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15kt Sail

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Created by PeterLa A week ago, 27 Nov 2019
PeterLa
VIC, 1 posts
27 Nov 2019 9:21AM
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I have a Servene Fox 105L and a 7.2m sail but I really want to go in 12 to 15kts. Went out the other day and there just wasn't enough.

Should I go to 8 or 9m? Don't want to end up with 4 sails

Any ideas

Thanks

Peter

Tardy
3189 posts
27 Nov 2019 6:46AM
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Depends what your board will take . My 105 rocket , 7.0 is the biggest it will carry , but a 8,5 on a 116-120 plus litre board will get you there,

tbwonder
NSW, 233 posts
27 Nov 2019 11:28AM
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For a board that is 65cm wide even a sail around 7.6-7.8 is going to feel big and heavy. I wouldn't recommend anything bigger.
I would look at a larger board. Or get into foiling.

duzzi
123 posts
27 Nov 2019 10:38AM
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Select to expand quote
PeterLa said..
I have a Servene Fox 105L and a 7.2m sail but I really want to go in 12 to 15kts. Went out the other day and there just wasn't enough.

Should I go to 8 or 9m? Don't want to end up with 4 sails

Any ideas

Thanks

Peter


You are not going to be able to use a 9.0 on a Fox 105 ... it is only 65 wide with a narrow tail (and a power box) .. a light freerace 7.5/7.8 is probably its limit, and the gap 7.2 to 8.0 is to small to see much of a light air improvement ...

Bender
WA, 2092 posts
27 Nov 2019 10:45AM
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In 12-15knts you don't need a bigger sail than a 5.8m you need a foil

snorkel692
QLD, 272 posts
27 Nov 2019 12:45PM
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I have cheerfully used 8.2s, both cam and no-cam, on my Fox 105- they have been fine and fun. In 13-15 knots I tend to use an overdrive 7.8 which matches the board well. I don't think I'd use a 9 with it, , low 8s are a reasonable maximum but 7.8 seems to be a great choice. Hope that helps!

AUS 814
NSW, 339 posts
27 Nov 2019 4:02PM
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Just get an LT

sailquik
VIC, 4772 posts
27 Nov 2019 9:36PM
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Find a fuller, lighter, less twisted sail that has more shape higher up. - More like a raceboard sail.
It will most likely/almost certainly have a narrower range on the top end. But if you only have 13-16 knots, that won't matter as much.
As much as the development of modern Freeride/Slalom/Race sails has progressed, and they HAVE progressed a LOT, it has been at the expense of needing to carry a much larger sail area, and the extra weight that comes with it.

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.

Jonski
WA, 63 posts
27 Nov 2019 7:32PM
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Yep a foil
is the answer

Swindy
WA, 315 posts
27 Nov 2019 8:03PM
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Select to expand quote
AUS 814 said..
Just get an LT


The answer to Life the universe and everything is no longer 42

duzzi
123 posts
28 Nov 2019 1:29AM
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Select to expand quote
PeterLa said..
I have a Servene Fox 105L and a 7.2m sail but I really want to go in 12 to 15kts. Went out the other day and there just wasn't enough.

Should I go to 8 or 9m? Don't want to end up with 4 sails

Any ideas

Thanks

Peter

An additional piece of info. I am 158 pounds and my light air board is a venerable Isonic 111. It is at least a half size, if not a full size, bigger than the Fox 105. Only 68 wide but with a fairly huge tail of 49.5 cm one foot off. It was rated to 9.0 by Starboard.

I used it with a 8.0 and it was fine, but at my weight the sail was too big for the varying conditions of the Bay Area. I settled to a 7.3 Switchblade and I never saw any difference in light air performance compared to the 8.0.

In the same conditions I am out with a ACX 5.4 and Moses Freeride foil. Your 7.2 should get you well below 12 knots with a foil. It is an expensive alternative, but to gain low end with a windsurf you would need a different board AND a bigger sail ... cost would be similar if not more ...

LeeD
926 posts
28 Nov 2019 1:45AM
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Listen to Sailquick

Orange Whip
QLD, 661 posts
28 Nov 2019 5:42AM
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sailquik said..

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.


Were you referring to this one perhaps?


Grantmac
80 posts
28 Nov 2019 3:53AM
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You could get a foil on that board if you are a lightweight.

LeeD
926 posts
28 Nov 2019 5:55AM
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Not sure a lightweight benefits more than 2 mph wind speeds over foiling.
For sure, heavyweights reap huge advantages with foiling, as much as 6 mph breezes.

duzzi
123 posts
28 Nov 2019 5:59AM
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Orange Whip said..



sailquik said..

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.





Were you referring to this one perhaps?






I bet that you cannot find a sail that has as much low end as a Switchblade. It is a "tuned down" racing sail, that works well under powered, like many other 2-3 cam freerace (e.g., probably, the one in the photo). But there is no free lunch, push too much the low end and you will loose range and control in the upper end. That's why nobody really builds "light air" specific sails.

And even if there was one, surface is surface. You would need a squared meter, to squared meter and half more to make a difference.

