Forums > Sailing General

The Battery Thread

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Created by 2bish 1 month ago, 8 Nov 2019
2bish
TAS, 416 posts
8 Nov 2019 2:11PM
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I happened this headline today "New battery technology could slash the cost of electric vehicles". I have to admit, I had a ho hum moment, thinking yet another grand claim from the media. Seems like we get a steady stream of headlines like this, yet we haven't really seen anything too concrete.

However, I took a few moments to actually read the article and it has now piqued my interest. Seems like this one is at a stage that will see a product. And what a product - US $10 per kWh compared to US $48 per kWh for lead acid and a staggering US $300 for Li ion.
+ high energy density
+ non toxic
+ incombustible

theleadsouthaustralia.com.au/industries/technology/new-battery-technology-could-slash-the-cost-of-electric-vehicles/

If we do see a product that's anything like these claims, I'll be looking at a house battery bank upgrade for sure.

Post any other interesting battery technologies or products here if you like, it could be a good shared resource for us.

jev7337
VIC, 425 posts
8 Nov 2019 2:26PM
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Sounds very promising, as many others do such as Aluminium Ion.

Karsten
NSW, 299 posts
8 Nov 2019 5:19PM
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Also interesting is the "Firefly" battery.
Generating a lot of interest in some boating circles.
Think it's a lead-acid variant but last I looked t was not yet for sale in Aus. Nonetheless, some boats here may actually have some installed if they have been cruising the world, or owners may have imported batteries privately.
Anyone with experience or inside knowledge - please speak up.

2bish
TAS, 416 posts
8 Nov 2019 11:29PM
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Select to expand quote
Karsten said..
Also interesting is the "Firefly" battery.
Generating a lot of interest in some boating circles.
Think it's a lead-acid variant but last I looked t was not yet for sale in Aus. Nonetheless, some boats here may actually have some installed if they have been cruising the world, or owners may have imported batteries privately.
Anyone with experience or inside knowledge - please speak up.


These are pretty interesting aren't they, thanks for that tip. Yes they're lead-acid with a carbon foam inside. I couldn't find anyone selling them in Australia either, there's a facebook page that's many years out of date and dead links on there to fireflyenergy.com.au. Maybe they haven't been able to increase production enough to sell in Aus yet? sounds like the US is swallowing all the stock.

woko
NSW, 540 posts
27 Nov 2019 7:06PM
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bit of a drift from the OP, it seems my conservative approach to battery size may have been tested, and likewise the quality of giant AGM batteries. A C20 test ran for a just 2 minutes on a 2 year old battery, I've been conscious not to run the unit down to less than the given parameters, but have cycled it deeper rather than shallower. Anyway the folk at Aussie batteries are happy to honour the 5 year warranty. Now the heads up, it's a pro rata job ie 50% through the warranty period you give 50% of the price of a new unit and you get a replacement, sounds good so far, but that's on the recommended retail price not the advertised price. I'm sure you can see where this is leading. And of course the warranty period stays with the initial purchase. So if the replacement fails in a year,the say 70% pro rata of RRP in all probability will be more than the advertised price. Morale of the story is if you go down this path, have the battery tested at the 2year mark otherwise your pissing in the wind !

2bish
TAS, 416 posts
27 Nov 2019 7:45PM
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All good Woko, just the kind of thing for this thread. So can you tell me what a C20 test is pls?

2bish
TAS, 416 posts
27 Nov 2019 7:46PM
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All good Woko, exactly the kind of thing for this thread. So can you tell me what a C20 test is pls?

woko
NSW, 540 posts
27 Nov 2019 9:56PM
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The way it was explained to me is a 20% amp draw ( ie 20a from a 100 Ahr battery) should last, well you would think 5 hrs ? ( 5hrs X 20a = 100ahr) before it falls to 10.5v. As the battery ages the expected draw time decreases, the run time on the one I had tested was 2 minutes, a fair bit shorter than the half life of 2.5 hrs

southace
QLD, 4172 posts
28 Nov 2019 10:52AM
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Just pulled this beauty out of a motor boat, made a bit of a mess!

sydchris
NSW, 274 posts
28 Nov 2019 12:51PM
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Select to expand quote
southace said..

