours is the voice of reason.

The overwhelming majority of SAKSA members are passive and unoffensive, and a fantastic group of people from around the state.
It's an interesting position, as I also don't see it as SAKSA's role to sensor the opinions of the kiting community, good or bad, nor can we. Seabreeze does manage posts that cross the line and continues to do a good job of it.

Once again it's a great discusssion as from your post, plus Morne's and others, it's clear that there is a need to differentiate between the message of the SAKSA Committee and other individuals. This way someone new to the sport, who doesn't know the association itself or the various individuals, can determine what the association's position is.

I'm sure the committee will move on this quickly.

I think this topic is turning into a debate about if you can or can not kite at henly if your not a saksa member.

Why should this be the only reason a kiter would consider paying the $65 joinging fee.

Can "not a SAKSA" and "mr Pinch" please reply and tell me if they attended the state wave or freestyle titles and/or Robe @ Easter. SAKSA organised these events. If SAKSA wasnt there, would have your organised them...im guessing not because its a massive effoirt for one person.
Do you not want these events to keep hapening??

i ask any person who is umming and arring about joining saksa, do you want to see events like this continue to happen and our sport grow?
Im sure if you come and participate at robe in 2009, your view about SAKSA would be very positive..

so i set you the challenge as a SAKSA member too a non SAKSA member... come to an event and see how much effort this assosiation does and how much you enjoy your weekend, and then come have a conversation with me and tell me your reasons why you shouldnt join and i shound not continue to be a member.

This is great. Ive always wanted to say something. But it took a group to stand up!
No one seems to be wrong or right with the facts. Lawyers make big bucks fighting out info in Acts and Laws all the time......

I called the Cops today and asked what they would do if non saksa members Kited within 4km of an airport. They said no Criminal laws has been breached, so nothing. But they did say they have had complaints about saksa, and said a person had come in and made a Incedent Report agains a SAKSA member for Threats of Violence.......... "go saksa"



The real meat here is the fact that SAKA act "like a gang" I have had dealing with them. non good.

And whats with casa, are you going to call the cops or "CASA armed kite sqad" to pull us off henly beach?

Yes it may be only a few "gang thugs" in saksa. But it only takes one fool.

So for the two years that SAKSA was not operating in Adelaide, did more cops come down? I will be down at Henly with no permit. CALL CASA.......

To all, after reading this forum, I am going to put my 2 bits in.
As being one of the first Kiters in Adelaide with Murf, Skyes and Winding.

You newbie’s haven’t really seen anything yet. Yes at Henley we have had the airport police and SA Cops come down and drag us off the beach.

Back then, we where lucky enough to have a small amount of permit riders allowed there. It wasn’t SAKSA that did that, it was the local rider and on of the shops. This worked until last year, when we did get talked to again from the airport police, and SAKSA then had meeting and made the new agreement.

The main reason that it was allowed to kite there at Henley and at other permit beaches, is that SAKSA would police the riders and talk to crew doing the wrong thing.

Think your self lucky you live in Adelaide; other states have massive bans on beaches and very clickly group.

Lastly I want to see a sailing insurance company pay out on a kiting 3 party clam.

Remember kiting is a EXTREME sport, very powerful and dangerous. With 2mm lines that have a 2 tone breaking strain. That’s a lot of injury to some before a line breaks.

Just one thing.

I have just run a event to promote kiting and windsurfing at Barmera to also promote the lake to help tourism. SAKSA was very supportive.

Cheers
Stewie,,