Gestalt
QLD, 12236 posts
28 Nov 2019 8:15AM
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how much do you weigh.
what sail is your 7.2 and is it in the right mast

Faff
VIC, 704 posts
28 Nov 2019 11:01AM
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Orange Whip said..

sailquik said..

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.



Were you referring to this one perhaps?




Maybe NP Tempo? That was a great sail.

jimbob SA
SA, 936 posts
28 Nov 2019 12:49PM
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sailquik said..
Find a fuller, lighter, less twisted sail that has more shape higher up. - More like a raceboard sail.
It will most likely/almost certainly have a narrower range on the top end. But if you only have 13-16 knots, that won't matter as much.
As much as the development of modern Freeride/Slalom/Race sails has progressed, and they HAVE progressed a LOT, it has been at the expense of needing to carry a much larger sail area, and the extra weight that comes with it.

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.


My Ezzy Lion is like this..use a 6.5 as my biggest sail. Great low range settings Planes up really early but yeah top end is limited not control wise just speed hits a wall. That said I do have a Naish foil setup for lighter days.

westozwind
WA, 1290 posts
28 Nov 2019 11:12AM
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10-12 knots with a 5.3. Naish Hover crossover 140 and 1650 foil


Al Planet
TAS, 1445 posts
28 Nov 2019 2:13PM
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My first thought would be to try a larger fin. I have run a 38 on the 105 and that helped with a camless 7.5 rigged but maybe a 42 would be ok. In the end the narrow tail might be limiting though I think the Fox responds really well to good pumping technique.

sailquik
VIC, 4772 posts
Thursday , 28 Nov 2019 9:01PM
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Faff said..


Orange Whip said..



sailquik said..

I seem to remember that at least one of the windsurfing sailmakers specifically designed and marketed such a sail for this very purpose a few years ago, but I can't remember who it was.





Were you referring to this one perhaps?






Maybe NP Tempo? That was a great sail.



Helium was one I was thinking of.

NordRoi
285 posts
Thursday , 28 Nov 2019 10:21PM
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PeterLa said..
I have a Servene Fox 105L and a 7.2m sail but I really want to go in 12 to 15kts. Went out the other day and there just wasn't enough.

Should I go to 8 or 9m? Don't want to end up with 4 sails

Any ideas

Thanks

Peter




I don't know what is your size, but a 7.2 vs a 8.0...it's a big difference in handling and fun factor. 12-15kts I get going with a 7.8 but not my 7.0 with an Isonic 72cm Wide. For my 70kg, a 7.8 4 camber sails is my max of tolerance and fun factor. Camless are way more fun to handle.

So yes a bigger sail and a bigger fin, but there is a balance with width and volume that you need to figure it out. A 8 - 9m on a 80ish wide will get you goin pretty quick and probably in 10 - 12 kts? But I doubt a 65cm board would carry efficiently a 9.0m. I skeptical you would gain 2 kts from a 7.0 to a 8.0m if your board is 65cm, sometime it just add weight and you can't pump efficiently and it transfer to not much of a gain. The best would be a test and see if your investment will give you your goal, it might!

A sail you can pump and light without camber would be your friend on a 65cm if you want to go bigger in my own opinion.

So check how much new part you need(mast, boom and sail), put that in a spreadsheet, had different opions, like foil...and compute! ;-)

MagicRide
226 posts
Friday , 29 Nov 2019 4:44AM
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Just got mine. Ready to go! Finally, I can get out in light winds!





Basher
137 posts
Friday , 29 Nov 2019 9:33AM
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Interesting question.
The old school answer is to go for a bigger rig and see what happens. If you can't plane on a 7.2m on a 105 litre board then my advice would be to look at a 7.8 rig. That's usually about the biggest you can set happily on a 460 mast.

Once you get into 8m rigs or bigger this often means buying another mast, and maybe a longer boom. The weight of the rig then often outweighs the benefits of extra sail size.

The 105 Fox should happily take up to a 7.8 (according to the Severne site) but for bigger sails you'd want a bigger board.

Lightwind sailing is about several things.:
1) Is it really windy enough to plane, or are you kidding yourself about the wind strength and should be doing other things?
2) You don't mention body weight and lightweight sailors usually plane in lighter winds than the heavier guys.
3) The best light wind planers tend to be slalom boards, with width being important when carrying larger floppy-leech rigs.
4) If you like turning more than blasting, then the best light wind early planers are freestyle boards, and it's amazing what you can do with a 64cms-wide freestyle board rigged with just a 5,2 rig, set with a tight leech.
5) Some of us find that big sails aren't much fun. Big sails on boards that are a bit small are even less fun.
6) Foiling is often the new answer to lighter winds, and even a relatively small sail will work with a foil - maybe where you pump the foil and not the sail. But of course that's a different sport.
7) Another light wind watersport is to stick a modest sail on your SUP board and glide around on that.
8) If you regularly get these marginal / 15knot days then it's worth working out which sort of kit best suits you for those conditions.



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"15kt Sail" started by PeterLa