Just pulled this beauty out of a motor boat, made a bit of a mess!


What's your verdict - overcharging?

southace
QLD, 4172 posts
28 Nov 2019 1:41PM
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Second boat
this year , I have know idea. Scary as I have 8 under my V berth!

Yara
NSW, 923 posts
28 Nov 2019 4:52PM
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Select to expand quote
southace said..
Second boat
this year , I have know idea. Scary as I have 8 under my V berth!


Looks like pretty cheap construction, with thin material for the top. Maybe overcharge plus blocked vent? There is a lot of cheap stuff coming in from overseas these days which would not pass local standards, sold by pop-up dealers.
Back to the original post. Lead acid at US$48/kW hr sounds a lot cheaper than market price. Unless they are talking wholesale price for large orders.

southace
QLD, 4172 posts
28 Nov 2019 5:01PM
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Select to expand quote
Yara said..

southace said..
Second boat
this year , I have know idea. Scary as I have 8 under my V berth!



Looks like pretty cheap construction, with thin material for the top. Maybe overcharge plus blocked vent? There is a lot of cheap stuff coming in from overseas these days which would not pass local standards, sold by pop-up dealers.
Back to the original post. Lead acid at US$48/kW hr sounds a lot cheaper than market price. Unless they are talking wholesale price for large orders.


We got 60cents per kilogram x 40 kgrams =$25

tired
51 posts
28 Nov 2019 4:57PM
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Dreadfully off topic...mostly
I hang my head in shame,

But did anyone else read the Wooden Boat magazine edition just prior to the current one?

Had an article about a timber barrel back ski/ runabout ( sorry 'bout that too ) in Hobart that had a electric motor and batteries,

Short version...$300k or so...
20 mins at full noise
One up,

Looked very nice on the River Derwent though,

saltiest1
NSW, 2091 posts
29 Nov 2019 5:59AM
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Select to expand quote
woko said..
bit of a drift from the OP, it seems my conservative approach to battery size may have been tested, and likewise the quality of giant AGM batteries. A C20 test ran for a just 2 minutes on a 2 year old battery, I've been conscious not to run the unit down to less than the given parameters, but have cycled it deeper rather than shallower. Anyway the folk at Aussie batteries are happy to honour the 5 year warranty. Now the heads up, it's a pro rata job ie 50% through the warranty period you give 50% of the price of a new unit and you get a replacement, sounds good so far, but that's on the recommended retail price not the advertised price. I'm sure you can see where this is leading. And of course the warranty period stays with the initial purchase. So if the replacement fails in a year,the say 70% pro rata of RRP in all probability will be more than the advertised price. Morale of the story is if you go down this path, have the battery tested at the 2year mark otherwise your pissing in the wind !


I'd be having a chat to fair trading on that one.

2bish
TAS, 416 posts
29 Nov 2019 8:49AM
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Select to expand quote
tired said..
Dreadfully off topic...mostly
I hang my head in shame,

But did anyone else read the Wooden Boat magazine edition just prior to the current one?

Had an article about a timber barrel back ski/ runabout ( sorry 'bout that too ) in Hobart that had a electric motor and batteries,

Short version...$300k or so...
20 mins at full noise
One up,

Looked very nice on the River Derwent though,


I saw something like that displayed at the last Wooden Boat Festival. It may have been that one. I hadn't realised at the time that it was electric, beautifully built though.

woko
NSW, 540 posts
30 Nov 2019 7:25AM
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Select to expand quote
saltiest1 said..

woko said..
bit of a drift from the OP, it seems my conservative approach to battery size may have been tested, and likewise the quality of giant AGM batteries. A C20 test ran for a just 2 minutes on a 2 year old battery, I've been conscious not to run the unit down to less than the given parameters, but have cycled it deeper rather than shallower. Anyway the folk at Aussie batteries are happy to honour the 5 year warranty. Now the heads up, it's a pro rata job ie 50% through the warranty period you give 50% of the price of a new unit and you get a replacement, sounds good so far, but that's on the recommended retail price not the advertised price. I'm sure you can see where this is leading. And of course the warranty period stays with the initial purchase. So if the replacement fails in a year,the say 70% pro rata of RRP in all probability will be more than the advertised price. Morale of the story is if you go down this path, have the battery tested at the 2year mark otherwise your pissing in the wind !



I'd be having a chat to fair trading on that one.


It's clever marketing for sure. Will cost $175 for the replacement, if it was say a century battery with 2yr warranty I would have to buy a new battery at full price, as the giant battery is 30 months old it sorta works for me. Swings & roundabouts.

MorningBird
NSW, 2271 posts
1 Dec 2019 5:52PM
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I need two house batteries. The space for each of them is up to 32.5cm long and18 cm wide. Height is flexible as there is a fair amount of space.
Looking on eBay it looks like 110ah up to maybe 130ah.
I bought my current house batteries on eBay and they lasted about 7-8 years but I feel eBay now is risky.
Any recommendations on where to get them and what battery brand/ah? I am not after the most expensive option. The boat isn't a liveaboard and isn't heavily used nowadays.

AzureF305
NSW, 124 posts
1 Dec 2019 6:08PM
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You could try these guys

www.korrlighting.com.au/

A 'real' business providing proper service.

I got my AGM house batteries from them.
Better quality, better prices and delivered free to your door. Bargain.

Charriot
QLD, 792 posts
1 Dec 2019 6:52PM
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I have 4 of those on the yacht, now , one more for camper.
I use solar charger only, for all of them , just perfect.

N1094519, from assiebatteries.com.au
delivered to the door.



Bundeenabuoy
NSW, 693 posts
2 Dec 2019 6:06AM
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I have two house batteries on the Swanson 28, I bought in August.
They work perfectly and are dated 2005.
My Marine Electrician had never seen any older than 2009.
Apart from everything else, I have now started to run a BandG Chartplotter off them.
Lets see how they go.

Ramona
NSW, 5302 posts
2 Dec 2019 8:01AM
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I like the old style century deep cycle batteries that have caps to top up the electrolyte. I top them up regularly too. Next battery I might look at the industrial range.
www.batteriesdirect.com.au/shop/product/27045/c1275.html

kiterboy
1476 posts
2 Dec 2019 5:19PM
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Select to expand quote
Charriot said..
I have 4 of those on the yacht, now , one more for camper.
I use solar charger only, for all of them , just perfect.

N1094519, from assiebatteries.com.au
delivered to the door.




Seeing this post makes me feel better; I just bought one of these exact batteries for some camping coming up. I also got a 250W solar panel to charge it. Always hard the first time out with something like this, to know if you've made the right purchase :)

woko
NSW, 540 posts
2 Dec 2019 9:35PM
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As previously posted test em at 2 year old, I'm basically comitted to buying the warranty battery, but next time ( unless I get outstanding service from the replacement ) I will get a century or interstate or other track proven wet battery and keep an eye on the water level.

Jolene
1084 posts
2 Dec 2019 7:03PM
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I run a couple of 100ah Bosch AGMs. 2014 installed and still going strong. Wind gen provides most of the power needs for us so the batteries rarely drop below 85 %. I would never go back to using batteries that are unsealed and require maintenance .

MorningBird
NSW, 2271 posts
Tuesday , 3 Dec 2019 2:44PM
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Select to expand quote
Charriot said..
I have 4 of those on the yacht, now , one more for camper.
I use solar charger only, for all of them , just perfect.

N1094519, from assiebatteries.com.au
delivered to the door.




I looked them up and they look the goods.
Do they come with normal round (SAE) screw in terminals?

UncleBob
NSW, 486 posts
Tuesday , 3 Dec 2019 4:24PM
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Hi, I have had good service and advice from Online Batteries Sydney, located at Picnic Point. PH 02 97852444. If I remember correctly the guys name is Matt. They do pick up or delivery.



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"The Battery Thread" started by 2bish